Anyone else feel they will be enacting a "rational" suicide, no involuntary thoughts and emotions? Do you feel guilty for feeling this way?

[BeautifulMosaics]

And I do not feel this is a superior form I want to make clear.

It's just that all over the news, you see from depressed people and in suicide notes: "The thoughts in my head constantly telling me I'm worthless and I should do it".
For me, I have never experienced this.

What I have experienced is pure apathy and being barred from meds that may help me and basically feeling that because of this apathy having no solution and my previous trying and holding on hope never getting anywhere, that I have had the life sucked out of me and that nothing will ever change. That life is not for me. I have a plethora of other issues as well of course.. But basically I don't have the energy to live life and not even the interest I don't think. Those are my feelings but the decison to possibly commit suicide is very well my own thought and this is a decision that I have "logically" arrived at. I have added up all my issues that seem like a mountain to beat and control for the rest of a life that I do not even have the energy or interest for and decided I am better off dead than suffering.

I feel guilty for having a "rational" suicide wish as opposed to an involuntary thought imposed upon me - because "suicide is bad" so by deciding this myself as opposed to having these thoughts and emotions imposed upon me I have chosen something so horrific and bad when my issues aren't enough?

People with chronic illnesses and physical pain they cannot escape I am not talking about of course because that is something that is imposed upon you and makes life unbearable - but then surely my apathy and the way my brain works is something that has been imposed upon me? (Although it certainly cannot be compared to the pain from a chronic illness).

Anyone relate?

**

I also think a part of this is the media and society presenting suicidal people as irrational and insane, because there's no way a "healthy" person, especially young, could want to kill themselves without being insane or under the influence of the boogeyman's thoughts. There's no way you could simply decide that life isn't worth it because - what!?

 

[FuneralCry]

Yes, I can relate. I have come to the conclusion that my life is not worth living. Life does not appeal to me in any way and I am not meant for this world. It is a perfectly rational decision, it is the only thing that makes sense to me. I am not 'mentally unwell' It is not an involuntary thought. It is what I want. I feel like suicidal thoughts are a part of me and they have been since I was very young. I see life as a pointless, tedious thing and I just dislike it and that is the way things are.

The way I see it, I do not feel guilty, as we have the right to take our lives at any time of our choosing. We have no obligations to stay alive as we did not ask to exist in the first place.

 

[clown_17]

I've been on both sides. There was a time where I felt bad about myself and the world for no reason and that was a big driving force of my suicidality. I even knew I wasn't right, it was like those thoughts were invading my own. So yeah, irrational suicide do exist IMO. Although I've been on the other side, where the decision was well thought through and I had no realistic way of getting to a better situation. And the suicidality wasn't driven by my emotions but by planning how to get out of this and realizing there is no option that won't cause you pain.

I really hate the way suicide is always seen as irrational. It makes it seem like the mentally ill aren't able to make choices for ourselves. Pain is pain, we shouldn't be forced to live because it isn't the "right" pain.

 

[suisuiforum]

I completely understand what you mean by a "rational suicide," because that is why I want to CTB as well. Societal conceptualizations of depression (especially among normies and pro-lifers) depict someone who has immensely low self-esteem and believes that the world would be better off without their presence. However, I would rank my perceptions of myself as relatively neutral, which is more positive than many people with mental illnesses, and I'm not trying to die to fulfill other people's desires. Instead, I've come to the conclusion that life is inherently meaningless, and if I am experiencing more hardships than pleasure (even if not by a wide margin), it makes no sense to continue powering through this sunk-cost nightmare. Mainstream society cannot understand this line of thinking very well, because there is an inherent widespread prioritization for life passed down through genetics and the collective consciousness.

I don't feel guilty about any of this, because euthanasia should be granted for people who really want it. There will be no end to the comparisons, because there is always someone else with a worse plight; we are still entitled to choose what we want to do with our lives (or deaths in this case) as our birthright regardless of the level of suffering we endure.

 

[Fadeawaaaay]

And I do not feel this is a superior form I want to make clear.

It's just that all over the news, you see from depressed people and in suicide notes: "The thoughts in my head constantly telling me I'm worthless and I should do it".
For me, I have never experienced this.

What I have experienced is pure apathy and being barred from meds that may help me and basically feeling that because of this apathy having no solution and my previous trying and holding on hope never getting anywhere, that I have had the life sucked out of me and that nothing will ever change. That life is not for me. I have a plethora of other issues as well of course.. But basically I don't have the energy to live life and not even the interest I don't think. Those are my feelings but the decison to possibly commit suicide is very well my own thought and this is a decision that I have "logically" arrived at. I have added up all my issues that seem like a mountain to beat and control for the rest of a life that I do not even have the energy or interest for and decided I am better off dead than suffering.

I feel guilty for having a "rational" suicide wish as opposed to an involuntary thought imposed upon me - because "suicide is bad" so by deciding this myself as opposed to having these thoughts and emotions imposed upon me I have chosen something so horrific and bad when my issues aren't enough?

People with chronic illnesses and physical pain they cannot escape I am not talking about of course because that is something that is imposed upon you and makes life unbearable - but then surely my apathy and the way my brain works is something that has been imposed upon me? (Although it certainly cannot be compared to the pain from a chronic illness).

Anyone relate?

**

I also think a part of this is the media and society presenting suicidal people as irrational and insane, because there's no way a "healthy" person, especially young, could want to kill themselves without being insane or under the influence of the boogeyman's thoughts. There's no way you could simply decide that life isn't worth it because - what!?

