Discussion Considering a Goodbye Thread (not just yet, calm down): I Want to, and Yet I'm Defensive

[Soul]

Thank you for telling us about your needs, @GoodPersonEffed.

Posting a goodbye and asking the moderators to lock it immediately would serve some purposes, but people would no doubt start parallel threads responding to your goodbye. You wouldn't have to respond to them, of course, but by the same token you wouldn't have to respond on an ordinary unlocked goodbye thread.

If you felt responses were needed, maybe having a set answer ready in your clipboard to paste as necessary ("that was a dick thing to say" appeals to me personally, but "please reread my clearly stated requests regarding this thread" might do as well). If you don't have to think about it each time maybe the dick things won't be as much of a distraction.

Since you want contact and support, maybe a "group pm" that includes just the people you want to be with you would be better than a standard goodbye. You could ask someone to post a public thread for you after you've died, since you realize closure will be helpful to us. You've left quite a footprint on this forum, and many people care about you, what's happening with you, what you're experiencing and what sense you're making of it.

I respect your ability to decide what's right for yourself, and wish you the outcomes that are best for you. I hope that's an acceptable sentiment.

@GoodPersonEffed, I go out of my way to read your posts, but don't always respond to them. That's not disinterest; just caution. You've repeatedly given me good mental exercise, which I would like to be able to reciprocate but I'm not rigorous enough. And for quite some time I've had a question I'm afraid to ask you: Who is GoodPerson without being Effed, and what is her life like?

 

[Soul]

I know I have been guilty of expressing my own sadness in people's goodbye posts, and of reassuring them that this need not be the path, or that it's okay if they back out. I realize that these well-meaning sentiments can be harmful to an individual in the midst of what could be a difficult process.

I would like to think that many of us pick up on cues in the messages that people leave — whether it's their language, or frequency of posts — there's something we observe that triggers our response. My guess is (and of course I can't be sure, but I would assume) that had I not read this thread, but read a goodbye message from you, I would get a sense of your resolve. Likewise, if someone was expressing trepidation and uncertainty, I think I might be able to pick up on that too.

I wonder how we can strike a balance. In an effort to be a supportive community, but depending only on written communication, how can we best understand each other and be there for one another? I don't think it's an easy answer. No one of us has the insight into another's soul. It's all guesswork mostly.

Sometimes our responses are shaped by what others are posting. Just yesterday I felt compelled to state that the person can back down or postpone his attempt, because of someone else pressuring him to go through with it.

Also, having been through the Big Media Brouhaha over an SN death I sometimes feel it's in the best interests of the forum if *someone* mentions that the person doesn't have to go through with it. I take it in stride if someone replies "d'oh!"

I can't really picture striking a balance with this. There are new members all the time, often taking cues from others about how to respond to goodbye threads, but the clueless will always be with us, as will those with agendas.

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

I respect your ability to decide what's right for yourself, and wish you the outcomes that are best for you. I hope that's an acceptable sentiment.

It was perfect.

 

[ebt88]

Maybe you can lock your post so no one can comment?

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

A couple of people have brought up locking the post for comments, but that negates my main purpose of getting support. Giving the community the opportunity to say goodbye is the secondary goal, notifying the community is not.

If I post a goodbye thread, it's for the interaction.

The issue is that there's going to be interaction I don't want no matter how clearly or firmly I say it I don't want it. Someone won't read it, or they'll think they have a better reason for going ahead and doing it than my reason for not doing it.

I recognize someone may feel poked by this blunt statement, but when it's boiled down, that's how it is. I've been involved in a lot of discussions about this on the forum, I've witnessed numerous threads where people have said in the intro what they don't want and why only to be overridden, and comments here only reaffirm this understanding for me. There's no value judgment on it nor condemnation, it's recognizing the reality of what I'm against and feel is against me, which is what I've been trying to weigh out since the OP -- will I get enough benefit to outweigh it?

Tell a bunch of people not to do something, and someone will inevitably (fucking) do it. We all may overloook things, and if we don't, we're still all kindergartners, just slightly more sophisticated in our defenses and excuses. I can laugh about this and not feel offended on a good day. The day I end my life with a difficult method (I'm gonna speak strongly here for emotional emphasis) IS NOT GOING TO BE A FUCKING GOOD DAY.

