Venting Existence could never be “beautiful”.

[FuneralCry]

This is one of the examples of toxic positivity that is replusive to me, I think I've even read people saying that "existence is beautiful" before on this site, which is something that comes across as being so absurd to me, it makes little sense to say that as the hellish nature of existence certainly is undeniable. The reality is that existence could never be beautiful and to believe such a thing would of course be centred around delusions, as the truth is that having the ability to exist here truly is such a terrible and hopeless thing. The existence of life is a cruel, horrific tragedy and it's such a nightmarish and chaotic world we exist in that is filled with endless risks and potential for harm.

This world is hell as there is no such thing as "rock bottom", existence holds unlimited capacity for torment and pain to be experienced, where all that we are destined for is to lose everything and inevitably decay. It's impossible to comprehend the amount of torture that has been experienced all throughout history and sadly will do in the future, there really is no beauty in this and there could never be. Existing is so incredibly futile, it's just unnecessary suffering and senseless cruelty all for no reason, I think it's completely irrational to actually want to exist here, it's insane to me being so in denial of the reality of existing and labelling existence as being a beautiful, desirable state.

There is nothing beautiful about being trapped here as existence is slavery, we are a slave to our suffering in a world where factors out of our control can make existing even more unbearable for us. But even without that the emptiness would always remain and the awareness of the fact that there is nothing to be gained by this pointless and yet painful process of slowly dying. There is only beauty in death and the thought of this impermanent existence ending. I only see beauty in being unable to suffer for all eternity, finally free from everything. Death makes everything insignificant for us.

 

[Tesha]

I often read your words and wonder if anything is positive in your life? This isn't a personal attack, I just struggle to comprehend how absolutely everything can be so negative, yet you're still choosing to be here. Is SaSu a negative experience for you? I'm genuinely interested and as I said I'm not looking to inflame you. I'm severely suicidal, but can see how some people see the world differently to me…. Just not so negatively, so consistently. Hope this doesn't offend.

 

[TeflonMummy]

Just speaking from the perspective of a serial procrastinator, death has made everything significant to me. I feel like if everything lasted forever nothing would matter. Everything here has a time limit and if you don't experience it, you aren't likely to see it ever again. In a finite world there isn't an infinite amount of suffering, eventually it will end and in that end there will finally be infinite peace.

I do agree with you though; there's no reason available to me in this life that existence is worth its time or effort.

 

[woh6]

I see beauty in nonexisting, just finally being gone seems so nice and peaceful,..

 

[Forever Sleep]

I guess certain moments in life can be beautiful- or- at least, some people find beauty in them- if you don't over analyse it. I love nature. I love to see birds in the garden splashing about in the bird bath. Just simple things. Where I live, the house martins have retuned and the way they fly is incredible. None of it makes existence itself worthwhile to me personally. Still- I'm grateful that I still have moments that lift my spirit.

I feel really bad for you that nothing seems to help you or at the very least- distract you. I can understand why anyone could become suicidal in this world. Still- I think most people can at least remember a handful of moments where things were a little better. I suppose many people are curious really- which I get- must feel annoying and intrusive. Still- you don't seem to have any happy moments or memories in life. Do you even have things that you prefer to do over other things- or, is it all just tedium? Sorry if I'm being too intrusive- I don't expect you to respond if it offends you.

I suppose I've known people who found life beautiful. They truly cherished their lives. They also made my life a lot happier. Many of my fondest memories were with them. I suppose I admired them in a way. Loving life actually takes a lot of effort in my opinion. It's not like all of their lives were easy by any means. They worked bloody hard at their jobs and they worked equally hard at maintaining friendships and being social. To me- that wasn't delusion- they truly felt that way.

I think many of us here are deeply cynical and pessimistic. We feel like we know the truth about life. Maybe that's a good thing. It means there aren't likely to be any nasty surprises lurking- we're already expecting the worst to happen. Still- seeing as so much of life comes down to chance- so much of it is out of our control- or- we simply don't have enough power to change it- I do also see the sense in just going with the flow and trying to enjoy the scenary here and there. I tend to get bogged down with all my negative thoughts but I don't necessarily think that's a superior or insightful way of thinking. It's just become something I've become comfortable with.

 

[rushia]

Positivity is a mind virus that does not exist outside of the modernized world.

