Venting Why would anyone want to live in this world?

[Ryan.s]

I want to see if people feel the same way.... We were born into this world. This world, this universe that suddenly appeared. We did not ask to be born we did not control our birth. We have to live in this world. It doesn't matter if you live paycheck to paycheck or you live in a mansion with more money in the bank than you know what to do with. Anyone can be depressed. Anyone can hurt. And no matter your hierarchy in this society you have to live in this horrible world. This world where children are molested everyday, the world where innocent people are tortured and abused for all different sorts of reasons, the world where children starve to death everyday ,the world where humans hurt each other constantly, when the reality is that your fellow human is all that you have got. No matter who you are you will suffer in this world. Every human suffers. This begs the question, what is the meaning of life? As sad as it seems, it may just be to be born, eat, and die. This is a sad world and a sad universe. Suicide seems like a way out. Like a relief. It is a way to escape this thing we call life. A door that takes us away from the heart break. Suicide means no more tears, no more hurt, no more sorrow. Suicide is the gateway to our heaven. Away from this world in which we don't want to live in.

 

[UnluckyFew]

I too fail to see the appeal of this existence. I think the idea of some sort of utopia is delusional. I think it's going to be a shitshow until the Ponzi scheme goes bust.

 

[Walilamdzi]

I can totally see where you're coming from! But think you meant tortured not tutored :)

 

[Ryan.s]

I can totally see where you're coming from! But think you meant tortured not tutored :)

Thanks for the correction mate!

 

[porfin1234]

I think there are many reasons to want to live in this world. Not to gloss over the hardships of life, and suffering many endure, but there is much beauty and joy and growth to experience as well. Sometimes it's the simplest of things. Art, experiencing different cultures and meeting people even if they come and go or are brief moments of connection, sharing a meal with loved ones, exploring modes of thinking, books, music, nature, laughter.. etc..

 

[Mr2005]

I want to see if people feel the same way.... We were born into this world. This world, this universe that suddenly appeared. We did not ask to be born we did not control our birth. We have to live in this world. It doesn't matter if you live paycheck to paycheck or you live in a mansion with more money in the bank than you know what to do with. Anyone can be depressed. Anyone can hurt. And no matter your hierarchy in this society you have to live in this horrible world. This world where children are molested everyday, the world where innocent people are tortured and abused for all different sorts of reasons, the world where children starve to death everyday ,the world where humans hurt each other constantly, when the reality is that your fellow human is all that you have got. No matter who you are you will suffer in this world. Every human suffers. This begs the question, what is the meaning of life? As sad as it seems, it may just be to be born, eat, and die. This is a sad world and a sad universe. Suicide seems like a way out. Like a relief. It is a way to escape this thing we call life. A door that takes us away from the heart break. Suicide means no more tears, no more hurt, no more sorrow. Suicide is the gateway to our heaven. Away from this world in which we don't want to live in.

Ask people what their reasons are. It's not that. They're all very personal and very different. That's all things we should care about and it might do us a favour if we did.

 

[Mistake of Nature]

I think each individual needs to create meaning for their life. It's the only way to trudge through each day and endure the suffering inherent in existing. You have to find some way to give your life purpose if you want a chance at being mentally healthy.

This is my problem and a major reason why I want to CTB. My past, current, and future suffering far outweighs the joy in my life, and I can't find anything that will make this pain worth it in the end.

 

[Bct]

Some people may see what they enjoy still outweigh their suffering, or at least having some hope that their life will get better.

 

[WOODESITY]

Right now I'm trying to somehow overcome fear of death and letting go of life, reason i think it's very hard to do so is that we've been brainwashed and told our lifetime by almost everyone that it is immoral to leave life and many use toos and words to make one think that life is worth living, that suffering is worth, that's why Many immoral people say that to find your purpose, enjoy life (suffering) and if you leave you'll cause me and those around suffering, so honestly fuck those people, life has no fuckng purpose, i think we don't even have instincts at all, and our thinking and actions are defined by the lifelong brainwashing and society around us, nature doesn't care or think about anyone, there is no god, god is made up bullshit to control masses, to put fear in people, fear of non existence, death is seen as bad and sad when in fact it's only solution to end suffering.