Seriously, at the moment I'm experiencing a symptom, either someone will comment with something beautiful that fills me up, or someone will do (what the fuck) they want to do/feel justified doing and weaken my strength at the very moment I need it. Or maybe instead of weakened I'll just laugh on the way out at the timely affirmation of why I'm exiting this fucking world.

 

[puppy9]

1+1=2 ,,,,That's what I love about you.

 

[Funkymonks]

@GoodPersonEffed
To me it comes down to one thing. Respect.
A goodbye thread is and should be completely about the individual that posts it. You are in your very last moments of life and you need support and compassion and a virtual hug.
There are many different personalities in this forum, with different interpretations regarding what should be posted in a goodbye thread, should it be info on your method, encouragement to stay or have a great time in your next life.
Personally I would not post on a thread without reading the op previous threads and try to gauge what the correct thing to say is or if anything at all is appropriate.
Do you feel that the pros outweigh the cons? I think as mentioned before either having a group pm with those whom you feel would be of most support and comfort to you.

Ultimately the choice is yours to make and whatever that may be we as a community must respect your decision.
i hope you are able to come to a decision that is acceptable for you.

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

Many have mentioned a group PM. It's not what I seek, but it's moot because that option is not available. Mods can create a group PM but members can't.

PMs are too personal for me. I've rarely PMd and prefer to do things on the open forum or not at all. It's a policy that works well for me. If I did it in a group PM, I would ask that it be kept only among those I invited, and someone could potentially share information anyway. It would require too much trust and I have met very few people in life who have the personal ethics and inner fortitude to resist not blabbing something private about someone else. Therefore anything that got out would be my own damn fault.

 

[Eachdaymakesmedumber]

I hate that dehumanizating part which people who have become hurt someway or another in their life, does to other human beings. It's disgraceful and happens everywhere here on goodbye threads. It's just human nature.

What's been done to yourself must be done to someone else - It's human thinking.

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

I hate that dehumanizating part which people who have become hurt someway or another in their life, does to other human beings. It's disgraceful and happens everywhere here on goodbye threads. It's just human nature.

What's been done to yourself must be done to someone else - It's human thinking.

This feels a bit derailing. There's no focus in the comment on the OP, and it feels provocative, which will lead to an argument and get the thread locked.

Could you please stay on topic?

Thanks.

 

[Brackenshire]

I want to say i have allways enjoyed reading your post. You make me think and consider, i appreciate that.

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

How is it derailing though? It touches what you're talking about. People commenting and being disrespectful? I'm just explaining the psychology behind it.

That psychological explanation is not at all what is happening, and people are just going to get defensive about the accusations.

You just joined today, but I've noticed your posts and you seem to go on various threads and poke at people to provoke.

I'm putting you on ignore and wish you well...far away from me. And preferably from my thread.

 

[HadEnough1974]

@GoodPersonEffed may the universe give you the strength to carry out whatever you chose, the strength to decide, the strength to keep going another day until you decide to write the final chapter of your life.

Peace

 

[Lostandfound7]

Your presence will def be missed, dear @GoodPersonEffed . Ur one of my faves...I appreciate ur candor, honesty, and compassion..

While I must admit that me recently reading ur post about possibly not writing a Goodbye thread made me feel a bit sad n cheated, lol, u must do what feels right to u..But plz (begging.lol) give us a chance to luv on u and say our "goodbyes"...♡

However, it's ur moment so do u, Boo♡♡♡..I support whatever decision u make..Nuff love♡

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

give us a chance to luv on u

You just did.

I loved it.

You're one of my faves, too.

 

[Pryras]

When I think about doing a goodbye thread, I start to feel defensive about it. So I want to talk about it and get these feelings out. Maybe gain some helpful perspective from others for having done so.

I'm rational about this consideration as well as feeling strong emotions. I am defensive, which means I'm already offended, and I'm primed for an attack and a fight. I'm trying to honor what I feel but also not attack or harm, so with two exceptions at the end, parentheses are me giving my emotions some space to take part in this discussion without taking charge.

