Discussion Grieving a parent vs long term estrangement:

[MeltingHeart]

I will preface this by saying when I use the term Vs i dont mean that one is the 'winner' as in one or the other is worse exactly, but just to discuss an experience.

My mother, that I lived with when I was growing up (my dad left when we were v,young and I have had little contact with him thoughout my life & he was totally unavailable in terms of support- emotionally & financially), well she was incredibly emotionally abusive to me, just a few examples- she would say to my face (as if I was an impatial friend or something) dont ever have children they fuck up yourlife, she regretting having me as she cant do things she wanted to do, complained to me about her body after having kids, would leave me alone all night in the house by myself when I was pretty young, shout at me constantly, and make me sit in the room to listen when she was having arguement with her partner etc etc etc. When I was 17 and after another shouting attack I walked out with a bag, in an unknown city we were staying in, so i knew no one and found a hostel to live in, now since then (that was 20 years ago) we have had no contact over the phone or in person, except two very brief meets ups- that were not good, within 5 mins she was attacking and belittling me again - so i had to walk away and made the choice not to have her in my life at all. She has never tried to make contact- which I wouldnt want anyway- as I know she hasnt and will never changed, she is 'dead' to me in other words, and in theory I could have dies years ago-and she would never have even known.

I was having a discussion recently and someone was saying that is not the same as grieving over a parent that has passed away, I would never be able to understand the pain of that, implying that it is SO much worse, and how I wouldnt know how i would feel if my mother died. I was trying to say that in many ways it is like grief actually; that to not have someone in your life at all in anyway whatsoever, for well over 20 years is actually tantamount to having had a parent that has passed. And in actual fact I know people whos parents have passed away (again I want to add I am not undemining that own kind of unique pain-that I may not know) and yet collectively they have spent more time with that person in their life, than I ever did with mine. And I know I would never ever want to see them again-because of their sustained level of cruelty. And I thought (but I did not say this to the person I was talking to) I can not even have the slight comfort or knowing I was loved or even console myself with happy memories. And yes this 'physical' person exists out there somewhere in the world- but i dont know where (nor want to-for the reasons stated) but apparently I am meant to be able to cope with this better, simply because this person that gave birth to me is alive...as if this should make things ok...and some how easier to deal with than literal 'death' based grief...well it does not...it does not work like that...

thku for reading if u did- sorry that was long...

 

[noctiva]

I have to say I'm in the same boat. I've cut ties with my mother, but only 5 years ago. She was very emotionally abusive, and I can totally find her in your comments, she always told me to never have children, children are ungrateful, they ruin your figure and your finances, she regretted having me, a girl, because girls are useless. Additionally she'd scream at my dad at night or lock herself in the bathroom, crying loudly, lamenting how everybody mistreated her.
My mother is, in all intends and purposes, dead to me. But yes, she is still alive and out there, somewhere. I know for myself, when my mother dies, I will not mourn her. I mourned her loss, or rather the lack of the mother, the lack of motherly love and guidance which I never had, for years in therapy.
I do not know how the death of a loving and kind parent compares in this situation, I'm sorry I cannot answer that. But the idea that all mothers are loving and kind, compassionate and caring, self-sacrificing saintS who need to be appreciated and worshipped... I cannot subscribe to that. And I think, that's the implication of the person you had your chat with from what I got, that even though you aren't in contact, you still get 'comfort' from knowing that she is out there and that you will, when her time comes, realize what you had in her and mourn. Or at least that's what I always get, the implication that I cannot relate, because my mother is still alive and I will realize that I've wasted the time to make up with her when her death hits me. But as you say: Happy childhood memories of my mother that I could mourn, they don't exist, so they cannot kick in, when she actually kicks the bucket (pardon my language).

