Do you think there is a lot of half-knowledge on this website?

[noname223]

I don't necessarily mean that concerning suicide. Though on suicide one should probably be very sure what one really wants, not being too ambivalent and I think a certain consistency is probably good when one makes the decision. The topic of this thread is half-knowledge. I think one should be careful when one reads about suicide. Not relying on one single person for example. Because on such a decisive question half-knowledge is dangerous.

I don't think fake news are a huge problem in this forum. (But I am not sure about it.) At least not much more than in other places on the internet. I think fake news and unverified information are part of the internet. Everyone can produce information in the past journalists were the gatekeepers. At least when we talk about the media.

I did not really relate this question to suicide. Rather on other topics like philosphy, politics, religion and other sciences. Are there competent people in this forum? Some people reallly impressed me. I have read some sophisticated and intricate thoughts on certain topics. I don't agree with everything that was expressed though. But here are some interesting individuals in this forum. And our suffering and pain kind of connects us.

I think I tend to making threads with half-knowledge. Due to the fact I make so many threads I usually don't make in-depth research. Though I would consider me somewhat competent on certain topics. At least compared to the average person. I often express my opinion instead of researching the objective truth on something. If I did only threads on issues I am an expert in I could barely make any posts at all. Though I think this applies to many people.

I think on the internet in general one should take information with a grain of salt. One should be critical and have the fact in mind that literally anyone can pretend shit online.

What is your opinion on that?

 

[MidnightDream]

Yes. I don't think anyone can have an entire knowledge on something, no matter how educated a person might be, no matter how good their intentions might be, no one can ever be 100%. Even with in-depth research, there will always still be more to learn, developing theory, new evidence, etc. And unfortunately, all humans experience confirmation bias. That's a major point of contention on this website, specifically with regards to certain methods and at the end of the day, it's human nature to want to be right. Fake news is an interesting point, ultimately it's impossible to verify anyone's experience with any topic without witnessing it first hand, and even then it would be open to interpretation. It's important to remain vigilant, trust our instincts, explore multiple sources of information and ultimately form our own opinions. As you said, take everything with a grain of salt.

 

[Altvtysp]

What you are saying is correct. I made an attempt two days ago with a method that was described on here (and in some of the suicide book PDFs) that it would cause you pass out in 30-60 seconds and then you essentially get strangled to death. It never made me pass out but I tried doing it for up to 10 minutes and now my eyes are very damaged and bright red. It will take weeks to heal. Even if I wanted to try to move forward I can't imagine going around the next few weeks with severely damaged eyes. It's the worst that could have occurred. The method did not work and has left me badly scarred in a way that even if my former employer gave me my job back I would have to ask them to wait for several weeks and I'm not sure how I would explain it. I'd like to find a quick, low pain and non-terrifying method but haven't figured out what I could do that's likely to succeed without harming me some more if it fails. I would take any claims about methods with a grain of salt.

 

[Chinaski]

Not a single person on this website knows a single fucking thing about anything, myself included.

 

[FuneralCry]

People can post anything on here and make it sound believable. It is the internet after all. I think that on here there are some arrogant people who like to think of themselves as being very intelligent, more than they actually are. That kind of thing is irritating and tiring to me.

But I think the problem with this is in regards to suicide methods. People can spread false information and could lead to others potentially failing attempts. This website is basically just endless threads about suicide methods, and I just wish that the society accepted suicide as an option so we could all just exit peacefully without having to do method research online. It's just so terrifying the thought of a method failing.

 

[MelancholyMagic]

On the internet, if I want to be an expert university professor, all I have to do is...say I am. That's it. Some people may not believe me, but some will (trust me on this - I have done research on internet gullibility with my colleagues, and we are from a prestigious top 100 US university).

People lie often in real life, and near constantly on the Internet. Sometimes it matters, sometimes it does not. But much info online - even from people who seem knowledgeable - is really just partly fabricated or parroted from someone else. Not always, but it usually is (and you do not know when it is or when it is not).