Even here, only place i come to just find some many useful information for me, i come across people, who thinks that life can be beautiful and good, it's all just delusional thinking

 

[pthnrdnojvsc]

I want to see if people feel the same way.... We were born into this world. This world, this universe that suddenly appeared. We did not ask to be born we did not control our birth. We have to live in this world. It doesn't matter if you live paycheck to paycheck or you live in a mansion with more money in the bank than you know what to do with. Anyone can be depressed. Anyone can hurt. And no matter your hierarchy in this society you have to live in this horrible world. This world where children are molested everyday, the world where innocent people are tortured and abused for all different sorts of reasons, the world where children starve to death everyday ,the world where humans hurt each other constantly, when the reality is that your fellow human is all that you have got. No matter who you are you will suffer in this world. Every human suffers. This begs the question, what is the meaning of life? As sad as it seems, it may just be to be born, eat, and die. This is a sad world and a sad universe. Suicide seems like a way out. Like a relief. It is a way to escape this thing we call life. A door that takes us away from the heart break. Suicide means no more tears, no more hurt, no more sorrow. Suicide is the gateway to our heaven. Away from this world in which we don't want to live in.

Right now I'm trying to somehow overcome fear of death and letting go of life, reason i think it's very hard to do so is that we've been brainwashed and told our lifetime by almost everyone that it is immoral to leave life and many use toos and words to make one think that life is worth living, that suffering is worth, that's why Many immoral people say that to find your purpose, enjoy life (suffering) and if you leave you'll cause me and those around suffering, so honestly fuck those people, life has no fuckng purpose, i think we don't even have instincts at all, and our thinking and actions are defined by the lifelong brainwashing and society around us, nature doesn't care or think about anyone, there is no god, god is made up bullshit to control masses, to put fear in people, fear of non existence, death is seen as bad and sad when in fact it's only solution to end suffering.

Even here, only place i come to just find some many useful information for me, i come across people, who thinks that life can be beautiful and good, it's all just delusional thinking

I arrived at the exact same conclusions both of you on this thread did @Ryan.s and @WOODESITY .

Some facts that are made taboo that no one knows or talks about .

If life were so wonderfull why do around 1 million people in the world commit suicide annually?

How many suicides happen each day on Earth?

Answer (1 of 2): According to WHO(world health organisation), approximately one million people commit suicide each year worldwide, that is about one death every 40 seconds or 3,000 per day. For each individual who takes his/her own life, at least 20 attempt to do so. Some stats related to it ar...

www.quora.com

The last few weeks of most people's lives are extremely painful and scary. And these are natural deaths as in cancer. I have thousands of these truths and i could and might write a book about them.

Another thing that is hardley ever mentioned is that all humans will die anyway. But that's one of the most fundamental truths about reality but is taboo.

And @WOODESITY , we have been brainwashed to believe many lies . Just one example of one lie is that "death and suicide are so bad that you have to endure even great suffering and not end it because life so so worth it for it's own sake just to be alive even if your life is terrible" . I'm in the process of deprogramming my own brain to destroy all the lies they programed in my brain.

 

[a.n.kirillov]

This is why I came to respect theologians over the last few years and have acquired some taste for the bible. The theologians always knew and admitted to all those things you named, and furthermore have posed the question of how a good and loving god could create such a world and call it good.

Many people enjoy their lives. I used to enjoy it. The need to find some justification for it, the questioning and despair only become relevant once you suffer yourself and can find no (ultimate) purpose or justice within it. Buddhism becomes more popular in the west, but Buddhism, stripped of it's metaphysics, or at least without people really believing in them, isn't much more than solipsism and detachment; and I don't see that as very appealing.

So as a thinking (and suffering) person, you are left in a Nietzschean or Darwinian world, unless you delude yourself into some sort of other (secular) belief system that gives you back your notions of good and evil, justice, etc. You can pronounce the world as bad, but if you're intellectually honest as an atheist, you will have to admit that just as it isn't good or just, it can never be bad/ evil or unjust—it simply is. This is very hard to accept as one of the losers.