 

[MeltingHeart]

I have to say I'm in the same boat. I've cut ties with my mother, but only 5 years ago. She was very emotionally abusive, and I can totally find her in your comments, she always told me to never have children, children are ungrateful, they ruin your figure and your finances, she regretted having me, a girl, because girls are useless. Additionally she'd scream at my dad at night or lock herself in the bathroom, crying loudly, lamenting how everybody mistreated her.
My mother is, in all intends and purposes, dead to me. But yes, she is still alive and out there, somewhere. I know for myself, when my mother dies, I will not mourn her. I mourned her loss, or rather the lack of the mother, the lack of motherly love and guidance which I never had, for years in therapy.
I do not know how the death of a loving and kind parent compares in this situation, I'm sorry I cannot answer that. But the idea that all mothers are loving and kind, compassionate and caring, self-sacrificing saintS who need to be appreciated and worshipped... I cannot subscribe to that. And I think, that's the implication of the person you had your chat with from what I got, that even though you aren't in contact, you still get 'comfort' from knowing that she is out there and that you will, when her time comes, realize what you had in her and mourn. Or at least that's what I always get, the implication that I cannot relate, because my mother is still alive and I will realize that I've wasted the time to make up with her when her death hits me. But as you say: Happy childhood memories of my mother that I could mourn, they don't exist, so they cannot kick in, when she actually kicks the bucket (pardon my language).

Yeah thats it, im sorry for yr troubles, but I still dont get how i can find 'comfort' in knowing that there is someone 'out there', now a literal stranger (its actually over 20 years now- except for those two -v.brief, horrible meet ups) ...who was incredibly cruel to me throughout my whole childhood...im not sure what the 'realize what you had in her' would be...i've essentially not had a mum for 20 years or more, and prior to that didnt really have one anyway....I wasnt even allowed to call her mum. The irony is that the person who I spoke to was my step mum- and she has made it incredibly hard for me to get even vaguely close to me dad in later years...really creating a situtation where I just did not feel comfortable even trying to have much contact with him..after not having him in my childhood, or teen years, twenties...I couldnt even re-connect later on as she made it so so hard..that being said he made no effort at all to either..he'd moved on by then, had two other kids with her, and even admitted that we are virtual strangers...which I was actually glad to hear him admit to infront of her.

i do think u got it alot thou, so thank u- people that have a even slightly caring, loving, interested mother seemingly can not believe or comprehend that they could have been THAT bad- im made to feel like i am making it up or exaggerating things- i only wish i was!

thku for reading my vent thou.

 

[LonelyLight]

I'm in the same boat. My mother is an alcoholic, has been as long as I remember. A few of the things you said are similar to my childhood. I was always alone at home while she drank in the pub, until she would come home at 2am, twisted drunk, and start blaring music and cry. No food to eat in the house except maybe those microwaveable hotdogs if your lucky. Sometimes she would forget to leave the key for me to the front door, so I'd have to sit in the garden until whatever time she came home, generally in the rain and cold.
She did the same thing with the fighting, if she fought with a partner she would make sure I could hear it, same if she fought with my siblings.
Even now, she sometimes calls me and has the phone sitting in the room while her and her partner fight. I just hang up now.
So, in terms of having it easier to have a dead parent, no.
I'd rather have a mother that loved me as a mother should, and unfortunately lose her but have great memories and security in the fact she loved me, than having to deal with the fact my mother is here, not willing to make a change for any one of her children, still putting men and drink before us, calling me telling me shes gonna kill herself *she does that often and then "forgets" she did it the next day* and just pretty much hurting me anytime we speak.
I love my mother despite it all, but I hate my mother too.