 

[Superdeterminist]

maybe existence could be beautiful if there were no suffering, but in reality that will never obtain. so i agree

 

[Hotsackage]

galaxies are pretty, so are nebulas

 

[Aisley]

I really hope you get a way out. And in the foreseeable future, too, not some day down the road. Life is supposed to be little bursts of good amongst the marathon of shit, and you don't even get those. You got ripped off. I'm sorry.

 

[Challu]

Humans = existence
Bad humans = bad existence
Good humans = good existence

(not patronizing)

 

[OceanBlue]

I often read your words and wonder if anything is positive in your life? This isn't a personal attack, I just struggle to comprehend how absolutely everything can be so negative, yet you're still choosing to be here. Is SaSu a negative experience for you? I'm genuinely interested and as I said I'm not looking to inflame you. I'm severely suicidal, but can see how some people see the world differently to me…. Just not so negatively, so consistently. Hope this doesn't offend.

Seeing the world realistically is not negativity - bad outweighs the good and "good" is often just neutral or absence of bad, like good health.
With enough awareness and empathy happiness is impossible.

SaSu is not "good" in itself. It can be comforting, then it's a temporary escape from the bad.. or we can learn here how to exit the bad permanently. SaSu exists bc of the bad, a bit like a doctor.

"yet you're still choosing to be here." This has been answered so many times, there's even a thread for long term users - people "choose" to stay for various reasons - the SI is strong, death can be scary, uncertainty and inaccessibility of methods, some live for other people etc.

 

[Tesha]

Seeing the world realistically is not negativity - bad outweighs the good and "good" is often just neutral or absence of bad, like good health.
With enough awareness and empathy happiness is impossible.

"yet you're still choosing to be here." This has been answered so many times, there's even a thread for long term users - people "choose" to stay for various reasons - the SI is strong, death can be scary, uncertainty and inaccessibility of methods, some live for other people etc.

I suppose my view of the realistic world is different, which is fundamentally where my thought process might lie.

With regards to choosing to still be here, I'm also currently making that choice, so I'm aware of the difficulties CTB can bring. I suppose I'm just surprised that with such extreme views, life continues. Still, I suppose I can't judge As everyone has their reasons. It was just curiosity and if I'm being honest, interest as to why.

 

[yive]

 

[CentreMid]

I agree with you for the most part, life in general is a net-negative, and I know for myself that nonexistence would be ideal. However, I do think there are some things that can provide a temporary escape as we navigate this rat race we call life, no matter how fleeting. They might not be beautiful by any means, but they certainly numb the pain of being alive if one is hurting, or at least break the monotony if one has grown numb. Anywho, I do hope you find peace soon. I know you've been wishing and waiting for your ideal way out for a while now.

 

[iwantdeath6969]

i think existing is inherently neutral. we're all just animals living on earth, the reason humans are so unhappy is that the society we were born into isn't sustainable or enjoyable at all. this isn't human nature though, it's a choice we all for some reason keep making.

if you arent going to ctb any time soon, you should really just spend more time in nature and learn about how the world works. the more you learn about how other species live, the more you realize how insignificant our human problems and lives are.

before you call me pro-life, i'm not, i'm just also not exclusively pro-death like you. i think you should either ctb as soon as possible or just do something else with your life. i don't see what the point is of prolonging your suffering like this is. it's either a very short amount of time of a lot of discomfort & pain, and then it's over forever, or years and years slowly dying and suffering. i don't know why you're choosing the second option when your entire philosophy backs the first option. if you're too scared to ctb, just do something better with your life

 

[Rob1984]

i think existing is inherently neutral. we're all just animals living on earth, the reason humans are so unhappy is that the society we were born into isn't sustainable or enjoyable at all. this isn't human nature though, it's a choice we all for some reason keep making.

if you arent going to ctb any time soon, you should really just spend more time in nature and learn about how the world works. the more you learn about how other species live, the more you realize how insignificant our human problems and lives are.

before you call me pro-life, i'm not, i'm just also not exclusively pro-death like you. i think you should either ctb as soon as possible or just do something else with your life. i don't see what the point is of prolonging your suffering like this is. it's either a very short amount of time of a lot of discomfort & pain, and then it's over forever, or years and years slowly dying and suffering. i don't know why you're choosing the second option when your entire philosophy backs the first option. if you're too scared to ctb, just do something better with your life

You're talking to a brick wall... What you said is very logical, but many people have said logical things to FuneralCry and it just falls on deaf ears. FuneralCry is not on this forum to change their mind or ideology; they're just here to vent. Tbh, we should just have a section of this site for FuneralCry's diary entries.