Yes, suicide is a way out. If you think about it, there is ultimate justice and salvation in life: there is always death and it is totally egalitarian, it strikes everyone alike, brings eternal peace and one day life on the planet will stop.

 

[BeeLoyal]

I want to see if people feel the same way.... We were born into this world. This world, this universe that suddenly appeared. We did not ask to be born we did not control our birth. We have to live in this world. It doesn't matter if you live paycheck to paycheck or you live in a mansion with more money in the bank than you know what to do with. Anyone can be depressed. Anyone can hurt. And no matter your hierarchy in this society you have to live in this horrible world. This world where children are molested everyday, the world where innocent people are tortured and abused for all different sorts of reasons, the world where children starve to death everyday ,the world where humans hurt each other constantly, when the reality is that your fellow human is all that you have got. No matter who you are you will suffer in this world. Every human suffers. This begs the question, what is the meaning of life? As sad as it seems, it may just be to be born, eat, and die. This is a sad world and a sad universe. Suicide seems like a way out. Like a relief. It is a way to escape this thing we call life. A door that takes us away from the heart break. Suicide means no more tears, no more hurt, no more sorrow. Suicide is the gateway to our heaven. Away from this world in which we don't want to live in.

But Suicide means also hurting the people who might love you and miss you when you are gone.
In this cruel world, I don't know if we should carry on with our pain or not, to not make other people suffer.
My grandfather ctb when my mother was in her 20s and she never really recovered from it.
But I can understand that this might have been the only way out of his misery at that time.
(He was gay, in a very strict catholic family/surrounding.)

 

[Partial-Elf]

And why would you want to reproduce and put another person in this situation? I consider reproduction to be a severely negative moral act and was trying to think of an equivalent. The closest I got was drunk driving, very drunk. Because you're selfishly rolling the dice on other people's suffering, whether it's the people you could hit in other cars or the child who could experience horrific traumas beyond your control. Also, I'd say most people are intoxicated when they decide to roll those dice–whether it's alcohol, the strength of social norms around reproduction, fantasies about dressing babies up in baby clothes, picturing an idealized version of their offspring, infatuation with their partner, etc.

I guess this only applies if you've felt a certain degree of suffering, though. I do think there are a lot of people who just haven't reached that threshold to realize how bad things are, or are too strongly propagandized to realize it regardless of how much they suffer.

 

[itsamadworld]

I want to see if people feel the same way.... We were born into this world. This world, this universe that suddenly appeared. We did not ask to be born we did not control our birth. We have to live in this world. It doesn't matter if you live paycheck to paycheck or you live in a mansion with more money in the bank than you know what to do with. Anyone can be depressed. Anyone can hurt. And no matter your hierarchy in this society you have to live in this horrible world. This world where children are molested everyday, the world where innocent people are tortured and abused for all different sorts of reasons, the world where children starve to death everyday ,the world where humans hurt each other constantly, when the reality is that your fellow human is all that you have got. No matter who you are you will suffer in this world. Every human suffers. This begs the question, what is the meaning of life? As sad as it seems, it may just be to be born, eat, and die. This is a sad world and a sad universe. Suicide seems like a way out. Like a relief. It is a way to escape this thing we call life. A door that takes us away from the heart break. Suicide means no more tears, no more hurt, no more sorrow. Suicide is the gateway to our heaven. Away from this world in which we don't want to live in.

The few pleasures of this world do not outweigh the pain:
-. An orgasm is 10 seconds or so- then a life of time of suffering.
-. The drugs and alcohol all have their side-effects, and the highs are too short-lived.
-. The hormone highs only last for 2 years max. in new relationships/or post baby highs
-. We are only young and beautiful for a small portion of our lives, and then the system humiliates us as we get older so they can sell their shit and make money off elderly humans by forcing them to live in nursing homes!
-. Most of our lives we slave away in a job we hate.. And we are forced to work, or go to prison..I don't know many people that are NOT burned out with their job!
-. Even if one has it all; (looks, money, youth, intelligence, good disposition, don't have to work, or they actually like their jobs..) These things could all be taken away at the drop of a flask, like a beautiful woman who gets acid thrown in her face!
-. How controlling, cruel and demanding, competitive, aggressive, and selfish human nature really is...
Etc....I think it's better not to introduce a human into this prison-like planet. I don't think it will ever improve either...Unless human nature will change, and the planet will not always be trying to harm us....

