Venting Identity politics, divide and conquer, class, occupy Wall Street and oligarchy

[missedmybus]

Somebody in another thread posted a bunch of racist stuff about white people. I was typing out this post on response and got fired up. But thread was closed already. I still think the experiences, context and my conclusion are important to get across to as many people as possible.

Especially as I've noticed a lot of younger people (<25) are completely in this type of ideology. Don't know anything else. Think it's all true.

The effects of this toxic propaganda campaign is robably also the reason why some of us are here

On Identity politics, divide and conquer, class, occupy Wall Street and oligarchy.

Race is inherently a hierarchical concept and Whiteness.

I fundamentally disagree with these concepts.

I can tell you that for me, outside in a confused, lonely and vulnerable period, when the only people who seemed to accept me were skinheads (hate groups usually prey on people like that).

Outside of those 2 years I have never had a feeling of superiority or even really thought about what race is. The only two thoughts and memories of this are the horrors of world war 2 and looking back in disgust at my "friends" when I was 13 years old.

Throughout my life, the only people that actually seemed to have serious thought about race, were the people lowest on the factual hierarchy. Unemployed, mental issues, drug people and the very poor.

This, however, has not been exclusive to "White" (really? with the capital W?) people.

Let me explain with some anecdotes and some things I think from my research into of some of the above.
I have worked and met a lot of minorities in my life. I have trained some of them, from people who had nothing going for them, from doing menial labour to somewhat technical jobs.

At the beginning, when they were unemployed, didn't have any money or see a way to escape this situation, they would consistently ask me about race.

After six months, when they got hired permanently, got to learn something more technical than just standing at a conveyor belt breaking their backs. When they had perspective, all this talk about race stopped.

Do you think racism was the cause of these thoughts they had before? Or could it be that corporations were allowed to keep people waiting for six months to get a permanent job?

I tell you this not to brag or show "oh whitey trained a black guy, just like the good old days", just to to show you my perspective, and also to give some context why I do I think this way.

SInce about 2005 there has been a consistent messaging from Anglo countries (US and then UK) in media, humanities and by politicians (of both political parties.)

That white is king boss man who did everything wrong in history, and everybody else is oppressed and who is to blame. Whitey!!

Or that coloured and trans people want to rob and rape you. That some trans person will "convert" their children.

Who do you think owns this media, funds these universities, owns these politicians?
All this bullshit bullshit ideas and concepts and othering of people is only a way to keep poor people divided. They gain more money, more people get into bad situations and thus need somebody or something to blame. So they blame each other.

This is classic divide and conquer.

Since about 10 years ago, however, I have heard white people starting to think about race. In a serious way.

I didn't really understand why, until the first time Trump got elected, and the fact that this buffoon got into power.

I saw blatant and open xenophobia, coming from the leader of one of the world's superpowers.

I needed to know why.

I spoke with white people, asked around.

Some white people said "Maybe we need a guy like that."

or

"Everybody of a different colour seems to hate us, and if we allow them, we will go the way the native Americans did."

I spoke to people of colour. Asked around more.
This was more complex, as most of them have understandable historical grievances.

But the ones that went beyond these historical grievances, became more hostile as I challenged their ideas.

Talked to me as if I personally am some colonialist from centuries ago.

Mind you, these are people I've known for over a decade. None of this stuff ever came up in this way.

I enjoy talking about history and I am very interested in how historic events effect the present. So it's not like we hadn't spoken about race, colonialism or power dynamics.

Sometimes with completely opposing viewpoints, sometimes with passion. But always cordial and never personal.

I ask them where they got these ideas, how they got to so enthusiastic about these ideas. ALL OF THEM mentioned American media.

Why do you think Trump got elected? Why not another Obama, or a person of colour?

Is it because white people are inherently racist? Or did something else change in the last 20 years?

I can pinpoint to you exactly when these divisive identity politics started becoming mainstream.

Occupy Wall Street. The one time in my life the owner classes got scared.

Who do you think owns most American media outlets? It's not regular old me or you.

Would recommend you to do your own research, stop believing everything you are spoonfed and gain some critical thinking skills.

Maybe stop thinking about race so much, and start thinking about the billionaire class that is actively destroying the US right now.

