Discussion The cruelty of the human race.

[protector_iorek]

Sorry I know I just posted.. not trying to spam I promise, I just have so many thoughts and no one to share with.

Content warning: mentions of rape, abuse, molestation, etc below

Can anyone else simply not understand or not fathom the level of cruelty of the human race?

Correct me if I'm wrong but other mammals are also cruel to each other, but typically only out of necessity like hunger or sometimes chance to reproduce which may come down to social status. Most mammals are operating on instinct or have no other choice though, so we cannot judge them or hold them to the standard we hold ourselves as conscious human beings with moral codes.

I feel like this could be possible in a species like whales, who are highly emotionally intelligent and rely on social groups.. but as far as I know humans are the only species who purposefully murder each other, and engage in political war and genocide.

Other mammals rape but not with the context of conscious or unconscious hatred, misogyny, revenge, or domination that may be an underlying motivator when a human commits a rape or molestation.

Other mammals obviously don't engage in capitalism and something about money and assets seems to ruin a persons sense of morality. It's like the richer you are the farther you go to protect that, so you will then do any number of unethical horrible things to other people, and it doesn't matter, as long as you protected your wealth.

Nature can be cruel but not malicious, not purposefully evil.

People abuse, harass, assault, dox, and fire average everyday working individuals to protect their own profits. You'd like to believe that working hard and being responsible will keep you "safe" from this, but that's not true and it's the "just world" fallacy. At any time you could become ill and need to take time off work and be fired for it. You could be accused of doing something you didn't do and be fired. It doesn't matter. You are facing legal teams and HR departments and all manners of barriers in the workplace. And it's not just corporate world. Work is a great example of a human-created nightmare.

These are just a few examples of structures our species has created and engage in, which cause harm to all of us.

I've always been a person centered around morals, curious about right and wrong, and wanting to be as ethical as possible. I'm no saint, I know I have bought and owned things that weren't ethically sourced (most of us have), and I'm sure I've hurt people unintentionally.

But I've never engaged in a direct and purposeful retaliation against someone, I've never engaged in an act of revenge against someone, even someone who has hurt me very badly. I've never hurt someone physically and never purposefully tried to hurt someone emotionally. I've never spewed insults at someone's face or wished death upon someone. Of course I have been critical and judgmental of others (we all have) but not to their face. I've never tried to tear someone down at work or "snitch" on someone. I've never committed a crime, stolen something, or been violent towards another individual.

And yet so so many people in the world hold up unethical systems to protect their wealth or status. So so many people have no problem hurting another on purpose for their gain. Even at the individual level.

And here I am feeling guilty for every moment I even inconvenience someone in the slightest, here I am saying sorry for everything I do and say, here I am trying to make myself so small for the world so I'm not a burden. I feel guilty for everything and anything. I feel guilty for no longer being a perfect vegan of 8 years, I'm a vegetarian now. I feel guilty for spending money on some things. I feel guilty for eating. I feel guilty for the things I own. I feel guilty for EVERYTHING.

It's just.. so unfair. So cruel. Ethics and kindness are lost. How can people be so awful? I don't understand.

And this is all just another reason to CTB.

 

[darkenmydoorstep]

Guilt is an interesting phenomenon isn't it?
Some of us seem to experience it yet so many don't.
Is it innate I wonder, are we born with what we would term 'a conscience'?
Or is it grown or ignored, outcome resting upon that cultivation or lack of it?
Feels like some of the darker souls dominate sometimes when you look at the systems inflicted upon the world - work as you say, systems of eating animals that are (whatever your stance on it) crueller than they need be.
And so often it all hinges around money, economic gain.
As for humans doing bad things to each other, maybe sometimes that is self expression against they feel against some of those unnecessary systems. Most abuse after all is about power so I suppose it stands to reason that the more powerless the world makes us feel, the more we try and assert it in other ways.

There's something innocent to me about the way animals have no morals. A spider eating a fly, a cat torturing a mouse - because they truly know no better. An adult human of sound mind practising any sort of evil, clearly does know better and that's what makes it all the more chilling.

 

[Forever Sleep]

I agree with you that we are the most knowingly callous species. Still- I wouldn't be so sure animals are all together innocent. Most disturbing I think is that it is often the more intelligent animals that seem to be sadistic. Domestic cats know their owners don't like them hunting but they still do it. They're fed at home- so- it isn't for hunger. They enjoy it. You could argue it's 'natural' for them to be honing their hunting skills. That excuse could go for any animal in fact.

I saw a terribly distressing nature documentary where a group of killer whales were stalking a mother and calf whale- humpback or sperm whale I think. Anyhow- they kept chasing them because they knew the calf would eventually tire out. All they ate of it was it's tongue. It sounds like they did it more for the sport. Orcas supposedly have more developed emotional senses than we do- so- you can't really say they don't realise what they are doing. Same goes for chimps- they will hunt down and tear apart other monkeys quite savagely. They will even turn on one another if they perceive weakness and see a chance to gain power. You could argue again that it's instinct. So- why isn't it instinctual when humans do it? Because we know better- or, because we are taught that?