 

[a.n.kirillov]

guess this only applies if you've felt a certain degree, of suffering, though

Exactly. Good luck convincing the average Joe not to reproduce.

 

[Deleted member 1465]

it simply is.

That's a very tough thing for most people to accept, and even if they do, it's kind of hard to live with on a practical level. Hence religions. If they didn't exist, we'd have the need to create them.

 

[Iloveyouall]

Even if one has it all; (looks, money, youth, intelligence, good disposition..) These things could all be taken away at the drop of a flask

Even if you have it all, even if these things are not taken away you can suffer really hard.

Few weeks ago I read a post on here that was basically saying: if you think about life objectively, its only purpose is death. Death wins all the time. The reflection was more turned on death's perspective. Something like: what if death actually just create life to renew itself and so to live ? Why would death even care if beings suffer or not ? (At least that's how I understood it) It turned things completely on the other side. By extent we could say that it's kinda similar with what humans actually do. We give life to plants and animals by breeding them, we create them, not caring about their feelings or suffering because we need them to live. Of course we don't do that since very long but you get the idea.
As some said here, we are brainwashed, so most of our definitions and understandings of the life and death phenomenon are, I wouldn't say incorrect but completely subjective, depending of our own experiences which are just a cherry on top of a huge social-cultural shit covering, on top itself of the evolution cake that provides humans with limited capacities. But in reality, life and death maybe don't even exist, it's just our limited perception to apprehend events that occur. The suffering is the only thing that we are actually sure of because we have the genetic ability to feel it. Maybe existence is not meant to suffer, maybe it's the suffering that is meant to exist through us. I'm sorry I don't really see the point of what I'm saying, I feel like I just twisted things around for the only sake of it somehow.

 

[pthnrdnojvsc]

Even if you have it all, even if these things are not taken away you can suffer really hard.

Few weeks ago I read a post on here that was basically saying: if you think about life objectively, its only purpose is death. Death wins all the time. The reflection was more turned on death's perspective. Something like: what if death actually just create life to renew itself and so to live ? Why would death even care if beings suffer or not ? (At least that's how I understood it) It turned things completely on the other side. By extent we could say that it's kinda similar with what humans actually do. We give life to plants and animals by breeding them, we create them, not caring about their feelings or suffering because we need them to live. Of course we don't do that since very long but you get the idea.
As some said here, we are brainwashed, so most of our definitions and understandings of the life and death phenomenon are, I wouldn't say incorrect but completely subjective, depending of our own experiences which are just a cherry on top of a huge social-cultural shit covering, on top itself of the evolution cake that provides humans with limited capacities. But in reality, life and death maybe don't even exist, it's just our limited perception to apprehend events that occur. The suffering is the only thing that we are actually sure of because we have the genetic ability to feel it. Maybe existence is not meant to suffer, maybe it's the suffering that is meant to exist through us. I'm sorry I don't really see the point of what I'm saying, I feel like I just twisted things around for the only sake of it somehow.

Even if you have it all, even if these things are not taken away you can suffer really hard. Yeah Christopher Reeve(Superman) had it all but one day became paralized from the neck down , a quadriplegic. Robin Wiliams had it all and got a terrible alzheimer like dementia and had to commit suicide to get out of that hell. Even Steve Jobs got cancer and died. Cancer means terrible suffering.

So to me it's logical to at least have an exit strategy in case things go bad in a hurry. But that's taboo to say things like that.

 

[itsamadworld]

Even if you have it all, even if these things are not taken away you can suffer really hard.

