I have set my date

[HappyForever?]

I will CTB with SN on 2024/1/1 if I don't have a girlfriend by then.
I'm short, 5'8, and average looking. I will never be the one girls are physically attracted to.
I had one relationship, I guess she liked my personality, but it's hard to show my personality without something to attract girls first.
Casual sex is out of question, I simply cannot generate the lust with my height and looks. Watching others have casual sex and get into relationships in rapid succession is too painful to bear.
If I'm feeling particularly bad I will CTB early.

 

[DillPickles]

My friend, your desire for a girlfriend is not the answer. A big thing you want to avoid is pulling someone in, it not working out, and holding CTB over them.

 

[HappyForever?]

My friend, your desire for a girlfriend is not the answer. A big thing you want to avoid is pulling someone in, it not working out, and holding CTB over them.

I will not. I'm never going to hold CTB over someone. I'm CTBing because of unattractiveness, not because of the relationship not working out.

 

[Zegers]

Feeling uncomfortable in your skin is a hard problem.

Best wishes in whatever you do.

 

[Ligand]

I will not. I'm never going to hold CTB over someone. I'm CTBing because of unattractiveness, not because of the relationship not working out.

Do you have any other attractive qualities? Like are you smart, ambitious, social, charismatic, physically fit, or successful? You really only need a one or two of those to get laid, and if you have three or more you can get a solid girlfriend as long as you aren't incredibly short or super ugly.

This is coming from a dude btw

 

[HappyForever?]

Do you have any other attractive qualities? Like are you smart, ambitious, social, charismatic, physically fit, or successful? You really only need a one or two of those to get laid, and if you have three or more you can get a solid girlfriend as long as you aren't incredibly short or super ugly.

This is coming from a dude btw

I think I'm somewhat successful (top 2% grades in my major). I can be charismatic but only with interacting with specific people. I can be social if I really want to, but I don't see the point of being social with guys. Everyone in my college is smart so I don't see the advantage here. I do major in computer science so I can seem smart when it comes to fixing computer related problems. I'm somewhat physically fit, not too thin or overweight and reasonably athletic, but not muscular either. But all these can be worked on, unlike physical appearance. But the nail in the coffin is that I'm stuck in male-dominant environments, and will probably remain stuck for a long time.

 

[Ligand]

I think I'm somewhat successful (top 2% grades in my major). I can be charismatic but only with interacting with specific people. I can be social if I really want to, but I don't see the point of being social with guys. Everyone in my college is smart so I don't see the advantage here. I do major in computer science so I can seem smart when it comes to fixing computer related problems. I'm somewhat physically fit, not too thin or overweight and reasonably athletic, but not muscular either. But all these can be worked on, unlike physical appearance. But the nail in the coffin is that I'm stuck in male-dominant environments, and will probably remain stuck for a long time.

Get some hobbies and guy friends. "I don't see a point" - the point is so you don't want to kill yourself when you don't have a gf and so you aren't needy as fuck when you do have one.

If you are dead-set on finding women, you will need to go to places with women. You are in college, surely to god there are places in your school or around town where you can meet girls.

Your appearance/height isn't what's holding you back, it's your expectation that you can get a girlfriend while having no life and doing nothing fun. I can promise you that even hot guys that act like you do run into the same problems.

 

[Faith_No_more]

I'm really sorry you don't feel comfortable with yourself. I'm a woman and I'm not happy with the gentic lottery either. My hair is fine and limp, overweight, too many mental problems. I see you. sending good vibes.

 

[Moburin 29]

Hey buddy.
There is something I want to ask. Why such an obsession over finding a gf? I understand that it's nice to have a partner and all, but usually it's not a matter of life and death.

 

[HappyForever?]

Get some hobbies and guy friends. "I don't see a point" - the point is so you don't want to kill yourself when you don't have a gf and so you aren't needy as fuck when you do have one.

If you are dead-set on finding women, you will need to go to places with women. You are in college, surely to god there are places in your school or around town where you can meet girls.

Your appearance/height isn't what's holding you back, it's your expectation that you can get a girlfriend while having no life and doing nothing fun. I can promise you that even hot guys that act like you do run into the same problems.