 

[iwantdeath6969]

yeah, i figured honestly that it wouldn't get anywhere. but i guess if anyone else wants something to make life feel better that's my advice lol. and yeah, honestly sometimes FC's threads don't feel on topic with the suicidal discussion threads since they don't even seem to be actually actively suicidal, just miserable and seemingly pro-suicide politically and as a lifestyle??? never seen anyone like it before

 

[Rob1984]

yeah, i figured honestly that it wouldn't get anywhere. but i guess if anyone else wants something to make life feel better that's my advice lol. and yeah, honestly sometimes FC's threads don't feel on topic with the suicidal discussion threads since they don't even seem to be actually actively suicidal, just miserable and seemingly pro-suicide politically and as a lifestyle??? never seen anyone like it before

Yeah, I've been on this site for longer than my account date, and I have never seen anyone like FC. It's blows my mind how active they are; I have never seen an account that has even close to the amount of activity of FC. Like, not even remotely close. It's insane. I think SS is their hobby...? Idk how else someone could manage so many posts. that's why I am saying- FC should just get their own section of the site.

 

[uniqueusername39]

I thought I was as pessimistic and antinatalist as it gets, and it saddens me to see that some people such as you experience life so negatively that you hold views that even I would consider as extreme. Yes, I agree that life is a net negative, no one should have ever existed, existence is absolutely terrible and it would have been better if no one, from humans to viruses, ever existed. But as the years went by, I allowed some nuance into my views, ie, beauty could exist in spite of the suffering. Being hugged and kissed, creating art, watching a show I enjoy, saving for an item and finally unboxing it, plopping into a soft warm bed after a long day, are all little joys I am still able to experience, even if they are only joys because suffering enables the experience of that joy. I still don't consider them enough justification to continue existing or create more sentient existences, but I am fortunate that I still experience happiness, though I know you'd label this as being deluded. Being deluded is better than being miserable 100% all the time though I guess, which is why I understand why some people would want to bring more children into this world. This is why I keep my antinatalist views to myself now.

Same to the other users here, I am so curious about who you are, what you do in real life. Feeling relieved out of a small suffering, such as satiating hunger or thirst, resting after work, finishing a task--they are all still positive experiences, right? I mean that you would rather experience them than stay hungry, being overworked, etc. than not.

 

[leavingsoon99]

I agree with you. To me, this outlook isn't "pessimism" but reality. Life isn't beautiful. Life isn't worth it. I know that offends some people on here, but that's just reality. For me, anyway. Some people may actually see some type of beauty in it. And that's fine. That's their own opinion of life, and they have a right to place whatever value on life they wish. For me, life isn't worth it. A world of poverty, homelessness, hopelessness, and suffering will never be worth living in. I don't share most people's narrative of life. I don't like humans, because most of them are selfish, arrogant assholes who can't be trusted. I don't believe that suffering is the point of life. I don't think that life is some type of "school" where we're being trained... for what exactly? I've tried to look at life from every angle I possibly could, only to arrive at the conclusion that it isn't worth it for me. Again, some people will disagree, and that's fine. That's their right to do. I, personally, don't see the point in pumping myself full of hopeless hope just to keep getting knocked down because "that's life". Exaclty. That's life. It's not worth it.

 

[sickbeyondmeasure]

Life is beautiful, I just wish I wasn't in pain.

 

[Lynx.]

if you arent going to ctb any time soon, you should really just spend more time in nature and learn about how the world works. the more you learn about how other species live, the more you realize how insignificant our human problems and lives are.

I cannot help but disagree. FuneralCry has expressed their distaste of existence in itself, not just human existence. Assuming that they are only talking about human suffering and the pains of human existence is missing the point of these posts entirely.

Your message is kind of insulting as well, I'm assuming that you hadn't realized it while posting it.

"The more you spend time in nature learning how the world works..." to quote you again. That phrase is assuming that FuneralCry doesn't know how it works - that their naivete prevents them from seeing the beauty of it all.

Beauty or no beauty - everyone sees the world in their own way, but only the mechanics behind it are the true indicator of whether life is beneficial or not to those who possess it.