Few weeks ago I read a post on here that was basically saying: if you think about life objectively, its only purpose is death. Death wins all the time. The reflection was more turned on death's perspective. Something like: what if death actually just create life to renew itself and so to live ? Why would death even care if beings suffer or not ? (At least that's how I understood it) It turned things completely on the other side. By extent we could say that it's kinda similar with what humans actually do. We give life to plants and animals by breeding them, we create them, not caring about their feelings or suffering because we need them to live. Of course we don't do that since very long but you get the idea.
As some said here, we are brainwashed, so most of our definitions and understandings of the life and death phenomenon are, I wouldn't say incorrect but completely subjective, depending of our own experiences which are just a cherry on top of a huge social-cultural shit covering, on top itself of the evolution cake that provides humans with limited capacities. But in reality, life and death maybe don't even exist, it's just our limited perception to apprehend events that occur. The suffering is the only thing that we are actually sure of because we have the genetic ability to feel it. Maybe existence is not meant to suffer, maybe it's the suffering that is meant to exist through us. I'm sorry I don't really see the point of what I'm saying, I feel like I just twisted things around for the only sake of it somehow.

I consider what you are saying. However, I didn't intend to imply that life is easy -street for the one who has that list. And I know of the celebrities, people you think have it all, I know they can be depressed too as much as any other. Especially if they have mental illness....but point is; most people strive for these things to make their lives better. I mean you must do it too to a certain degree, brush teeth and hair....etc...and does make life a little more COMFORTABLE to have things.

 

[Deleted member 1465]

But in reality, life and death maybe don't even exist, it's just our limited perception to apprehend events that occur.

We have a limited perception. Therefore the truth may be likely to be something beyond our perception and might seem ridiculous to us if observed.

Maybe existence is not meant to suffer, maybe it's the suffering that is meant to exist through us.

Interesting. Leads to the question: What is the value of suffering? If it has value, does it have a point where it loses that value and just becomes pointless?

 

[LMLN]

I want to see if people feel the same way.... We were born into this world. This world, this universe that suddenly appeared. We did not ask to be born we did not control our birth. We have to live in this world. It doesn't matter if you live paycheck to paycheck or you live in a mansion with more money in the bank than you know what to do with. Anyone can be depressed. Anyone can hurt. And no matter your hierarchy in this society you have to live in this horrible world. This world where children are molested everyday, the world where innocent people are tortured and abused for all different sorts of reasons, the world where children starve to death everyday ,the world where humans hurt each other constantly, when the reality is that your fellow human is all that you have got. No matter who you are you will suffer in this world. Every human suffers. This begs the question, what is the meaning of life? As sad as it seems, it may just be to be born, eat, and die. This is a sad world and a sad universe. Suicide seems like a way out. Like a relief. It is a way to escape this thing we call life. A door that takes us away from the heart break. Suicide means no more tears, no more hurt, no more sorrow. Suicide is the gateway to our heaven. Away from this world in which we don't want to live in.

I my personal belief system, this place is not my home. It's a place of suffering and pain many times. I understand, I'm so sorry for your pain. I am in the same boat.

 

[Iloveyouall]

Therefore the truth may be likely to be something beyond our perception and might seem ridiculous to us if observed.

Ridiculous is the word.

What is the value of suffering? If it has value, does it have a point where it loses that value and just becomes pointless?

It maybe doesn't have any value. Value to who ? Towards or in comparison to what ? Maybe it is just pointless and renew it's existence like a lot of other things. Doesn't matter if it last long or not, as long as it exists.

 

[Deleted member 1465]

Ridiculous is the word.


It maybe doesn't have any value. Value to who ? Towards or in comparison to what ? Maybe it is just pointless and renew it's existence like a lot of other things. Doesn't matter if it last long or not, as long as it exists.

Ah, yes, it has no intrinsic value maybe, especially if we assume the absurd interpretation.

But we have no choice but to glean something from it in order to put one foot in front of the other. The question is, at what point do we stop learning things and just suffer? I guess that is individual for everyone and why many of us are here, because that point has been exceeded.

I recall a quote from somewhere: "Flogging a man teaches him just one thing. How to turn his back."