Do you have any recommendations of hobbies that allow me to meet more women? My current hobbies are either solitary activities or male dominated. I joined a cat feeding group in college which seems to have many women. But more chances are always welcome.
I do have guy friends. I mean that I don't see the point to go out of the way to know more guys. I already know enough guys naturally in college. I seek a gf for the things that guy friends cannot provide, such as physical intimacy and sex.
There are many women in my college, but there are even more men. That means I have to outcompete other men. And the women seem overwhelmed with choices, some to the point of decision paralysis. Meeting people outside of college may work, but it's even harder than in college.
What you said is why I'm giving myself a grace period before I CTB. I'm giving myself a chance to improve my life, and if nothing works I will CTB.

Hey buddy.
There is something I want to ask. Why such an obsession over finding a gf? I understand that it's nice to have a partner and all, but usually it's not a matter of life and death.

To be frank I don't know. Maybe I struggle with low self esteem and seek validation in the form of a partner. Maybe there is some hidden trauma in play. Maybe I missed my best years and is clawing desperately to catch up to others. But I know for a fact that I'm much, much happier when in a relationship.

 

[lita-lassi]

someone else isn't going to fix you dude, that's a kind of shitty and selfish approach tbh and anyone you're honest to about your motivations will likely think the same and detach themselves. it wont even be because they dont like you its because that isnt a healthy dynamic at all

 

[HappyForever?]

someone else isn't going to fix you dude, that's a kind of shitty and selfish approach tbh and anyone you're honest to about your motivations will likely think the same and detach themselves. it wont even be because they dont like you its because that isnt a healthy dynamic at all

I had a relationship and she fixed me for the time by just existing, and our relationship was great while it lasted. We broke up for unrelated reasons.

 

[lita-lassi]

I had a relationship and she fixed me for the time by just existing, and our relationship was great while it lasted. We broke up for unrelated reasons.

i cant even start to pull this apart without getting banned. ill just say you dont need a gf

 

[darkenmydoorstep]

I will CTB with SN on 2024/1/1 if I don't have a girlfriend by then.
I'm short, 5'8, and average looking. I will never be the one girls are physically attracted to.
I had one relationship, I guess she liked my personality, but it's hard to show my personality without something to attract girls first.
Casual sex is out of question, I simply cannot generate the lust with my height and looks. Watching others have casual sex and get into relationships in rapid succession is too painful to bear.
If I'm feeling particularly bad I will CTB early.

If casual sex is what you are looking for, there will be plenty of apps where you can find that. I'm not saying it's the answer btw, just stating fact.

 

[Ligand]

Do you have any recommendations of hobbies that allow me to meet more women? My current hobbies are either solitary activities or male dominated. I joined a cat feeding group in college which seems to have many women. But more chances are always welcome.
I do have guy friends. I mean that I don't see the point to go out of the way to know more guys. I already know enough guys naturally in college. I seek a gf for the things that guy friends cannot provide, such as physical intimacy and sex.
There are many women in my college, but there are even more men. That means I have to outcompete other men. And the women seem overwhelmed with choices, some to the point of decision paralysis. Meeting people outside of college may work, but it's even harder than in college.
What you said is why I'm giving myself a grace period before I CTB. I'm giving myself a chance to improve my life, and if nothing works I will CTB.


To be frank I don't know. Maybe I struggle with low self esteem and seek validation in the form of a partner. Maybe there is some hidden trauma in play. Maybe I missed my best years and is clawing desperately to catch up to others. But I know for a fact that I'm much, much happier when in a relationship.

I wasn't really recommending hobbies to meet women, I was recommending hobbies to have solid guy friends and something to look forward to other than women.

Realistically in college the only way you're going to meet women is either through classes, at parties, randomly on campus, or somewhere else social like a bar. Since you're a computer science major I would strike out classes, your best bet would probably be trying to either go to parties or host parties if possible. If that's not an option, you should try to get into going to bars. It kind of sucks but it's a way better choice to meet women than most other options.

What do you have to lose by flirting with girls at a bar anyway? Worst that could happen is some light embarrassment before you check out forever.

Also the fact that you're seeking validation is a very very bad sign. Everyone seek some validation in a partner but if that's one of the main things you're looking for - you're fucked. That's why having a life that's already awesome it's so important for finding a partner. If you're a dude, a partner should complement your already awesome life - not be the main event. This is why it's so important to be successful and have hobbies and be a generally busy person. The girl at the end is merely a nice addition to your already great life. If your life is already awesome, you probably won't really care how it goes anyway. You'll know there are plenty of other women waiting to find someone like you. Make yourself someone that a woman would actually want to be with.