If you spend more than five minutes in nature, observing it carefully, you'll notice the carnage of existence.
A zebra, missing half of its leg, being mauled by lions as the vultures fly above, waiting for their chance to eat. And some day, those same vultures and the same lions will be on the menu for other predator, just as the zebra was.
Some poor fish is being killed from the inside, devoured slowly by parasites - or if not, a whale will open its mouth, meaning the end of the road.
Some poor raccoon has been killed by a wolf, along with their young offspring.
The list goes on and on. Forever. With each one of those experiences having a lot of meaning and significance yet, nature and existence cares not for it, at all.

Existence is, overall, a negative experience, be it on human society or in nature. And if one observes nature, truly and carefully, they won't fail to notice it.

Cheers for the comment, anyways. Sorry if I have misinterpreted anything or if I'm misguided with my comment - I just saw the praise of nature and the instincts to share a bit of my negative thoughts kicked in, :P.

EDIT:

i don't see what the point is of prolonging your suffering like this is. it's either a very short amount of time of a lot of discomfort & pain, and then it's over forever, or years and years slowly dying and suffering. i don't know why you're choosing the second option when your entire philosophy backs the first option. if you're too scared to ctb, just do something better with your life

FuneralCry has shared many times that, the thing that keeps them here on this earth is the unavailability of a safe, reliable and painless method. It's the same for me.

Even if that wasn't the reason - thinking that life is a negative may not necessarily make one to kill themselves.

"If you are scared to ctb, just do something better with your life."

I'm sorry, I just find that insulting and belittling again. You don't know FuneralCry personally. How would you know what they are doing with their life? Even if you knew, it's still insensitive to say that to someone, since your standards of what it means to do 'something with one's life' may differ from person to person.

 

[SilentSadness]

I agree that life is horrific. It's not beautiful. There is a small amount of happiness but it's so low and far between compared to the misery that it's nearly invisible. I think it's cruelty to force others to be trapped here in life, and to constantly repeat shallow words of optimism. I think humans are resistant to harsh realities, and in this case it's that there is nothing so valuable about life that you should force others to exist.

 

[FuneralCry]

I often read your words and wonder if anything is positive in your life? This isn't a personal attack, I just struggle to comprehend how absolutely everything can be so negative, yet you're still choosing to be here. Is SaSu a negative experience for you? I'm genuinely interested and as I said I'm not looking to inflame you. I'm severely suicidal, but can see how some people see the world differently to me…. Just not so negatively, so consistently. Hope this doesn't offend.

As other people have already pointed out suicide just isn't straightforward in this world. If suicide was as easy as just choosing to leave, then this site would never need to exist. The fact is that suicidal people are denied the option of methods like Nembutal, we cannot just exit in a peaceful and reliable way and it's the reality. In this world suicide is so unnecessarily complicated and risky, and people can end up in a situation of even worse suffering just from trying to attempt.

And no, I don't see existence as being positive or desirable at all, I just carry on existing as if one doesn't find a way to die there is no choice but to. My existence is so futile and empty and I simply despise existing, it could never be worth it for me, but of course as I said it's just not straightforward to leave. There are absolutely loads of posts on this site written by people struggling to plan suicide and go through with it, one can hate existing and be fully aware that suicide is the most rational option, yet still feel trapped here. I wish that existence had an off switch but it simply doesn't, and also I live in the UK which is a very anti suicide country.

And the forum is fine for me, it serves it's purpose as being a place to vent, I don't really care about what other people post on here, I just use this site for my own sake.

I feel really bad for you that nothing seems to help you or at the very least- distract you. I can understand why anyone could become suicidal in this world. Still- I think most people can at least remember a handful of moments where things were a little better. I suppose many people are curious really- which I get- must feel annoying and intrusive. Still- you don't seem to have any happy moments or memories in life. Do you even have things that you prefer to do over other things- or, is it all just tedium? Sorry if I'm being too intrusive- I don't expect you to respond if it offends you

No, it's not offensive, I do find existing to be very tedious and unnecessary, it's the way that things have always been, it's completely a futile process but time will pass no matter what and then I will eventually fall asleep, at least I'm able to sleep for some of my time spent here, (even if it often takes a while to fall asleep) But apart from that only death can bring relief from suffering, existing here truly is a hopeless fate, it's the reality and it will and can only get worse.