This is a very wise observation. Previous to six months ago suicide had never ever crossed my mind. And so, like most people, I thought of suicide as some thing that people dead in a state of extreme anguish, mental confusion, madness. But as you have said, the decision can really be calm and rational. An assessment of one's current condition and future prospects. For me I have taken a huge step backwards in my circumstances. The love of my life having left me. And my financial situation cut off at the knees. And so what is there to live for? In someways I wish I was "crazy ". Then I would have a better excuse. Then I might be driven by my demons to end things more quickly. Instead, I'm just trying things out. Experiencing this Excruciating deprivation, Self-loathing, and extreme boredom.

 

[Gustav Hartmann]

I wonder whether a rational suicide is possible. You can assess the pros and cons in a decision matrix, what I often did, but in the end suicide is in the realm of opposing emotions and instincts.

It depends on your cultural background if you feel guilt in connection with suicide. For example: If you think that you are a burden to society, you would feel guilty if don´t commit suicide.

 

[Fadeawaaaay]

I wonder whether a rational suicide is possible. You can assess the pros and cons in a decision matrix, what I often did, but in the end suicide is in the realm of opposing emotions and instincts.

It depends on your cultural background if you feel guilt in connection with suicide. For example: If you think that you are a burden to society, you would feel guilty if don´t commit suicide.

Exactly. Last night for example a good friend took me out to dinner and a movie. She paid for me. That was very pleasurable on one level but incredibly emasculating on another… An ongoing reminder of my failure. Is that a way of life that I want to have moving forward for the next four decades? It's not even possible it's not even conceivable. So as much as I love life itself.… I refuse to live my life as a burden on other people as a subject of pity and charity… Every moment is an excruciating reminder of my own failure to take advantage of the incredible opportunities that were given to me…

 

[Smart No More]

I think a rational suicide should be the only suicide. If its irrational then maybe it should be occurring.

Even in the throws of extreme distress and dramatic experiences a person can make a rarional decision. Not everybody manages this but it would be naive and incorrect to assume otherwise just because it's hard to fathom.

If a condition is causing your quality of life to be so imbearable that you only exist in suffering and there is no solution, then logically your life is no longer a life aside from in technical sense of it consisting of electeical signals surging back and forth in a biological organism.

There is nothing more rational than ending that life as peacefully as possible as your body/biological organism no longer service it's function and there is no reprieve from the resulting torment.

However, if there is a way to fix things then I feel we owe it to ourselves and the gift of life we were gifted to at least take that chance and try. Only after exhausting our options can we then proclaim our decision to ctb a logical decision.

It seems so obvious that if this isn't how one thinks then maybe there is some irrationality involved and on need of addressing.

I suspect there are maybe two states which allow a person to overcome SI and ctb. The rational state and the extreme state of irrationality. It's perseved somewhat paradoxically in many peoples eye which is probably at least partially why there is such taboo around it. It's a little too obvious to comprehend when it's such a definite and final act.

Much like the concept/reality of infinte space is impossible to comprehend so is the concept of ending it in our perception. And obviously where religious theories are born.

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

My suicide would absolutely be rational. I don't see myself as worthless, I'm even lower than that. My death will definitely be a net positive for the world as a whole no matter who cries about it or how sad anyone gets. Removing myself from existence is genuinely the most noble thing I can do for everyone.

 

[artificial_ineptness]

I do strive towards a rational suicide (and I feel that most people on SS do), although I also have that innate drive towards it that I cannot explain / that is not something rationally considered. My issue is that I cannot seem to reason about CTB rigorously enough, and I am not sure if it's even possible (for me anyway), which is frustrating and essentially takes away from the whole "rational" part.

Feeling guilty about it sounds like maybe you don't consider other people enough in your "ethical calculations" or that your values clash with those of the society, because I think that's what guilt is mostly about - the values of the society you grew up in.

P.S. apathy sucks ass, sorry that you have to deal with it.

 

[hopelessgirl]

And I do not feel this is a superior form I want to make clear.

It's just that all over the news, you see from depressed people and in suicide notes: "The thoughts in my head constantly telling me I'm worthless and I should do it".
For me, I have never experienced this.

What I have experienced is pure apathy and being barred from meds that may help me and basically feeling that because of this apathy having no solution and my previous trying and holding on hope never getting anywhere, that I have had the life sucked out of me and that nothing will ever change. That life is not for me. I have a plethora of other issues as well of course.. But basically I don't have the energy to live life and not even the interest I don't think. Those are my feelings but the decison to possibly commit suicide is very well my own thought and this is a decision that I have "logically" arrived at. I have added up all my issues that seem like a mountain to beat and control for the rest of a life that I do not even have the energy or interest for and decided I am better off dead than suffering.

I feel guilty for having a "rational" suicide wish as opposed to an involuntary thought imposed upon me - because "suicide is bad" so by deciding this myself as opposed to having these thoughts and emotions imposed upon me I have chosen something so horrific and bad when my issues aren't enough?

People with chronic illnesses and physical pain they cannot escape I am not talking about of course because that is something that is imposed upon you and makes life unbearable - but then surely my apathy and the way my brain works is something that has been imposed upon me? (Although it certainly cannot be compared to the pain from a chronic illness).

Anyone relate?

**

I also think a part of this is the media and society presenting suicidal people as irrational and insane, because there's no way a "healthy" person, especially young, could want to kill themselves without being insane or under the influence of the boogeyman's thoughts. There's no way you could simply decide that life isn't worth it because - what!?

This is exactly what I feel like actually. I do do not believe I'm unworthy and all that bullshit. I'm just done with life :-) like it is logic for me to go to bed at the end of the day, I would now like to go to bed for ever ;-)