 

[lita-lassi]

Also the fact that you're seeking validation is a very very bad sign.

Make yourself someone that a woman would actually want to be with.

this

 

[Moburin 29]

The girl at the end is merely a nice addition to your already great life.

O hey, that kinda reminds me of a really nice quote: "Your soulmate is your compliment, and not your missing piece"

 

[Aim]

I will CTB with SN on 2024/1/1 if I don't have a girlfriend by then.
I'm short, 5'8, and average looking. I will never be the one girls are physically attracted to.
I had one relationship, I guess she liked my personality, but it's hard to show my personality without something to attract girls first.
Casual sex is out of question, I simply cannot generate the lust with my height and looks. Watching others have casual sex and get into relationships in rapid succession is too painful to bear.
If I'm feeling particularly bad I will CTB early.

Hey, are you sure you want to do this?! I understand how painful it must be for you. But remember that beauty comes from the inside, and beauty fades. Looks fades! There is someone out there for everyone. When you have a good heart. That will shine trough, and everyone loves that

 

[VioletNight]

Adding a girlfriend to a life you already feel unfulfilled in will not fix the problem. It's better to chase the life you want to have and find your partner along the way, it also increases the likelihood that you two will share passions and interests which will make the relationship more fulfilling.

Your looks don't define you and anyone that would judge you based on things you can't control was never worth having around anyways.

 

[HappyForever?]

If casual sex is what you are looking for, there will be plenty of apps where you can find that. I'm not saying it's the answer btw, just stating fact.

Dating apps don't work for the majority of men, especially those who are at a disadvantage in physical attractiveness.

I wasn't really recommending hobbies to meet women, I was recommending hobbies to have solid guy friends and something to look forward to other than women.

Realistically in college the only way you're going to meet women is either through classes, at parties, randomly on campus, or somewhere else social like a bar. Since you're a computer science major I would strike out classes, your best bet would probably be trying to either go to parties or host parties if possible. If that's not an option, you should try to get into going to bars. It kind of sucks but it's a way better choice to meet women than most other options.

What do you have to lose by flirting with girls at a bar anyway? Worst that could happen is some light embarrassment before you check out forever.

Also the fact that you're seeking validation is a very very bad sign. Everyone seek some validation in a partner but if that's one of the main things you're looking for - you're fucked. That's why having a life that's already awesome it's so important for finding a partner. If you're a dude, a partner should complement your already awesome life - not be the main event. This is why it's so important to be successful and have hobbies and be a generally busy person. The girl at the end is merely a nice addition to your already great life. If your life is already awesome, you probably won't really care how it goes anyway. You'll know there are plenty of other women waiting to find someone like you. Make yourself someone that a woman would actually want to be with.

Having something to look forward to does not work for me for some reason. I feel only 70% happy doing anything when not in relationships. When doing things I enjoy I always catch myself wondering how good it would be to do it with someone who loves me.

I will probably give bars another shot. Last time I visited everyone is in their own little groups minding their own business. Does this mean I need to go to another bar, or approach them despite their groups?

I need to feel attractive, and attracting partners is the only way to gain this validation. Seeking validation is only part of the reason. I assume that everyone looking for a partner wants the normal benefits of having a partner, such as physical intimacy and sex. That's why I left those out of my answer, as the poster implies that me wanting to CTB over not being able to find a partner is abnormal.

I do feel that a gf, or rather the ability to find a gf at will, is my last missing piece in life. But the missing piece ruins everything else. I would even be content single if I didn't struggle so much in finding a gf.

I always hear women say "I want someone handsome" and "I want someone over 6 feet tall", especially on social media. I seldom hear women say "I want someone with an interesting life" or "I want someone with a great personality". I'm aware that my perception may be skewed by confirmation bias. Also there is a chance that women don't know what they really want, and the less shallow women probably don't use social media that much. But it hurts to look at.

Adding a girlfriend to a life you already feel unfulfilled in will not fix the problem. It's better to chase the life you want to have and find your partner along the way, it also increases the likelihood that you two will share passions and interests which will make the relationship more fulfilling.

Your looks don't define you and anyone that would judge you based on things you can't control was never worth having around anyways.