 

[GreenTree]

You seam very intelligent funeral cry. Have you ever tried anti depressants or seaked help.

 

[FuneralCry]

You seam very intelligent funeral cry. Have you ever tried anti depressants or seaked help.

I've never really seen myself as being intelligent honestly, but I have enough awareness to recognise that wanting to die could never be an "illness", hating existing and not seeing it as a desirable state isn't depression, it's being realistic and not being blinded by delusions. I just know that existing isn't for me, I certainly don't wish to age and experience even worse suffering. And I think all the discussion about wanting to die being a mental illness that needs to be "helped", is nonsense really, that whole mental health industry only exists as a way to profit from people's suffering anyway.

I could never be delusional enough to want to exist in this chaotic world filled with endless potential for harm and senseless cruelty, it's really irrational to want to exist just to risk experiencing even worse suffering at any moment just to be tortured by old age. Only death can help someone in this harsh reality, when one has awareness that existing is truly something hopeless and futile, there's nothing to be gained by delaying the inevitable, it's just a process of slowly dying. I just don't like the sensation of having to exist and being trapped within my own thoughts anyway, it's unsettling and unappealing, even if there wasn't any extreme suffering the emptiness and dissatisfaction would always remain. I think it makes so much sense wishing for permanent nothingness in a world as hellish as this.

 

[Hahem]

I don't quite undertand your point, you make it seem like having positive experiences or any semblance of happiness is impossible and mere delusions, while there are many people out there that seem to be enjoying life, by that I mean their lives have much more pleasure than suffering (laughing, going out, love, experiences, etc.). So it just seems strange for you to say that suffering is inevitable and existence is all bad, maybe it is for you (and me), but for many it isn't and happiness is pretty much possible for most people (maybe all people)
Just expressing my opinion, no offense

 

[Rob1984]

If suicide was as easy as just choosing to leave, then this site would never need to exist.

That's not true at all. Some of us are on this site to discuss topics on suicide, or to just vent our daily struggles (such as what you do). The reason I have not ctb is because I don't want to yet. It has nothing to do with a lack of an easy method, I can assure you. You would not understand this because you are convinced everybody suffers non-stop in this world, but that is nothing more than just a perspective you hold. But to assume if everyone could easily ctb, and therefore SS would not be necessary to exist, shows you are not aware of all the different and stimulating discussions that occur on this site. Which is odd considering how you are, by far, the most active account on SS. I would think of all users, you in particular should see the value of SS, regardless if we all had an easy and painless way out of existence. In this case, I am afraid you are projecting your own reality on to others in that you are assuming the reason people stick around existing is because of the lack of an easy and guaranteed way to ctb. For many of us, the question is not how we should ctb, but whether we should. You would not understand, because you are convinced suicide is 100% of the time the most rational decision one could make in life, so any of us who are prolonging our death would be considered irrational to you. This response I am giving also touches on your comment: "[SS] serves it's purpose as being a place to vent, I don't really care about what other people post on here, I just use this site for my own sake."

 

[Menschenmühle]

I often see my own existence as futile and unnecessary, but it's a tad bit too extreme to make my view of my own life so systematic as to generalize it to every living being.

You say that those who view existence as "beautiful" are delusional, but I don't think you have the right to say that. When it comes to your own subjective experience, you have every right to claim that YOUR own life can never be beautiful, but when it comes other people's lives, it seems that we just have to take what they say at face value, simply because we don't have enough information about their own subjective experiences to make a claim pertaining to their quality of life.

It's true that life has an endless capacity for suffering, but it also has an endless capacity for joy and happiness. For me personally, there's an asymmetry that leans heavily towards suffering more than pleasure. However, many people claim the opposite, they see their lives as mostly full of joy and pleasure, and it seems they have enough "hope" that carries them forward to continuing their lives rather than ending it.

What I want to say, in the end, is that your viewpoint needs a bit of nuance. You have every right to make whatever claim you wish about your own life. It seems that you see it very negatively, and I sympathize with you for that, because I also see my own life in a negative way. However, you just can't take your own personal feelings and generalize them to the point where they become applicable to all of existence and to every possible human experience.

 

[Yozo_oba]

I can somewhat see why people would think of certain things in life to be "beautiful or good", but there is no such thing as good in this world, only a temperary escape from the bad, like a drug. The only way for there to truely be "good" is to be forever free from it all.