And if there is no intrinsic value to suffering, then all we do to try and be happy, must be delusional. Is wilful delusion therefore a good thing? If it is, up to a point, then at what point does that delusion become harmful?*

From Ten Miles to Go on a Nine Mile Road, by Jim White:

From the splinter in the hand
To the thorn in the heart, to the shotgun to the head
You got no choice but to learn to glean solace from pain
Or you'll end up cynical or dead

*All rhetorical questions BTW and really up to the individual, if the concept is even valid.

 

[Painpleasure]

I am not religious but even the Bible recognised the brutality of life in its totality:

Ecclesiastes 4 :

"And I declared that the dead, who had already died, are happier than the living, who are still alive.
But better than both is the one who has never been born, who has not seen the evil that exists under the sun".

One of my favourite compassionate philosophers is a man by the name of David Benatar. This quote eloquently sums up my views on why it is immoral to deliberately subject your unborn children to a world in which unfathomable and unthinkable pain exists:

"It is curious that while good people go to great lengths to spare their children from suffering, few of them seem to notice that the one (and only) guaranteed way to prevent all the suffering of their children is not to bring those children into existence in the first place."

 

[GoBack]

I would love to live in this world. I gave it all I had to try and live in it. But now my body and mind and heart are too broken , some of my own doing, mostly
others. I'd love another chance but I'm 2 old and wrecked

 

[Erdapfel]

Why would anyone want to live in this world?

I don't think that there is anyone who really ,,wants'' to live in this world. All living things got forced into existence. There is no freedom at all, therefore no free will. If anybody suddenly decides to want to live in this world, then it is nothing more than a product of Stockholm syndrome to me.

 

[a.n.kirillov]

Why would anyone want to live in this world?

I don't think that there is anyone who really ,,wants'' to live in this world. All living things got forced into existence. There is no freedom at all, therefore no free will. If anybody suddenly decides to want to live in this world, then it is nothing more than a product of Stockholm syndrome to me.

That's going too far. Why should their enjoyment be a psychopathology but not your non enjoyment?

 

[RepressedMind]

I find those moments of mental relief when I can mentally concentrate on something and not worry about my problems. Being able to do that frequently and consistently is what makes it bearable to live.

 

[darkhorse256]

I don't know why anyone would want to live in this world. Sure, there may be moments of happiness but they are always fleeting. It doesn't cover up the inconvenient truth that 99%of existence is pain.

 

[Iloveyouall]

The question is, at what point do we stop learning things and just suffer? I guess that is individual for everyone and why many of us are here, because that point has been exceeded.

I see what you mean but I feel we actually never stop learning things even when suffering seems all what is left. Maybe we don't perceive it because we can be overwhelmed but our brain does.
It may sound harsh but suffering can be as much delusional as happiness in a way. Delusional in the sense it can completelly blind perspectives. Some can't help to suffer as much as some can't help to feel happy. Don't get me wrong, it's not like it is something you can control in any way, it just is when it's there.

"Flogging a man teaches him just one thing. How to turn his back."

Very true.

I actually don't understand the concept of intrinsic value. Nothing has an intrinsic value. Value is a construction of the mind that results from the social interaction we have with money, exchange. If we humans weren't here, nothing would have any value.

And if there is no intrinsic value to suffering, then all we do to try and be happy, must be delusional. Is wilful delusion therefore a good thing? If it is, up to a point, then at what point does that delusion become harmful?*

We try to be happy because suffering doesn't feel good. It's like a defense mechanism from the mind and body I guess. I don't really see how to intelectualize that actually.
How can you be wilfully delusional ? Like not wanting to know ? I guess it become harmful as soon as it become reckless and this point is attain way more quickly that we like or are able to admit it.

I find those moments of mental relief when I can mentally concentrate on something and not worry about my problems. Being able to do that frequently and consistently is what makes it bearable to live.

I heard that multiple times yup. Not thinking and concentrate is actually the key.

I don't know why anyone would want to live in this world. Sure, there may be moments of happiness but they are always fleeting. It doesn't cover up the inconvenient truth that 99%of existence is pain.

If we had the choice, I guess everyone would be like "Hum no thanks." and walk away.