 

[MeltingHeart]

I'm in the same boat. My mother is an alcoholic, has been as long as I remember. A few of the things you said are similar to my childhood. I was always alone at home while she drank in the pub, until she would come home at 2am, twisted drunk, and start blaring music and cry. No food to eat in the house except maybe those microwaveable hotdogs if your lucky. Sometimes she would forget to leave the key for me to the front door, so I'd have to sit in the garden until whatever time she came home, generally in the rain and cold.
She did the same thing with the fighting, if she fought with a partner she would make sure I could hear it, same if she fought with my siblings.
Even now, she sometimes calls me and has the phone sitting in the room while her and her partner fight. I just hang up now.
So, in terms of having it easier to have a dead parent, no.
I'd rather have a mother that loved me as a mother should, and unfortunately lose her but have great memories and security in the fact she loved me, than having to deal with the fact my mother is here, not willing to make a change for any one of her children, still putting men and drink before us, calling me telling me shes gonna kill herself *she does that often and then "forgets" she did it the next day* and just pretty much hurting me anytime we speak.
I love my mother despite it all, but I hate my mother too.

Im sorry you had this also &OMG i used to get locked outside ALL the time too, id get home from school and do the same- in all weather- not sure where to go- or if i should tell anyone, and other times i would have to go to a phone box (when they were still in use- and as she never paid the home phone bill) late at night, sometimes in cold and dark & stand outside it...often for an hour or more..whilst she would shout, scream and swear to either my dad or her partner...often breaking the phone by smashing it...I just wanted to be at home reading, or doing homework or at a friends house but she made me go with her everytime. She drank alot too, took alot of drugs...I would even sit and roll joints for her...and then go out all night till the morning and leave me all alone...i used to comfort eat & then inevitably developed an eating disorder. She also threatened to kill herself etc..all that intense stuff. But people just dont seem to understand if they are still alive..its like the loss of a parent (or maybe sexual/physical abuse also) is the only quantifiable or valid form of trauma that seems to elicit true understanding or any emphathy...Some people seemingly can not even open their minds and even try and understand how bad long term emotional abuse and neglect can be...I dont love her. Its been too long & too much hurt. I feel nothing for her, nothing at all.

 

[LonelyLight]

Im sorry you had this also &OMG i used to get locked outside ALL the time too, id get home from school and do the same- in all weather- not sure where to go- or if i should tell anyone, and other times i would have to go to a phone box (when they were still in use- and as she never paid the home phone bill) late at night, sometimes in cold and dark & stand outside it...often for an hour or more..whilst she would shout, scream and swear to either my dad or her partner...often breaking the phone by smashing it...I just wanted to be at home reading, or doing homework or at a friends house but she made me go with her everytime. She drank alot too, took alot of drugs...I would even sit and roll joints for her...and then go out all night till the morning and leave me all alone...i used to comfort eat & then inevitably developed an eating disorder. She also threatened to kill herself etc..all that intense stuff. But people just dont seem to understand if they are still alive..its like the loss of a parent (or maybe sexual/physical abuse also) is the only quantifible of valid form of trauma that seems to ellicit true understanding or any emphathy...Some people seemingly can not even open their minds and even try and understand how bad long term emotional abuse and neglect can be...I dont love her. Its been too long & too much heart. I feel nothing for her, nothing at all.

Wow, that is absolutely awful. I never really meet anyone that understands me so it's nice to have someone that does, as unfortunate as it is. But yes, people are very ignorant to it, and always come up with the "but shes your mother" answer and "aren't you lucky to still have her" hmmm am I?
Sometimes I wish I could detach from her also, I think life would be a little easier as I wouldnt be weighed down with her latest bullshit. But I always end up feeling sorry for her

 

[MeltingHeart]

Wow, that is absolutely awful. I never really meet anyone that understands me so it's nice to have someone that does, as unfortunate as it is. But yes, people are very ignorant to it, and always come up with the "but shes your mother" answer and "aren't you lucky to still have her" hmmm am I?
Sometimes I wish I could detach from her also, I think life would be a little easier as I wouldnt be weighed down with her latest bullshit. But I always end up feeling sorry for her