I want a life with a partner, or rather a life with the ability to find a partner at will.

I said above that I've always heard women say that they want physical attractive partners, and other features are seldom mentioned.

 

[Moburin 29]

I feel like social media screwing all of us up.
You can see this strangely high standards for guys. And for girls goes the same thing. Many women, especially young girls, feel like if they are not good looking they are not valid. That's why you can see twelve year olds wearing make up and forty year olds doing tons of plastic surgeries. Of many people are not like this, but it's pretty common problem.

As for places, you can try going to comicons or dance classes. I know it sounds pretty random, but in comicons it's really easy to get along if that your thing. And dancing classes have usually more girls than guys, plus many opportunities to talk.

Bur hear me out. You don't seem like a bad fella, but I think you are lacking a bit of perception. I think it will be good in a long run, to talk with relationship therapist or at least some mature woman to get a better grip on how things work. Because when you spend most of the time only in men circle, you see only one side of things.

All the best)

 

[Ligand]

Having something to look forward to does not work for me for some reason. I feel only 70% happy doing anything when not in relationships. When doing things I enjoy I always catch myself wondering how good it would be to do it with someone who loves me.

I will probably give bars another shot. Last time I visited everyone is in their own little groups minding their own business. Does this mean I need to go to another bar, or approach them despite their groups?

I need to feel attractive, and attracting partners is the only way to gain this validation. Seeking validation is only part of the reason. I assume that everyone looking for a partner wants the normal benefits of having a partner, such as physical intimacy and sex. That's why I left those out of my answer, as the poster implies that me wanting to CTB over not being able to find a partner is abnormal.

I do feel that a gf, or rather the ability to find a gf at will, is my last missing piece in life. But the missing piece ruins everything else. I would even be content single if I didn't struggle so much in finding a gf.

I always hear women say "I want someone handsome" and "I want someone over 6 feet tall", especially on social media. I seldom hear women say "I want someone with an interesting life" or "I want someone with a great personality". I'm aware that my perception may be skewed by confirmation bias. Also there is a chance that women don't know what they really want, and the less shallow women probably don't use social media that much. But it hurts to look at.

I want a life with a partner, or rather a life with the ability to find a partner at will.

I said above that I've always heard women say that they want physical attractive partners, and other features are seldom mentioned.

Wanting a partner is completely natural and not something to be ashamed of. Thinking that it will constitute 70% of your happiness as a young man is crazy. Most people don't want to admit this, but one of the only things a partner can give you that you can't readily get from other areas of your life - is sex. I enjoy sex as much as the next guy, but my life was pretty fucking awesome for a really long time before I got my first long-term girlfriend and was fucking regularly. It was honestly a lot better while I was single because I was still physically healthy. My life was awesome and full of great shit and that was a very attractive quality.

Something you notice is that paradoxically, the less you need other people, the easier it is to bring other people into your life. Finding a partner would make you happier but honestly, improving the life you have currently and just getting laid occasionally would lead to a much better life than whatever the fuck you think you want right now.

As far as bars and parties go, invite your friends to go with you and go out as a group so it's less intimidating. If it seems like your friends don't want to go, then try to be the guy that's social and gets them out of the house. And yes, it is actually pretty normal to just go up and talk to people in groups at bars. People go to those places as a way to meet new people. It takes a lot of practice, and it's gonna be awkward at first- but you'll get better at it (don't be afraid to drink a beer or two- it can really help.)

Yes, the majority of women want guys that are tall and attractive. They would also like these men to be immensely powerful, extremely wealthy, wickedly intelligent, and also very sensitive. The majority of men would like their women to be irresistible attractive, have incredible bodies, be extremely friendly, and go along with whatever they want. We all have a very high ideals for the type of partners we would like, but when we find someone that we connect with in real life - these standards kind of get thrown out the window. You've been in a relationship before so you know that you start to find someone's faults endearing. The Internet is very bad for your self-esteem and is honestly not very representative of how successful people can be in real life. I hate to be an anecdote guy but I've known plenty of dudes that were not very tall and not particularly good looking that got laid constantly because they were confident, fun, and just had a lot of practice being social. Life is easier for attractive people but it's also a lot easier for smart people. Utilize the fact that you're a smart person to learn how to live life like a confident, fun person.

