I knew N was not for certain painless. But everyone keeps saying it was.

[Tyra]

https://www.thestate.com/news/local/crime/article301877649.html

This guy was on death row, he had fluid in his lungs found in the autopsy.

"presence of froth suggests that Bowman's heart was still beating and he was still breathing and possibly even conscious following the injection of the pentobarbital"

"his last sensation may have been that as drowning as a burning feeling spread through his veins."

"That again is "yet another example" of pulmonary edema caused by pentobarbital, said Dr. Joel Zivot, a professor of anesthesiology and surgery at Emory University."

From another source "Autopsies of executed inmates show internal organ damage unseen by witnesses. It would be false to claim that pentobarbital kills by inducing sleep and the body remains pristine."

Lethal Injection: 'Burning as They Die'

How death penalty drugs go unregulated

www.medpagetoday.com

 

[0x64]

I thought they used a mix of drugs tbh

 

[hdead]

It took him two minutes to stop breathing fully, and I really don't think he was conscious for it. It seems like you're really trying to prove your own bias, and I'll not try to stop you. But I'd suggest you try reading the article for what it says rather than trying to fish between the lines so much.

There's a lot of speculation you quoted. You can't sensibly draw any conclusion from that.

 

[Tyra]

It took him two minutes to stop breathing fully, and I really don't think he was conscious for it. It seems like you're really trying to prove your own bias, and I'll not try to stop you. But I'd suggest you try reading the article for what it says rather than trying to fish between the lines so much.

There's a lot of speculation you quoted. You can't sensibly draw any conclusion from that.

Bias? Im scared and trying to get informed yet everyone here automatically thinks it's pain free.

Yeah YOU don't THINK he was conscious. Yet the actual experts speculates he was.

The whole point is that I don't know for certain it's pain free. I am not going to take a gamble on suffocating to death.

 

[hdead]

Bias? Im scared and trying to get informed yet everyone here automatically thinks it's pain free.

Yeah YOU don't THINK he was conscious. Yet the actual experts speculates he was.

The whole point is that I don't know for certain it's pain free, yes that's what speculation means.

I'm sorry I pissed you off, I didn't intend to. Your title is highly suggestive and you've been posting a lot lately questioning the same thing. I think everybody has been answering you and it's becoming a little repetative.

The speculation of an expert does not make it conclusive, it is still speculative - that is ALL I am trying to say.

Thanks for pointing out the definition of speculation, much appreciated. Didn't mean to grind your gears in this way.

 

[Tyra]

I'm sorry I pissed you off, I didn't intend to. Your title is highly suggestive and you've been posting a lot lately questioning the same thing. I think everybody has been answering you and it's becoming a little repetative.

The speculation of an expert does not make it conclusive, it is still speculative - that is ALL I am trying to say.

Thanks for pointing out the definition of speculation, much appreciated. Didn't mean to grind your gears in this way.

People just pretend this information just doesn't exist tho… that's the problem.

People just brush it away.

 

[hdead]

People just pretend this information just doesn't exist tho… that's the problem.

People just brush it away.

I agree with you that people seem to be very set on N being the golden standard, but that's also because it simply is - given the alternatives.

In the article you shared the person was given 10gm. The PPeH states a dosage of 15gm - a pretty big difference. Also, the hygiene, storage and quality of the drug that the feds used in the case you shared was questioned. I think people here are reasoning from a place of a non-expired, sterile and well kept version of the drug when they say it's painless.

Anyway, in the end we don't really know. We can only read, read and read some more and make our own decisions on how to go about things. I still wish I could get my hands on N though.

 

[Tyra]

I agree with you that people seem to be very set on N being the golden standard, but that's also because it simply is - given the alternatives.

In the article you shared the person was given 10gm. The PPeH states a dosage of 15gm - a pretty big difference. Also, the hygiene, storage and quality of the drug that the feds used in the case you shared was questioned. I think people here are reasoning from a place of a non-expired, sterile and well kept version of the drug when they say it's painless.

Anyway, in the end we don't really know. We can only read, read and read some more and make our own decisions on how to go about things. I still wish I could get my hands on N though.

From the link, it was said that the company who provided the N was of very high standards for their N.

 

[Ultimatefighter]

Bias? Im scared and trying to get informed yet everyone here automatically thinks it's pain free.

Yeah YOU don't THINK he was conscious. Yet the actual experts speculates he was.

The whole point is that I don't know for certain it's pain free. I am not going to take a gamble on suffocating to death.

Thats why with for example dogs, they use first a drug that make you unconsious before they inject N

 

[Forveleth]

Cherry-picking statistics does not make them true. Any reason in particular you are pushing hard on this narrative? Especially when people can not get pentabarbitol anyway?

 

[Tyra]

Cherry-picking statistics does not make them true. Any reason in particular you are pushing hard on this narrative? Especially when people can not get pentabarbitol anyway?

Because I never heard of anyone mention it! And people just sweep it under the rug and pretend it doesn't exist.

Anytime I mention it, people just say robotic sentences and don't actually talk about it. They say stuff like "well it's the gold standard so"

 

[Forveleth]

Because I never heard of anyone mention it! And people just sweep it under the rug and pretend it doesn't exist.

Anytime I mention it, people just say robotic sentences and don't actually talk about it. They say stuff like "well it's the gold standard so"

Ok then. Pentabarbitol may not be 100% painless I'm 100% of deaths. It still is the beat known method out there, however.

If your plan is to educate, you need to come across with more information than a single case supporting your point and also not so hostile. There is sometimes misinformation here but anger or frustration or whatever you have going on does not fix that.