In terms of suicide methods, I am very skeptical of much of what I read here. Suicide rates (even very violent methods) have incredibly high fail rates, but you would not think it just from looking through the methods subforum (https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/means-matter/means-matter/case-fatality/).

 

[CTB Dream]

Fullknow not possible universe large spend entire life due not know any. There no thing full know only topic very small possible .even this topic small subject typ see image not know number atom only show image. Still this no meaning cant do find truth still posible ,see machine know no brag no say half full not like human

 

[Altvtysp]

People can post anything on here and make it sound believable. It is the internet after all. I think that on here there are some arrogant people who like to think of themselves as being very intelligent, more than they actually are. That kind of thing is irritating and tiring to me.

But I think the problem with this is in regards to suicide methods. People can spread false information and could lead to others potentially failing attempts. This website is basically just endless threads about suicide methods, and I just wish that the society accepted suicide as an option so we could all just exit peacefully without having to do method research online. It's just so terrifying the thought of a method failing.

There are a ton of posts on pretty much every method conceivable but I don't think much of it is very realistic or at least makes it seem like you're a lot more likely to succeed than fail. I spent a lot of time researching that specific method and related ones on here and also in books like the Five Last Acts which go into it in detail. They did not really highlight that if the method fails what the consequences are like bursting most of the blood vessels in your eyes. I tried really hard to get the method to work and now don't believe it does at all because of how the ratchet latch operates. It's not possible to get it tight enough and the strap is too wide. I hope by expressing my experience that it will stop others from even trying it.

Society is really messed up. They want us to be a slave to the system and it's not profitable to allow people to end their lives in middle age if they so choose. Society's answer to what I'm going through is to forcibly hold me in an awful psych ward and force me to take psych drugs I do not want. It doesn't matter what I want FOR MY OWN LIFE and that I no longer want to be in this reality any longer. I've been this way for many years since my last serious (in hindsight now that I've been able to research things it wasn't that serious or at least not likely to succeed) attempt. I've tried killing myself at least 7 times over the past 24 years but that time in 2018 when I cut 7" incisions in both my wrists was the first time I did it with premeditation and was violent towards myself.

Since then I've mostly kept my suicidal ideation deep within myself and was able to surpress it until my life got really difficult in 2019 and now just very recently. In 2018 I had destroyed my career and was losing my place. In 2019 I had rebuilt my life with a new job and place to live while dealing with these gigantic scars on my wrists and ended up impulsively ingesting like 70 grams of gabapentin after getting drunk. I rebuilt my life again with time over the last few years. My life imploded before this recent suicide attempt. I guess I'm making a progress since the SA's are following my life being destroyed and not causing it. I'm just done trying to function in society and being a drain on my family.

We absolutely should have the option for pain-free suicide. If I have to put in the request and wait a period of time I would totally choose that route but since I'm doing it on my own terms I would prefer to get it over with sooner rather than later. I lost my job but really I was very isolated the last few years and it had become an important social connection so it was much more than that. I live in a pretty isolated community and there aren't really many other places to work. I'm constantly reminded every single day how much I've been attacked and smeared by my recent work. I can hardly leave my house without running into a former employee. I'm not explaining everything that has happened but the situation was so intolerable that I tried made an attempt 2 days ago and it made my life even worse.

I can't leave my house because my eyes look so bad. It will take weeks for them to start healing but I'm not going going to be sticking around that long. I think I've settled on doing a full hanging. It's going to hurt but there are major issues with the other methods. I wouldn't have made the attempt two days ago had I thought it wouldn't have succeeded. I would suggest on this website and the books to include odds of success with every specific method and a rundown of consequences for it failing (regardlrss I believe the ratchet method is totally bogus and probably hasn't ever been successful). I think had my eyes not been blown out I might have wimped out and went back to surpressing my ideation. I'm not rushing this I will make sure to have the proper material before trying again because failing is not an option. It sucks to be driven to commit such violence against myself but I have no other option. Our mental health care system is completely broken and I never want to go near it ever again.

