Discussion Does anyone know a lot of about the laws when it comes to suicide?

[Severen]

There have been people who have gone to prison for telling people to go kill themselves... Sometimes just to be cruel or sometimes because they literally want someone to commit suicide. So is telling people how to commit suicide, illegal? What about, giving people who want to CTB, some advice that will make it easier for them to CTB? That would be disturbing. Because that means, freedom of speech is pretty much fucking dead... And we all live in a North Korea like country except instead of starving, we have to try hard to avoid becoming fat.

 

[Suicidal4Ever]

I've been told to kill myself more times than i can count in youtube comment sections or playing call of duty lol

 

[alizee]

There have been people who have gone to prison for telling people to go kill themselves... Sometimes just to be cruel or sometimes because they literally want someone to commit suicide. So is telling people how to commit suicide, illegal? What about, giving people who want to CTB, some advice that will make it easier for them to CTB? That would be disturbing. Because that means, freedom of speech is pretty much fucking dead... And we all live in a North Korea like country except instead of starving, we have to try hard to avoid becoming fat.

In USA it varies from state to state. Someone can tell a person they should commit suicide and not be charged but in another state it would result in criminal charges. Here is a good answer about USA for people who commit suicide:

To what extent is suicide legal in the U.S. and in individual states?

At one point, legal scholars referred to suicide as a form of self-murder (for example, see Coke or Hale). Are those who take their own lives guilty of some crime, or have some forms of the act been

law.stackexchange.com

In Canada it's decriminalized completely for the person committing suicide. Yet, anyone helping will likely be prosecuted if the authority has reasonable proof and the person giving the help isn't mentally ill in anyway. Doctors are still paranoid about helping people end their life and when it's now legal for people in chronic pain that fit the discriminatory criteria of will die in the foreseeable future.

Free speech is dead depending on the state you live in the USA. Since police are corrupt as can be for whoever wants something silenced.

 

[Severen]

I've been told to kill myself more times than i can count in youtube comment sections or playing call of duty lol

Yeah but let's say, someone told you to CTB while you were playing Call Of Duty and you did... That other player might be considered an accomplice in a crime, then...

In USA it varies from state to state. Someone can tell a person they should commit suicide and not be charged but in another state it would result in criminal charges. Here is a good answer about USA for people who commit suicide:

To what extent is suicide legal in the U.S. and in individual states?

At one point, legal scholars referred to suicide as a form of self-murder (for example, see Coke or Hale). Are those who take their own lives guilty of some crime, or have some forms of the act been

law.stackexchange.com

In Canada it's decriminalized completely for the person committing suicide. Yet, anyone helping will likely be prosecuted if the authority has reasonable proof and the person giving the help isn't mentally ill in anyway. Doctors are still paranoid about helping people end their life and when it's now legal for people in chronic pain that fit the discriminatory criteria of will die in the foreseeable future.

Free speech is dead depending on the state you live in the USA. Since police are corrupt as can be for whoever wants something silenced.

The responses on that website are very cryptic...

 

[alizee]

Yeah but let's say, someone told you to CTB while you were playing Call Of Duty and you did... That other player might be considered an accomplice in a crime, then...


The responses on that website are very cryptic...

Yah not the usual high quality answer from stack overflow but I agree with the general sense it depends on the state you reside in the USA.

Another example of the law would be telling suicide advice in a state where that's allowed but instead over the Internet and where the receiver is in a state it isn't allowed. Charges could be made against you in the receiver's jurisdiction but the likelihood you're forced to go there for court is unlikely.

 

[Watcher]

Yes, giving support/assistance/ or manipulate someone to commit suicide, is a crime in most countries and states.

 

[Severen]

Yes, giving support/assistance/ or manipulate someone to commit suicide, is a crime in most countries and states.

So basically like 75% of people here are criminals?

 

[Watcher]

So basically like 75% of people here are criminals?