What they might do to other countries as well

Do you think these billionaires give a shit about people of colour? If that is even the correct term anymore. It's changed multiple times in the last few years.

They might give a shit about white people though, as one of the most visible of these oligarchs grew up in apartheid South Africa.

The one actively destroying the things that protect vulnerable people.

Are you ready to live under a white christian nationalist authoritarian oligarchy?

Because you already are living under one, they are just rolling it out slowly.

This might come across as a threat. But wake up and see what's going on in reality.

Project 2025 - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Something you can point at, show people how detrimental and dangerous this situation really is.

I would suggest you speak to as many people as possible about what a threat to the world this is.

Every type of person.

 

[EvisceratedJester]

You fundamentally disagreeing with the fact that race and whiteness are hierarchical because some skinheads were nice to you and because you feel like you've, personally, never felt superior as a result of race is nothing short of idiotic, tbh.

The concept of race literally came about as a means of creating a divide between poor Europeans and enslaved Africans by placing those of European descent on top in order to create a divide between the two groups. It also was historically a way for European colonizers to other the people whose land they were colonizing. Race and whiteness are inherently hierarchical concepts. This is not a new sentiment either. People have been saying this for a very long time. Nothing that you said in any way disproves this. The concept of race was used to better justify slavery and would end up becoming a concept that would be ingrained in Western society, not being used to justify the mistreatment and discrimination of POC.

Race is something that should not be downplayed and the fact that you never considered the idea that maybe part of why you have trouble with recognizing racism might just be because your whiteness protects you from it, thus the particular experiences that POC generally go through that have allowed for them to better recognize racism when they see it, even in its more subtle forms, aren't going to be something that you necessarily register as easily? Along with that, it feels like you are straight-up ignoring the fact that we have a shit ton of research that does confirm many of the issues with racism that people of colour talk about today. Maybe those POC you were training stopped talking about racism with you because it's clear that you don't give a shit about their experiences and are quick to brush them off?

Also, we can do two things at the same time. Issues in regard to class tend to heavily intersect with issues regarding race, so both are actually in need of being tackled. One should not be ignored in favour of the other, otherwise, any attempt to dismantle these issues will end up falling flat. Funnily enough, issues regarding classism are something that historically have been brought up by many black American activists and are still commonly talked about by many black activists today.

Race is a social construct that has become interwoven in the structure of many Western civilizations, thus discussions on it are needed. Funnily enough, it is actually people like you who create more divide. When you go ahead and brush off the issues that POC in your country are going through, only talking about uniting with them when it's convenient for you is what leads to many POC not wanting to bother themselves with you. Why would anyone want to work with someone who, rather than examining their own privileges and looking towards wanting to create meaningful change for everyone, instead decides to invalidate the struggles of others under the false pretenses of "unity"? Especially when there is a history of people doing shit like this and benefiting from it while little ends up changing for many POC communities, especially in the case of the African American community.

Do you want people to unite? Do you want people to start using their critical thinking skills and to try educating themselves? Then you need to educate yourself rather than just ignoring shit and expecting others to do the same. I'm getting sick and tired of hearing people like you with this sort of "kumbaya" type rhetoric running around and expecting people like me to just ignore all of the systematic issues that impact my community purely for your benefit. People are only going to start uniting when people like you actually start to take the issues of other marginalized communities seriously instead of running around with your empty platitudes and shit. Those "mainstream identity politics" that have been causing this divide have existed since prior to when either you or I were born. None of this is recent. This divide has been around for quite some time.

You people only want "unity" purely for your own benefit. You don't care about anyone but yourself and it shows. This pattern isn't a new one. This shit has been seen over and over again. The minute you get what you, and everyone else like you, want you people will gladly go throw everyone under the bus. Hell, look at the number of racist dumbasses who vote for Trump and who were saying racist shit about black people only to then start whining about how "we all need to unite against this" and "where are all the black women? We need to unite together more than ever" the minute shit hit the fan and they realized that they weren't safe from his horrible rampage.

Honestly, this crap is getting tiring. I especially feel sorry for African Americans. They seem to have to deal a lot with this sort of crap and must be so exhausting.

Anyway, I'm going to get my sleep-deprived ass back to studying for my exam.