I'm sorry this reply is so long but one more thing my family is aware how I feel and they are upset that I harmed myself but know forcing me to do something against my will would only make things worse.

 

[Pluto]

Knowledge itself is a dubious concept.

When I was young, Pluto was a planet and dinosaurs were extinct.

700 years ago, the sun revolved around the Earth.

 

[CatLover]

When I was at school I took media studies as one of my college subjects (used to be called A levels, not sure what now). People told me it was a waste of time and I was the subject of many ribbings for my 'useless' subject. I took lots of others too and it fit into my schedule so I didn't personally see the problem.
Fast forward a few decades and you know what, it's possibly one of the most useful things I ever studied to my actual life. We were taught how to look at something in the media - whether that is on the BBC or in the newspapers or a personal report or whatever - and check the sources and see if we could verify if it was true. We were taught about bias and agendas and how everyone will have them, even if they think they don't.
We were taught how hard it is for people to see things from someone else's point of view or to emphasize with their situation if they hadn't experienced it personally. And now I see people getting into Qanon and all sorts of other nonsense, believing that Jeremy Corbyn was a 'terrorist synthesizer' (someone actually said that exact phrase to me) and all sorts of other nonsense things. They are so easily manipulated because they don't or won't check their sources and follow a story to see if it's true or if it's coming from someone with an agenda. All news is not created equal - check where it's come from. Sometimes I think they don't even care, they have their views about immigration or whatever, and they're happy to just believe things that confirm that.
Anyway, I'm super glad I spent those two years on that, as most of the other things I studied are now just incredibly out of date or ended up being not so useful in my working or personal life. But how they laughed at the time lol
Having said that, things get away from you, and no one can know everything about everything. As humans our brains work by 'filling in the gaps' and 'making assumptions' as we literally can't process all the information we get coming in every day. It's something to be aware of but not something we can really do much about.
I think another point is since we don't know everything, we should perhaps listen to people who ARE experts in these areas that we are not. For example, I am not trans, but my best friend was (RIP) and we talked about it a lot. I am disabled and she was not. We both thought that anything that concerns trans or disabled people should listen to those people because people living outside that experience can't have any idea what it's like.

 

[Altvtysp]

Knowledge itself is a dubious concept.

When I was young, Pluto was a planet and dinosaurs were extinct.

700 years ago, the sun revolved around the Earth.

To be honest this last SA I did with far more "knowledge" or we could maybe say "shared experience" than my last one up to this point. I haven't before this attempt acrually spent a lot of time online and researched methods. Sadly even with trying to "educate myself" I still picked a fucking retarded method that cannot work. I'm going to go with full hanging and doing that properly if I still want to go through with it. Even properly done it only has a 60ish% percent rate. I don't like heights and can't get ahold of a gun. I told my former supervisor all about my SA and my previous mental "health" history and his response was to suggest jerking off together online which I was more than happy to do. At least it got my mind off of this stuff. I'm still gonna look at rope assemblies in the morning and figure out a set up that will work so if I'd like to exit quickly I can do it.

 

[makethepainstop]

I don't necessarily mean that concerning suicide. Though on suicide one should probably be very sure what one really wants, not being too ambivalent and I think a certain consistency is probably good when one makes the decision. The topic of this thread is half-knowledge. I think one should be careful when one reads about suicide. Not relying on one single person for example. Because on such a decisive question half-knowledge is dangerous.

I don't think fake news are a huge problem in this forum. (But I am not sure about it.) At least not much more than in other places on the internet. I think fake news and unverified information are part of the internet. Everyone can produce information in the past journalists were the gatekeepers. At least when we talk about the media.

I did not really relate this question to suicide. Rather on other topics like philosphy, politics, religion and other sciences. Are there competent people in this forum? Some people reallly impressed me. I have read some sophisticated and intricate thoughts on certain topics. I don't agree with everything that was expressed though. But here are some interesting individuals in this forum. And our suffering and pain kind of connects us.