Maybe, but internet doesn't have especific law's ( it depends on the country and culture around you ) onnly if your country creates a law specifically about the theme... But most of the time, they don't care about it. They have more "important" state/government, problems to resolve before. That's how the world works. A philosopher that could bring you a response could be Michael Foucault. Search a video about his work and life. He talked about political power, and how the division between different points of view of a group which have have 'political/economic influence" can chance the pre-stablished moral of most of big masses. The main concept wich can give you an idea of the pos-true concept. Basically, the ones who has the political/economic power are the ones who decide which ideas are correct or aceptable, and which are wrong according to their their "moral/ideology's values. Nietzsche and Foucault culd give and answer. I still believe at lesat in baruch espinoza's Concept of god.

 

[Thorn]

So basically like 75% of people here are criminals?

Would be 100, but 25% are already gone.

 

[Severen]

Would be 100, but 25% are already gone.

 

[ProhibereDolor]

Depends on the country. As for the illegality of telling someone to kill themselves, this is way out of my league. I'm not a lawyer. But one thought comes to mind. Here in the US those pieces of shit over at NAMBLA are able to talk about that horrible shit with impunity. The problem is that no matter how illegal an act may be, the right to talk about that act seems to be protected unless it's a conspiracy to commit blah blah blah. But you would figure that talking about having sex with boys IS conspiracy to commit. But I cannot tell you where that line is drawn. Even though what those nasty fucks talk about is heinous and super illegal they argue that talking about an act is not the same as committing said act(even though we all know those sick bastards DO commit said acts).

Maybe, but internet doesn't have especific law's ( it depends on the country and culture around you ) onnly if your country creates a law specifically about the theme... But most of the time, they don't care about it. They have more "important" state/government, problems to resolve before. That's how the world works. A philosopher that could bring you a response could be Michael Foucault. Search a video about his work and life. He talked about political power, and how the division between different points of view of a group which have have 'political/economic influence" can chance the pre-stablished moral of most of big masses. The main concept wich can give you an idea of the pos-true concept. Basically, the ones who has the political/economic power are the ones who decide which ideas are correct or aceptable, and which are wrong according to their their "moral/ideology's values. Nietzsche and Foucault culd give and answer. I still believe at lesat in baruch espinoza's Concept of god.

History is decided by the mother fucking winner. They decide what goes in the books and what doesn't.

 

[Watcher]

Would be 100, but 25% are already gone.

Don't care about it, we are a pro-choice forum. We help each other in diferent ways, it's no time were the diferece between goog or evil it's completely clear. Don't be afraid, in most of cultures, pro-choice was a rure, including crihistianism. The bible it's not completely creal about it, epicuros philosophy say that we don't nees to care Abou death, is something than some will catch without knowing it

 

[ProhibereDolor]

I've been told to kill myself more times than i can count in youtube comment sections or playing call of duty lol

Same here. It's pretty sad how people that have no idea who you are or what you're about treat others. They hide behind the anonymity of the internet but would never say the same shit to your face(usually) because they will get their asses kicked. Most people I have the joy of running into online are stuck up holier-than-thou asshats. One of the few exceptions is this very site. I have never seen so many people willing to rally around and assist others as well as how compassionate people can be as I've seen in my short time as a member here.

Everyone on this site deserves a round of applause

 

[not_a_robot]

Yes, giving support/assistance/ or manipulate someone to commit suicide, is a crime in most countries and states.

Ok so if somebody on the internet keeps saying "I have no means to kill myself!"
And I say, "But knives and ropes are everywhere."
Am I a criminal?

 

[Watcher]

Ok so if somebody on the internet keeps saying "I have no means to kill myself!"
And I say, "But knives and ropes are everywhere."
Am I a criminal?

Maybe, but FBI or cia, dont care at all about people having mental illnesses. They are concetretaded more in economics and politics context

 

[not_a_robot]

Same here. It's pretty sad how people that have no idea who you are or what you're about treat others. They hide behind the anonymity of the internet but would never say the same shit to your face(usually) because they will get their asses kicked. Most people I have the joy of running into online are stuck up holier-than-thou asshats. One of the few exceptions is this very site. I have never seen so many people willing to rally around and assist others as well as how compassionate people can be as I've seen in my short time as a member here.