If someone sees something of themselves in the following and takes offense and wants to defend in return, perhaps they will note that I am rejecting things that deeply trouble me for good (fucking) reason. Perhaps they think they act out of good reason and that I am wrong. These things are serious enough to me that I am defensive and considering not doing something that would serve my wants and needs because of what I deeply oppose and reject, and what I would feel is an assault, much like the person who has an aversion to touch and rejects hugs; they're not rejecting the person hugging, they're rejecting an action they experience as harmful, no matter the intentions. Sometimes people try to force hugs on them anyway. There's no way to stop them, and that's part of my frustration and defensiveness, especially at the very last moments of my life. It's just not about the hugger or their desired connection anymore, the time for that is done, it's about something else now.

Doing a goodbye thread is attractive because in my last moments I would feel appreciated by those who genuinely appreciate me, valued, cared about, supported, and not alone in my final moments, which will be difficult ones. It would serve my courage, and I'm going to need it; I am courageous, I can do it alone, but it would be so much better if I got what I seek to bolster that, and I would lay out what I seek and what I don't want. However, I feel like in posting a thread that I'd have to simultaneoulsy walk through a minefield and get hit by shrapnel to obtain all of the benefits I seek.

I am defensive about people talking about promises of or hopes for an afterlife they believe in or desire to be true. I mindfully rejected such things in real life, and in response to these types of comments, I would be experiencing more defensive rejection of such things when I need to be calm, focused on the chosen action, and accepting of what I'm choosing to do. I may possibly hope for the same things as well, but they would not be the focus and so would be a distraction. The only hopes I have for my suicide are to not be interrupted, to pass as gently and quickly as possible, and for my choice to come to pass and be done with this life. Additional hopes would be the benefits I listed for doing a goodbye thread. I don't know if the benefits are worth walking through the minefield of what I don't want.

I am defensive about people telling me I can wait, or I can change my mind. I already know that. The reactive part of me says, "Duh-uh!" but it's an asshole thing to say that would negate another when they're (probably) not intentionally doing harm (unless they're an overt or covert troll); it would be negating when experiencing negation. Rationally speaking, I'm not arriving at this decision with anything but full awareness, and each time I attempt, I already have this. Telling me I can wait or change my mind would be a huge distraction from moving forward toward accomplishing my unfortunate but rational goal. Some members perhaps aren't making the wisest choice and such distractions may serve them. I, however, am making the wisest choice for myself, and I want that respected and honored. But I can't make anyone do what I want, and I don't yet know how to brush it off if they don't. Hence, I'm defensive. I've been on the forum long enough that people generally know I've already got this figured out, but someone newer, or someone compelled to, may make these suggestions I find distracting and (grrrr! fucking) irritating.

Really, all of these things I'm defensive about are things I don't know how to brush off, to just ignore and move on, or to be magnanimous about and give a hug react for. I just don't have that last one in me, to reward and soothe another for doing something I specifically say to not (fucking) do. The goodbye thread would be about rewarding and comforting me. If someone couldn't do that, I'd want them to not do anything at all. But people generally don't do nothing at all for the good of another.

I am defensive about people trying to talk me out of it, as someone generally does on goodbye threads. I can lay out all my reasons, I can lay out rules for what I accept on the thread, and still someone will potentially say, "I respect what you said, but..." and that "but" indicates they may feel respect but they're not acting on it, instead they act on their own desire for that person and their action. I dislike this term, but I consider it virtue signaling in this kind of situation; but virtue signaling is, to me, a judgmental and negating term and I'm leaning on it because it helps me feel more right and justified, so I own that. However, I haven't even done a goodbye thread, I'm only considering it, and yet I'm already defensive, I already want to say, "If you can't make it about me and what I want, then shut (the fuck) up. I'm also doing this for closure because this is a community, it's not just about me, so say goodbye, and either offer what I want or don't offer it, or kindly stay (the fuck) out of it." And people naturally resist that. They want to be and to feel active. They want to give something, even if it's been strictly prohibited, because they are not capable of giving what is specifically asked for, either because it goes against their personal values, their personal wishes, or their personal convenience (if you doubt this pronouncement, I challenge you to test it within yourself; what other reason is there for overriding someone's specifically stated wishes, as some folks override a will?). I've done this kind of overriding myself so many times in life, had it done to me, and witnessed it being done to others that I feel confident in saying: they feel compelled to interact and to give and feel good, when the greatest gift would be for them to disengage from the person and the event, to make the effort to restrain. People don't recognize how active self-restraint is, thought it goes unrecognized by the other. Part of me wants to say in the rules for the thread, "If you do other than what's in the rules, it's a selfish move." More emotionally, and irrationally, I want to say, ("It's a dick move"). But of course either statement will be perceived by some as throwing down a gauntlet, and that just breeds resentment and motivates retaliation, whether imagining retaliation or actually doing it. It's negativity that gives rise to negativity. And of course, people hear a call to give something, and when they can't or won't give that, they give something else to feel they are not ineffective and to show they care. I just don't (freaking) want what they give (!). (Aaaargh!!!!!) So I'm experiencing a triple-bind: I have to be careful about how I state my boundary so as not to invite attack; stating it naturally invites it negation and attack; and if I don't state it, I'm going to receive what I don't (fucking) want and I (argh!) don't know how to let ping off me and ignore.