Start lifting weights ASAP. Getting even slightly muscular will do wonders for your anxiety and will make you a lot more attractive.

 

[darkenmydoorstep]

Dating apps don't work for the majority of men, especially those who are at a disadvantage in physical attractiveness.

Having something to look forward to does not work for me for some reason. I feel only 70% happy doing anything when not in relationships. When doing things I enjoy I always catch myself wondering how good it would be to do it with someone who loves me.

I will probably give bars another shot. Last time I visited everyone is in their own little groups minding their own business. Does this mean I need to go to another bar, or approach them despite their groups?

I need to feel attractive, and attracting partners is the only way to gain this validation. Seeking validation is only part of the reason. I assume that everyone looking for a partner wants the normal benefits of having a partner, such as physical intimacy and sex. That's why I left those out of my answer, as the poster implies that me wanting to CTB over not being able to find a partner is abnormal.

I do feel that a gf, or rather the ability to find a gf at will, is my last missing piece in life. But the missing piece ruins everything else. I would even be content single if I didn't struggle so much in finding a gf.

I always hear women say "I want someone handsome" and "I want someone over 6 feet tall", especially on social media. I seldom hear women say "I want someone with an interesting life" or "I want someone with a great personality". I'm aware that my perception may be skewed by confirmation bias. Also there is a chance that women don't know what they really want, and the less shallow women probably don't use social media that much. But it hurts to look at.

I want a life with a partner, or rather a life with the ability to find a partner at will.

I said above that I've always heard women say that they want physical attractive partners, and other features are seldom mentioned.

The older I become (am 49) physical attraction starts to mean less. I mean there has to be a little but we're all headed the same way and the pursuit of looks is a superficial pursuit.

 

[SadShroomie]

I believe it depends on how old you are. Have you gone to college yet? Are you past the age of "young and dateable"? If you are just out of highschool, most people don't find "the one" until they are in their late 20s. Believe it or not, girls are into men for their personality far more than their looks. (And example would be gamer bf and big titty goth gf) you just need to respect them, treat them right even if they seemingly turned you down, in a lot of instances girls will turn you down 1 or 2 times before they realize that you may be the right one.
I believe it depends on how old you are. Have you gone to college yet? Are you past the age of "young and dateable"? If you are just out of highschool, most people don't find "the one" until they are in their late 20s. Believe it or not, girls are into men for their personality far more than their looks. (And example would be gamer bf and big titty goth gf) you just need to respect them, treat them right even if they seemingly turned you down, in a lot of instances girls will turn you down 1 or 2 times before they realize that you may be the right one.

 

[HappyForever?]

Wanting a partner is completely natural and not something to be ashamed of. Thinking that it will constitute 70% of your happiness as a young man is crazy. Most people don't want to admit this, but one of the only things a partner can give you that you can't readily get from other areas of your life - is sex. I enjoy sex as much as the next guy, but my life was pretty fucking awesome for a really long time before I got my first long-term girlfriend and was fucking regularly. It was honestly a lot better while I was single because I was still physically healthy. My life was awesome and full of great shit and that was a very attractive quality.

Something you notice is that paradoxically, the less you need other people, the easier it is to bring other people into your life. Finding a partner would make you happier but honestly, improving the life you have currently and just getting laid occasionally would lead to a much better life than whatever the fuck you think you want right now.

As far as bars and parties go, invite your friends to go with you and go out as a group so it's less intimidating. If it seems like your friends don't want to go, then try to be the guy that's social and gets them out of the house. And yes, it is actually pretty normal to just go up and talk to people in groups at bars. People go to those places as a way to meet new people. It takes a lot of practice, and it's gonna be awkward at first- but you'll get better at it (don't be afraid to drink a beer or two- it can really help.)

Yes, the majority of women want guys that are tall and attractive. They would also like these men to be immensely powerful, extremely wealthy, wickedly intelligent, and also very sensitive. The majority of men would like their women to be irresistible attractive, have incredible bodies, be extremely friendly, and go along with whatever they want. We all have a very high ideals for the type of partners we would like, but when we find someone that we connect with in real life - these standards kind of get thrown out the window. You've been in a relationship before so you know that you start to find someone's faults endearing. The Internet is very bad for your self-esteem and is honestly not very representative of how successful people can be in real life. I hate to be an anecdote guy but I've known plenty of dudes that were not very tall and not particularly good looking that got laid constantly because they were confident, fun, and just had a lot of practice being social. Life is easier for attractive people but it's also a lot easier for smart people. Utilize the fact that you're a smart person to learn how to live life like a confident, fun person.