yeah i hear those two statments all the time too! or people will just instantly go on to talk about themselves or that time they had that one arguement (with their otherwise nice & normal mum) without actually listening to what im saying first. I did used to feel sorry for her too-but then i realised even in those tiny and rare windows when she was even slightly nice to me- it wasnt cos she cared or loved me- its cos she was lonely, had pushed people away and just thought i could be her friend or companion to drag along when she wanted to go and so something-like take me out of school during a crucial time cos she wanted to go to india for 2 wks- and then be mental & do risky behavior the whole time. the fact she is 'blood' means nothing and it never has- i would have LOVED to have been adopted by a caring, kind person, that wanted to raise a child. ah well. Oh i did used to feel sorry for her too, i couldnt be weighed down by it anymore, and it was too relentless-it was too hurtful over and over again-as of course I desperately wanted her to love me and care for me & just be a little kind...i kept holding out hope things would change or get better but they never did...it just got worst if anything.. to the extent that going to live in a strange city, in a hostel with hardcore drug addicts, ex criminals , people with schizophrenia (that really should have been in a better care facility) ...well that became the better option in the end.

Shes lucky to have you- you never know-she might get better-some-people can change and improve- I hope she does for yr sake.

 

[LonelyLight]

yeah i hear those two statments all the time too! or people will just instantly go on to talk about themselves or that time they had that one arguement (with their otherwise nice & normal mum) without actually listening to what im saying first. I did used to feel sorry for her too-but then i realised even in those tiny and rare windows when she was even slightly nice to me- it wasnt cos she cared or loved me- its cos she was lonely, had pushed people away and just thought i could be her friend or companion to drag along when she wanted to go and so something-like take me out of school during a crucial time cos she wanted to go to india for 2 wks- and then be mental & do risky behavior the whole time. the fact she is 'blood' means nothing and it never has- i would have LOVED to have been adopted by a caring, kind person, that wanted to raise a child. ah well. Oh i did used to feel sorry for her too, i couldnt be weighed down by it anymore, and it was too relentless-it was too hurtful over and over again-as of course I desperately wanted her to love me and care for me & just be a little kind...i kept holding out hope things would change or get better but they never did...it just got worst if anything.. to the extent that going to live in a strange city, in a hostel with hardcore drug addicts, ex criminals , people with schizophrenia (that really should have been in a better care facility) ...well that became the better option in the end.

Shes lucky to have you- you never know-she might get better-some-people can change and improve- I hope she does for yr sake.

Oh God yes, there's always someone that has to out do you, "my ma is an alcoholic the last 20 years" "oh yeah? Well mine put gravy on my dinner when she knows I dont like it!!!" Its like huh? Really?
It's awful you got the drugs side of things too, and were exposed to situations like that, at least, I'll give her one thing, it's only ever been alcohol.
Thank you, I guess we can both live in hope that some day things will turn around... but I'm not banking on it from my end. Hugs to you friend don't ever feel alone in the world of shitty mothers, I'm right here with ya!

 

[MeltingHeart]

Oh God yes, there's always someone that has to out do you, "my ma is an alcoholic the last 20 years" "oh yeah? Well mine put gravy on my dinner when she knows I dont like it!!!" Its like huh? Really?
It's awful you got the drugs side of things too, and were exposed to situations like that, at least, I'll give her one thing, it's only ever been alcohol.
Thank you, I guess we can both live in hope that some day things will turn around... but I'm not banking on it from my end. Hugs to you friend don't ever feel alone in the world of shitty mothers, I'm right here with ya!

im run out of hope now-its all gone, that why im on here....im too old for it still bother me...i'd overcome so much...I thought i was resilient and had 'moved on'...i was nearly happy & ok, but its all come back to haunt me threefold..for many reasons...too much to go into! thku LonelyLight for yr understanding.

 

[LonelyLight]

im run out of hope now-its all gone, that why im on here....im too old for it still bother me...i'd overcome so much...I thought i was resilient and had 'moved on'...i was nearly happy & ok, but its all come back to haunt me threefold..for many reasons...too much to go into! thku LonelyLight for yr understanding.

Thank you too, my inbox is open if you ever like a chat! All the best