Finally, I'm defensive about posting a goodbye thread because, for some, it's entertainment. It's a public forum, and I'm certain there are people who watch the forum like it's a non-graphic, real-time soap opera version of bestgore, and they feed off of the drama and emotions of the moment. There are also members who are here for no other reason than to vampire off others' emotions and needs and traumas, so even if the forum were private, it's still sick entertainment for some, and I'm resistant to feeding that. I would have to make a concession to get my wants and needs met while knowing that my pain, my bravery in moving forward out of unconquerable toxicity, and others' responses are, to some, like nectar. If it were true nectar, they would be satisfied and enriched and (full-)filled, not keep coming back to feed off of and shit out genuine human connection and compassion that arise in repsonse to genuine human need. Their actions are fueled by greed, hatred and delusion, which are never satisfied. And I'm not going to feed them with any more parentheses then the little one they got.

So yeah, I'm a little defensive.



Summary

Reasons for wanting to do a goodbye thread (benefits):

1. Feel appreciated by those who genuinely appreciate me
2. Feel valued
3. Feel cared about
4. Feel supported, comforted, and not alone in my difficult final moments
5. Courage from feeling supported and not alone as I act on my choice
6. Closure for the community as well as for myself, giving people a chance to say goodbye


What I'm offended and/or defensive about that caution me against doing a goodbye thread since I cannot control them (shrapnel):

1. Comments about a promised or hoped-for afterlife
2. Comments that I can wait or change my mind
3. Comments trying to talk me out of acting on my choice
4. My goodbye thread and suicide being entertainment

I've considered making one for myself too when the time was right but hesitated for some of the same reasons you listed above.

I can tell you it will be very hard for me to avoid persuading you to stay but I will respect your boundaries and keep myself from doing that. Your answers over the past several months have helped me in ways I can't really communicate online. Things are hard over here but I always calm down and rationalize my thoughts when I'm talking with you. You remind me that I'm more evolved than those who hurt me and powerful. I resonate with you a lot and can relate to many of your feelings.

I respect whatever decision you make knowing it's coming from a well thought out place and won't persuade you to stay (despite wanting to) I will always remember you.

And personally, while the cons can be irrating I think the pros overweigh them. Placing focus on the members sending genuine goodbyes and feeling supported during your final moments outweighs the cons imo.

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

I've considered making one for myself too when the time was right but hesitated for some of the same reasons you listed above.

I can tell you it will be very hard for me to avoid persuading you to stay but I will respect your boundaries and keep myself from doing that. Your answers over the past several months have helped me in ways I can't really communicate online. Things are hard over here but I always calm down and rationalize my thoughts when I'm talking with you. You remind me that I'm more evolved than those who hurt me and powerful. I resonate with you a lot and can relate to many of your feelings.

I respect whatever decision you make knowing it's coming from a well thought out place and won't persuade you to stay (despite wanting to) I will always remember you.

And personally, while the cons can be irrating I think the pros overweigh them. Placing focus on the members sending genuine goodbyes and feeling supported during your final moments outweighs the cons imo.

I loved every word of this. Thank you.

Thank you for sharing that you've had similar concerns.