Start lifting weights ASAP. Getting even slightly muscular will do wonders for your anxiety and will make you a lot more attractive.

Thank you for all your advice. I'm considering postponing my plans, and giving more time for self improvement. I'll look into gyms. Thankfully there are gyms available on campus so it'll be readily accessible.

I believe it depends on how old you are. Have you gone to college yet? Are you past the age of "young and dateable"? If you are just out of highschool, most people don't find "the one" until they are in their late 20s. Believe it or not, girls are into men for their personality far more than their looks. (And example would be gamer bf and big titty goth gf) you just need to respect them, treat them right even if they seemingly turned you down, in a lot of instances girls will turn you down 1 or 2 times before they realize that you may be the right one.
I believe it depends on how old you are. Have you gone to college yet? Are you past the age of "young and dateable"? If you are just out of highschool, most people don't find "the one" until they are in their late 20s. Believe it or not, girls are into men for their personality far more than their looks. (And example would be gamer bf and big titty goth gf) you just need to respect them, treat them right even if they seemingly turned you down, in a lot of instances girls will turn you down 1 or 2 times before they realize that you may be the right one.

I'm in my early 20s. You are right that I should probably give it more time before I CTB.

I feel like social media screwing all of us up.
You can see this strangely high standards for guys. And for girls goes the same thing. Many women, especially young girls, feel like if they are not good looking they are not valid. That's why you can see twelve year olds wearing make up and forty year olds doing tons of plastic surgeries. Of many people are not like this, but it's pretty common problem.

As for places, you can try going to comicons or dance classes. I know it sounds pretty random, but in comicons it's really easy to get along if that your thing. And dancing classes have usually more girls than guys, plus many opportunities to talk.

Bur hear me out. You don't seem like a bad fella, but I think you are lacking a bit of perception. I think it will be good in a long run, to talk with relationship therapist or at least some mature woman to get a better grip on how things work. Because when you spend most of the time only in men circle, you see only one side of things.

All the best)

I'm starting to realize the effect of social media on people. Social media works on clicks. This means that contents that promote reactions gain more clicks and get pushed to the top. And those content may twist reality to incite rage, which is a very effective way to gain clicks. The people creating such content only care about clicks and not the negative effect the contents have on people.

 

[tired0zymandias]

hi man, i understand your situation and it must be hard for you. But in my opinion, you don't have to set a date of your ctb because of not getting gf, that is ridiculous. Like if you ended up be in a relationship it self maybe it will break your heart more. Trust me man, like what meant to be yours will never be someone else's in a million years.

come on man, you know you better, there's must be something you can do other than finding a gf or focusing on you appearance.

 

[Zegers]

I do feel that a gf, or rather the ability to find a gf at will, is my last missing piece in life. But the missing piece ruins everything else. I would even be content single if I didn't struggle so much in finding a gf.

Everyone needs a certain degree of validation, even those stoics and those "i dont give a fuck" people. Money doesn't solve your life, but it makes it better, the same goes for relationships. Height and social status are important traits for girls, but as you have been told above, you can complement it with other things, although let's not fool ourselves, appearance is the most predominant asset and you are not that short anyway (5'8 is not that short)

 

[scofield]

Try making something else that's challenging to aim for I mean i get it that you're single and everything and I won't give you false hope either but thinking getting a girl temporarily will save you is dumb.
There is literally so much out there to do and achieve do that and quit pornography for gods sake.

 

[saddavyd]

All your other qualities will become more important than your looks over time. Looks like you have a lot going for you. Remind yourself of that.

 

[Decided98]

I will CTB with SN on 2024/1/1 if I don't have a girlfriend by then.
I'm short, 5'8, and average looking. I will never be the one girls are physically attracted to.
I had one relationship, I guess she liked my personality, but it's hard to show my personality without something to attract girls first.
Casual sex is out of question, I simply cannot generate the lust with my height and looks. Watching others have casual sex and get into relationships in rapid succession is too painful to bear.
If I'm feeling particularly bad I will CTB early.

There's guys that I know shorter than you your not that short