I just want to know if there is someone who wanted to ctb and accidentally used sodium nitrate instead of sodium nitrite and survived. If so, what symptoms did you or this person have?
Considering the similarity in action of both, the symptoms can be rather the same but only Nitrite has a deadlier outcome at far lower dosages and with how rapidly it works. I think its happened more times than not on this forum especially due to how some people are still conscious after an hour or so and especially having not vomited but in other cases, medically speaking, people have still rapidly deteriorated after taking sn more so than with Nitrate. While Nitrate can also kill, it may take higher doses to get anywhere near fatal levels while SN, as we've seen, can take serious effect at 2 grams and may already need medical intervention depending how symptoms progress. This is why immediate medical intervention is repeatedly stated as the only thing that can save anyone especially since Methlyne Blue is the most effective antidote. On top of this, in the case of severe Methemoglobinemia, even if a timely diagnosis is made, the management of such severity is still challenging regardless of whether M-Blue is available or not and this is why, in some medical cases, like this one where one individual ingested 18g, he still died even with aggressive resuscitation, it's even further complicated in the event of Out of hospital cardiac arrest, CPR or hypoxemia-reperfusion injury.
This is why SN is really deadly and those that called for help which is the major reason why this method is unsuccessful are very fortunate because they called early enough before the methb levels progressed in severity, in reality, they could've still died if they waited a minute longer, that could've made all the difference.
This is why SN is really deadly and those that called for help which is the major reason why this method is unsuccessful are very fortunate because they called early enough before the methb levels progressed in severity, in reality, they could've still died if they waited a minute longer, that could've made all the difference.
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Linda
Member
- Jul 30, 2020
- 1,685
I haevn't tried it, but I know it's not very nice, and will result in unpleasant symptoms, including anything from vomiting to convulsions. But the dose needed to kill yourself (LD50) is in the range 5 - 15 grams per kg of body weight (according to data published by NOAA). The corresponding figure for sodium nitrite is around 50 - 500 milligrams per kg (same source). So you would need at least 10 times as much sodium nitrate to die as sodium nitrite, and perhaps as much as 300 times. If we assume 10 grams per kg of body weight, and a body weight of 50 kg (which is light), we are talking about a fatal dose of around 500 grams, or a little over 1 pound. Bottom line: it's not a practical way to die.
That's a really large range, I can see why some people say ~2g and others say ~25g
If it was 500mg per kilo just for the LD50 then someone who is 100kg could take 50g, not vomit, and have a 50:50 chance or surviving?
Linda
Member
- Jul 30, 2020
- 1,685
Yes, it seemed a large range to me too. Probably nobody knows a precise number because not many people ingest the stuff in quantities large enough to be fatal, and you can't do controlled experiments on people. I haven't checked, but the range for rats and other experimental animals is probably narrower, because people can do the experiments (unethical though that seems to me). Rats don't get to vote.
Not without converting it to SN first, otherwise the dose needed would be msssive and not really practical.
Linda
Member
- Jul 30, 2020
- 1,685
Probably vomiting and stomach cramps as a minimum. So yes, probably painful. There seems to be a lot of uncertainty about what is a fatal dose, presumably because there isn't much experimental data for humans, so it might not be a good idea to conduct any experiments on yourself. If you are determined to experiment, then I would strongly suggest that you keep the dose below half a gram (=500 milligrams), which, judging from published data, should be well below a fatal dose. But this is one experiment it would be better not to carry out.
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