I agree that the positives will likely outweigh the negatives. It's just such a sensitive moment, I'll need to be conscious of what I am and am not capable of managing and make the best decision for myself that I can. I'll be showing up to the arena, and there will be people in the cheap seats, but maybe I can use the analogy of inviting who I want to show up for me and integrate some of the advice here -- I can either PM certain people in advance, or tag them in the post so that they can show up if they want to. Every time I've shown up to the arena on this forum and vulnerably shared something that troubles me or asked for help, I've received great reward.

Your comment reaffirms, as have so many posts on this thread, my goal that as long as I'm still alive, to keep growing and learning, and to try to have a positive impact on others. It is already personally rewarding to do this, but even more so when it resonates for someone and brings them value. The appreciation more quickly replenishes the resources I expend.

I'm grateful you'll remember me. Even more importantly, though, I hope you'll remember and integrate whatever serves you. It all came from my heart, but originated with many teachers. Even if you one day don't remember me, if you are better for having known me, then it is a great validation, such a gift, and I am grateful to have had a positive impact on someone or something in the world.

 

[lonelyhouse]

Every single time I see your name as someone who has created a thread or commented on one, I get excited because I know I'm about to read some wisdom. I have always appreciated your insights and candor, and I felt like you needed to know that you're one of my favorite people on this forum, even though we've never directly spoken.

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

Every single time I see your name as someone who has created a thread or commented on one, I get excited because I know I'm about to read some wisdom. I have always appreciated your insights and candor, and I felt like you needed to know that you're one of my favorite people on this forum, even though we've never directly spoken.

THANK YOU!!!!!!

Your relationship thread was one of my favorites since I've been on the forum, both the OP and the discussion. I just referred someone to it on another thread asking about relationships as a reason to ctb. I consider it a valuable resource.

Also, this is my all-time favorite comment on the forum:

Thanks for coming to my TedTalk.

 

[HadEnough1974]

I loved every word of this. Thank you.

Thank you for sharing that you've had similar concerns.

I agree that the positives will likely outweigh the negatives. It's just such a sensitive moment, I'll need to be conscious of what I am and am not capable of managing and make the best decision for myself that I can. I'll be showing up to the arena, and there will be people in the cheap seats, but maybe I can use the analogy of inviting who I want to show up for me and integrate some of the advice here -- I can either PM certain people in advance, or tag them in the post so that they can show up if they want to. Every time I've shown up to the arena on this forum and vulnerably shared something that troubles me or asked for help, I've received great reward.

Your comment reaffirms, as have so many posts on this thread, my goal that as long as I'm still alive, to keep growing and learning, and to try to have a positive impact on others. It is already personally rewarding to do this, but even more so when it resonates for someone and brings them value. The appreciation more quickly replenishes the resources I expend.

I'm grateful you'll remember me. Even more importantly, though, I hope you'll remember and integrate whatever serves you. It all came from my heart, but originated with many teachers. Even if you one day don't remember me, if you are better for having known me, then is a great validation, such a gift, and I am grateful to have had a positive impact on someone or something in the world.

You've had this impact on allot of people and I did not want to say it to respect your boundaries but I too feel that your presence here is so important and would it be selfish of me to ask you to stay, fight longer, keep helping people.

You are loved by so many here. Please remember this, when you have dark moments. That you are valued and you have had a positive impact on so many people.

At the end, it's your choice, we will all respect that. But you are already loved and valued, at least here on Ss.

And don't forget, there are so many non registered users who are also reading your posts who don't have the courage yet to create an account. They too are inspired by you.

I can't articulate myself as well as you do, I don't have the energy, so I resort to humour to get my point across. I don't know how you find the energy to write with such compassion and empathy.

If you need to be reminded that you're loved and valued I'll send you a daily message "you're loved and valued".

We all carry a wounded inner child, especially those who have been abused and it's easy to forget that we are valued, loved and appreciated.

Peace

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

@Zappfe lover, @FriendofDeath, @Soul and @Brackenshire, I recognize I didn't respond to each of you individually as I have others here to say thank you for your kind and thoughtful words. I want you to know I read them and felt them deeply and appreciate you sharing with me what you value and/or would miss. From my heart, thank you.