Everyone on this site deserves a round of applause

You think people are just shitty anonymously on the internet? I have bad news. I get told to kill myself regularly by people who know I can't do a damn thing about it, mostly in mental health settings. It's my word against theirs, if I report it I will never be believed.

Maybe, but FBI or cia, dont care at all about people having mental illnesses. They are concetretaded more in economics and politics context

All cops care about one thing: getting their faces in the media.

 

[Watcher]

You think people are just shitty anonymously on the internet? I have bad news. I get told to kill myself regularly by people who know I can't do a damn thing about it, mostly in mental health settings. It's my word against theirs, if I report it I will never be believed.

All cops care about one thing: getting their faces in the media.

Exactly, everything is justa a media show

 

[Rukia]

So basically like 75% of people here are criminals?

Those are my doubts as well...I have this fear I will be one day prosecuted for being here...

Maybe contrary to what we believe this site is not on the radar yet, it is relatively new...but one day somebody would decide to do a crackdown...maybe it is just my paranoia speaking...didnt want to open such a thread myself as to not spread panic, but if it was open already...I spoke my mind, sorry for that...

Someone may say the answer is easy- not to be here anymore- but the community is so supportive, even if I am not actively suicidal anymore I dont want to leave...but the fear is great...

 

[Severen]

Depends on the country. As for the illegality of telling someone to kill themselves, this is way out of my league. I'm not a lawyer. But one thought comes to mind. Here in the US those pieces of shit over at NAMBLA are able to talk about that horrible shit with impunity. The problem is that no matter how illegal an act may be, the right to talk about that act seems to be protected unless it's a conspiracy to commit blah blah blah. But you would figure that talking about having sex with boys IS conspiracy to commit. But I cannot tell you where that line is drawn. Even though what those nasty fucks talk about is heinous and super illegal they argue that talking about an act is not the same as committing said act(even though we all know those sick bastards DO commit said acts).

History is decided by the mother fucking winner. They decide what goes in the books and what doesn't.

Yeah and while it's okay for NAMBLA to say what they want as long as there is no conspiracy, a 17 year old girl was sent to prison for 15 months for some text messages, telling someone to do what he has been saying he wants to do for 10000000 times already. https://www.cnn.com/2017/06/08/us/text-message-suicide-michelle-carter-conrad-roy/index.html

 

[jake3d]

a 17 year old girl was sent to prison for 15 months for some text messages, telling someone to do what he has been saying he wants to do for 10000000 times already. https://www.cnn.com/2017/06/08/us/text-message-suicide-michelle-carter-conrad-roy/index.html

I don't even... Thank whoever made me that I don't live in Big Brother Central.

 

[Severen]

I don't even... Thank whoever made me that I don't live in Big Brother Central.

Well a lot of countries are Big Brother Central but the USA has so many fucking religious freaks... It's like Big Brother Christian Central.

Those are my doubts as well...I have this fear I will be one day prosecuted for being here...

Maybe contrary to what we believe this site is not on the radar yet, it is relatively new...but one day somebody would decide to do a crackdown...maybe it is just my paranoia speaking...didnt want to open such a thread myself as to not spread panic, but if it was open already...I spoke my mind, sorry for that...

Someone may say the answer is easy- not to be here anymore- but the community is so supportive, even if I am not actively suicidal anymore I dont want to leave...but the fear is great...

People who panic are the guilty ones for lacking mental discipline. It's not fair to blame other people for their flaws.

Ok so if somebody on the internet keeps saying "I have no means to kill myself!"
And I say, "But knives and ropes are everywhere."
Am I a criminal?

If that someone CTBs right afterwards and his or her parents throw a childish temper tantrum, then probably, yeah.