I think I tend to making threads with half-knowledge. Due to the fact I make so many threads I usually don't make in-depth research. Though I would consider me somewhat competent on certain topics. At least compared to the average person. I often express my opinion instead of researching the objective truth on something. If I did only threads on issues I am an expert in I could barely make any posts at all. Though I think this applies to many people.

I think on the internet in general one should take information with a grain of salt. One should be critical and have the fact in mind that literally anyone can pretend shit online.

What is your opinion on that?

As two halves make a whole, I scan everything related to my preferred method. So I get half the info I need from one person and the other half from another. Not too surprising that no one wants to lay out a method from start to finish, and be sued by some overzealous pro-life ass, who has lost someone that came here for help.

 

[Muach]

Half, like 50%? I don't think there's 1% knowledge.
we just gather info, analyse, weigh,
Be smart,cautious, There's no guarantee.

 

[Forever Sleep]

In terms of methods, it kind of frightens me when people ask about the nitty gritty things like measurements- I really hope that they look at the megathreads too- or- a few separate sources to make sure they concur. Like I've seen SN referred to as 25mg rather than 25g. I think that one was highlighted and corrected pretty quickly though.

When it comes to philosophy and religions and life stuff, I think so much of it is ideas and perceptions. I personally love this place for being able to jot down the jumble that is in my head and see if it resonates with anyone else's. I don't think I have come across many threads that claim to be an authority on something. Most of the time I think we are just trying to flesh out our own thoughts with bits and pieces of remembered stuff here and there. Personally, I like the informality of that.

 

[chocolatebar]

this place is a mess, isn't it?

the way you put it makes me feel like you expect knowledge as in a scientific context. We're not doing science in here, although some pretend to.

we're talking to each other, sharing experiences, links and information. All this can have its flaws and require everyone to be extra careful when reading.

but isn't it all useful? Don't we, at the same time, lack a lot of knowledge but hold some important ones, that can't be easily found out there, even in scientific papers?

I find it interesting the way you call it, half-knowledge. Don't you think it's a case of popular knowledge? I think it's very similar to the way my grandmother know a lot of things I never heard anywhere, but also hold some mythical beliefs.

Not a single person on this website knows a single fucking thing about anything, myself included.

@socrates would disagree. There's one, and only one thing he knows :D

 

[Altvtysp]

I feel really mislead because I spent a lot of time researching this with posts on here, other websites and 2 of the books which suggested that the ratchet method is a legitimate way to CTB when in reality it cannot possibly work at all. I tried it on Sunday and all that happened is most of the blood vessels in my eyes busted and I've had to look like a monster since then. I would have CTB today with a method I know has a real track method but I'm going to respond to stuff on here and see my family one more night and do it tomorrow. I'm not blaming this website or anything as this misinformation was on other sites and even published in books. I think the nature of CTB is that when successful it isn't really noted except in scientific studies or if it's shocking enough on the news so many methods are suggestions/ideas without any kind of proven track record. There are several other posts on here that also report the ratchet method failed for them but I think what's important is make it clear that it cannot possibly work so others don't harm themselves like I did. If I knew it couldn't possibly work I obviously wouldn't have tried it. I would post a photo of how bad my eyes look but I'm afraid it could expose who I am or my location. Almost the entire whites of my eyes are blood red.

 

[BruhXDDDDD]

Not a single person on this website knows a single fucking thing about anything, myself included.

I genuinely think you're one of the most competent though lol
I'm not really on this website because I fully agree with it. No way in hell I'd get involved in helping someone else commit suicide regardless of whether i think it's right or not. I just like the culture of the site and get into periods of heavy suicidal ideation for a while so I can generally relate to the people. also i think i just have a massive hate boner for mainstream news sometimes so i like to see people bash it regardless of whether i actually agree with them.