You've had this impact on allot of people and I did not want to say it to respect your boundaries but I too feel that your presence here is so important and would it be selfish of me to ask you to stay, fight longer, keep helping people.

You are loved by so many here. Please remember this, when you have dark moments. That you are valued and you have had a positive impact on so many people.

At the end, it's your choice, we will all respect that. But you are already loved and valued, at least here on Ss.

And don't forget, there are so many non registered users who are also reading your posts who don't have the courage yet to create an account. They too are inspired by you.

I can't articulate myself as well as you do, I don't have the energy, so I resort to humour to get my point across. I don't know how you find the energy to write with such compassion and empathy.

If you need to be reminded that you're loved and valued I'll send you a daily message "you're loved and valued".

We all carry a wounded inner child, especially those who have been abused and it's easy to forget that we are valued, loved and appreciated.

Peace

Haha, no, you don't have to send me a daily message! But thank you for the reminder. I can always return to this thread whenever I need it. It has indeed brought light in the darkeness I am experiencing, and lifted some of the weight of it.

I said early on in my membership that I take comfort in knowing that the world will not be a better place for me not being in it. It's that I will be better without the world.

I don't talk about my reasons for suicide, but it is not a matter of self-destruction, rather one of self-preservation, of survival. I don't talk about my reasons because I don't need support for them, I know what they are and I know what I'm dealing with. If I share them, people will view them through their own lenses and have opinions and suggestions that will not serve me. So I keep them private and it is a wise decision to do so. It is enough to say that, as strong and as imperfectly but genuinely good as I am, there are things that are stronger and genuinely bad out of proportion to anything I could ever imagine; I am one human and don't have the capacity to effectively defend myself let alone defeat them.

Montaigne cautioned against the virtue of bravery becoming vice when one could reasonably stand against two cannons but not thirty, to know when one simply cannot defend what one wants to and what peril one faces for trying to do so, and to recognize when it is folly to commit to such a defense.

I've already reached the point that I recognize the folly, and already tried peaceful methods. Now I have to deal with the only sure method I have access to which will not be peaceful and will cause suffering, so for a time what I am experiencing is not worse than facing that particular death, but it is inevitable that it will be. In the meantime, continuing to learn and grow and have a positive impact on others gives me capability and strength for managing the impossible, and the comments of love, appreciation and valuing me that I've gotten here and elsewhere replenish my resources. I am deeply grateful. I wasn't surprised that people showed me these things, but how much and in ways that I value -- not merely pumping me up or love-bombing, but the most lovely constructive criticism that reflects I do what I set out to do. I coudn't be more pleased.

It is not enough, though, to keep me going indefinitely, as that, too would be folly and turn to vice, because I would be sacrificing myself for others' well-being and be a martyr, but for no world-changing purpose, and therefore a fool in a beautiful but self-destructive illusion. I would have no resources left for myself. The balance has not yet tipped in that direction, but I will know when it does. Perhaps I could keep going indefinitely, but I am suffering every day and night. The cruelty and depravity of what has power over this world is offensive to my spirit and constantly threatens to overwhelm me, and at times it has. I really don't want to go through it again and again. I would like to exit peacefully and rationally rather than running from the burning building when the flames are too close and I can smell myself already starting to burn.

In the meantime, I could liken it to being in a concentration camp, being the person who gives compassionate, rational, and sometimes humorous support to my fellow sufferers, including the guards who are also imprisoned and suffering, to uplift and bring some good and light in the dark environment of evil intentions and acts. When I at last escape, I know I will be missed -- not by all, but by some -- by those who genuinely appreciate and will miss me, and can also be glad for me that I am at last free and wish me well. This is the beauty in spite of the inhumane shit. Would that it overcomes the evil, not to conquer and destroy it, which would be to become it, but to teach it and show it and bring forth the good that its own pain, greed, and ignorance hide and suppress. It would take so much love and so much patience, more than I individually possess, as well as a longer than human lifespan. It is folly and delusion to imagine that I do possess enough, but utterly true that I wish I did. I have done and still do what I can, and then I will disengage from the fight, knowing I battled well and was worthy of winning even if I did not.