 

[Rukia]

People who panic are the guilty ones for lacking mental discipline. It's not fair to blame other people for their flaws.

You are right...Thanks for opening this thread...

 

[RainAndSadness]

Most people don't seem to understand that assisted suicide isn't the same as encouraging.

"You should commit suicide" <- encouragement and clearly a crime
"Here is how you commit suicide" <- assisting and legal in some countries

The whole point of assisted suicide is help, making sure the person who wants to end their life can leave in a dignified and peaceful manner. The decision lies solely on the person who wants to leave. That's it. That's assisting, someone makes the decision and you try to assist them in the execution of that decision, in an attempt to create the best outcome for that person. In contrary to encouragement, when the decision is influenced by others and therefore not fully autonomous anymore. I don't know why so many people outside of this forum don't get the difference.

 

[TAW122]

Most people don't seem to understand that assisted suicide isn't the same as encouraging.

"You should commit suicide" <- encouragement and clearly a crime
"Here is how you commit suicide" <- assisting and legal in some countries

The whole point of assisted suicide is help, making sure the person who wants to end their life can leave in a dignified and peaceful manner. The decision lies solely on the person who wants to leave. That's it. That's assisting, someone makes the decision and you try to assist them in the execution of that decision, in an attempt to create the best outcome for that person. In contrary to encouragement, when the decision is influenced by others and therefore not fully autonomous anymore. I don't know why so many people outside of this forum don't get the difference.

Partly because most people outside of this forum rarely ever responds to the word suicide rationally but anything that deals with death or suicide is always emotionally charged and people aren't rational when it comes to certain topics. This is only the surface reason though because social pressures and religion also plays a big role in many people's thinking.

 

[Rukia]

"You should commit suicide" <- encouragement and clearly a crime
"Here is how you commit suicide" <- assisting and legal in some countries

But there is a third scenario "I know someone is about to commit suicide, I know his location (country)"
Do I have to call the cops? I mean in theory...It is no longer an ideation but I mean somebody who is about to execute a concrete plan...

Also the person about to CTB is:
a) in my country
b) in foreign country

 

[jake3d]

But there is a third scenario "I know someone is about to commit suicide, I know his location (country)"
Do I have to call the cops? I mean in theory...It is no longer an ideation but I mean somebody who is about to execute a concrete plan...

Yes, inaction in such a case may legally fall under assisting under some countries' laws. Therefore respecting the right to a free choice is best done while keeping a low profile.

 

[Rukia]

Yes, inaction in such a case may legally fall under assisting under some countries' laws. Therefore respecting the right to a free choice is best done while keeping a low profile.

What do you mean by keeping a low profile? Using TOR or sth like that? I fear it is too little...and it is only a matter of decision from law enforcement to do a small witch hunt in this forum...
I know some ppl here will eventually CTB so they dont care...But it is minority I think...

It will be prudent to make a list of such countries where inaction is considered criminal and warn members from such countries...
I fear it is just ignorance of the law...because hardly anybody will choose "free choice" over his own safety...

 

[jake3d]

What do you mean by keeping a low profile? Using TOR or sth like that? I fear it is too little...and it is only a matter of decision from law enforcement to do a small witch hunt in this forum...
I know some ppl here will eventually CTB so they dont care...But it is minority I think...

Tor is enough. We are not that interesting.

 

[Rukia]

Well, if we are not interesting why the panic in the neighbouring threads?

If death is not interesting for law enforcement I dont know what to say
Isnt it a mantra we repeat (we are not interesting) to lull ourselves into false sense of security?

Still thinking about this list, we can make a sticky in the resources so members from those countries will be aware of the risks...even if it is theoretical for now...

 

[jake3d]

Well, if we are not interesting why the panic in the neighbouring threads?

If death is not interesting for law enforcement I dont know what to say

Nobody got cops sent over to check on them for being on a website where suicide is discussed. They got the visit because of ordering illegal pharmaceuticals over the internet and customs intercepting the package. Simple as that.