 

[LetzteAusfahrt]

I will open a goodbye thread because I want to give everyone the opportunity to say goodbye to me who wants it.

I don't mind posts that cheer me on or hold me back. Or wish me a nice life afterwards.

What I do is my own decision and I don't let myself be influenced by it. And I know very well that there will be nothing after that. I'm really looking forward to this nothing.

But I also have to admit that it is very hard to digest if someone says goodbye here and I am "live", so to speak. As nice as it is to be allowed to accompany this person.

 

[HadEnough1974]

@Zappfe lover, @FriendofDeath, @Soul and @Brackenshire, I recognize I didn't respond to each of you individually as I have others here to say thank you for your kind and thoughtful words. I want you to know I read them and felt them deeply and appreciate you sharing with me what you value and/or would miss. From my heart, thank you.



Haha, no, you don't have to send me a daily message! But thank you for the reminder. I can always return to this thread whenever I need it. It has indeed brought light in the darkeness I am experiencing, and lifted some of the weight of it.

I said early on in my membership that I take comfort in knowing that the world will not be a better place for me not being in it. It's that I will be better without the world.

I don't talk about my reasons for suicide, but it is not a matter of self-destruction, rather one of self-preservation, of survival. I don't talk about my reasons because I don't need support for them, I know what they are and I know what I'm dealing with. If I share them, people will view them through their own lenses and have opinions and suggestions that will not serve me. So I keep them private and it is a wise decision to do so. It is enough to say that, as strong and as imperfectly but genuinely good as I am, there are things that are stronger and genuinely bad out of proportion to anything I could ever imagine; I am one human and don't have the capacity to effectively defend myself let alone defeat them.

Montaigne cautioned against the virtue of bravery becoming vice when one could reasonably stand against two cannons but not thirty, to know when one simply cannot defend what one wants to and what peril one faces for trying to do so, and to recognize when it is folly to commit to such a defense.

I've already reached the point that I recognize the folly, and already tried peaceful methods. Now I have to deal with the only sure method I have access to which will not be peaceful and will cause suffering, so for a time what I am experiencing is not worse than facing that particular death, but it is inevitable that it will be. In the meantime, continuing to learn and grow and have a positive impact on others gives me capability and strength for managing the impossible, and the comments of love, appreciation and valuing me that I've gotten here and elsewhere replenish my resources. I am deeply grateful. I wasn't surprised that people showed me these things, but how much and in ways that I value -- not merely pumping me up or love-bombing, but the most lovely constructive criticism that reflects I do what I set out to do. I coudn't be more pleased.

It is not enough, though, to keep me going indefinitely, as that, too would be folly and turn to vice, because I would be sacrificing myself for others' well-being and be a martyr, but for no world-changing purpose, and therefore a fool in a beautiful but self-destructive illusion. I would have no resources left for myself. The balance has not yet tipped in that direction, but I will know when it does. Perhaps I could keep going indefinitely, but I am suffering every day and night. The cruelty and depravity of what has power over this world is offensive to my spirit and constantly threatens to overwhelm me, and at times it has. I really don't want to go through it again and again. I would like to exit peacefully and rationally rather than running from the burning building when the flames are too close and I can smell myself already starting to burn.

In the meantime, I could liken it to being in a concentration camp, being the person who gives compassionate, rational, and sometimes humorous support to my fellow sufferers, including the guards who are also imprisoned and suffering, to uplift and bring some good and light in the dark environment of evil intentions and acts. When I at last escape, I know I will be missed -- not by all, but by some -- by those who genuinely appreciate and will miss me, and can also be glad for me that I am at last free and wish me well. This is the beauty in spite of the inhumane shit. Would that it overcomes the evil, not to conquer and destroy it, which would be to become it, but to teach it and show it and bring forth the good that its own pain, greed, and ignorance hide and suppress. It would take so much love and so much patience, more than I individually possess, as well as a longer than human lifespan. It is folly and delusion to imagine that I do possess enough, but utterly true that I wish I did. I have done and still do what I can, and then I will disengage from the fight, knowing I battled well and was worthy of winning even if I did not.

I read your response, and there is so much there. I will need to reread a few more times. It also made me reflect upon my own battle. Before I exit, there is one last thing I need to do. It must be done.