I think animals can knowingly be cruel too. I also believe that- given the chance, any of them would also take over if they could. I'm not so sure animals live in this perfect harmony with nature by choice. I just think they are forced to. It's just that we developed more rapidly to be able to out maneuver a lot of things that kill other creatures.

I agree though- I hate our species. I'm just not so sure though that 'nature' is the harmonious force people romanticise it to be. What animal wouldn't use its evolutionary edge to dominate? In fact- you could argue that our sense of morals have been imposed upon us to try and hold back our more animalistic nature. Animals don't get married or sue one another. There's no protecting them when their 'rights' are violated. Either they learn to get stronger or better at hiding or- they die. It's hard to judge just how much of it is consciously malicious with animals. No doubt- it's less but- I wouldn't say there was no malice at all. Some animals are sadistic- maybe it's in their nature to be that way. Is it in our nature to be that way too?

 

[FuneralCry]

There is no limit as to how cruel humans can be, I truly believe that humans will always be the worst species, it's horrific how they just create so much harm. If all humans were capable of rational thought, this species would had gone extinct a long time ago which to me would be for the best, I hate how humans continue to so cruelly procreate.

 

[darkenmydoorstep]

I agree with you that we are the most knowingly callous species. Still- I wouldn't be so sure animals are all together innocent. Most disturbing I think is that it is often the more intelligent animals that seem to be sadistic. Domestic cats know their owners don't like them hunting but they still do it. They're fed at home- so- it isn't for hunger. They enjoy it. You could argue it's 'natural' for them to be honing their hunting skills. That excuse could go for any animal in fact.

I saw a terribly distressing nature documentary where a group of killer whales were stalking a mother and calf whale- humpback or sperm whale I think. Anyhow- they kept chasing them because they knew the calf would eventually tire out. All they ate of it was it's tongue. It sounds like they did it more for the sport. Orcas supposedly have more developed emotional senses than we do- so- you can't really say they don't realise what they are doing. Same goes for chimps- they will hunt down and tear apart other monkeys quite savagely. They will even turn on one another if they perceive weakness and see a chance to gain power. You could argue again that it's instinct. So- why isn't it instinctual when humans do it? Because we know better- or, because we are taught that?

I think animals can knowingly be cruel too. I also believe that- given the chance, any of them would also take over if they could. I'm not so sure animals live in this perfect harmony with nature by choice. I just think they are forced to. It's just that we developed more rapidly to be able to out maneuver a lot of things that kill other creatures.

I agree though- I hate our species. I'm just not so sure though that 'nature' is the harmonious force people romanticise it to be. What animal wouldn't use its evolutionary edge to dominate? In fact- you could argue that our sense of morals have been imposed upon us to try and hold back our more animalistic nature. Animals don't get married or sue one another. There's no protecting them when their 'rights' are violated. Either they learn to get stronger or better at hiding or- they die. It's hard to judge just how much of it is consciously malicious with animals. No doubt- it's less but- I wouldn't say there was no malice at all. Some animals are sadistic- maybe it's in their nature to be that way. Is it in our nature to be that way too?

 

[sserafim]

Sorry I know I just posted.. not trying to spam I promise, I just have so many thoughts and no one to share with.

Content warning: mentions of rape, abuse, molestation, etc below

Can anyone else simply not understand or not fathom the level of cruelty of the human race?

Correct me if I'm wrong but other mammals are also cruel to each other, but typically only out of necessity like hunger or sometimes chance to reproduce which may come down to social status. Most mammals are operating on instinct or have no other choice though, so we cannot judge them or hold them to the standard we hold ourselves as conscious human beings with moral codes.

I feel like this could be possible in a species like whales, who are highly emotionally intelligent and rely on social groups.. but as far as I know humans are the only species who purposefully murder each other, and engage in political war and genocide.

Other mammals rape but not with the context of conscious or unconscious hatred, misogyny, revenge, or domination that may be an underlying motivator when a human commits a rape or molestation.

Other mammals obviously don't engage in capitalism and something about money and assets seems to ruin a persons sense of morality. It's like the richer you are the farther you go to protect that, so you will then do any number of unethical horrible things to other people, and it doesn't matter, as long as you protected your wealth.

Nature can be cruel but not malicious, not purposefully evil.

People abuse, harass, assault, dox, and fire average everyday working individuals to protect their own profits. You'd like to believe that working hard and being responsible will keep you "safe" from this, but that's not true and it's the "just world" fallacy. At any time you could become ill and need to take time off work and be fired for it. You could be accused of doing something you didn't do and be fired. It doesn't matter. You are facing legal teams and HR departments and all manners of barriers in the workplace. And it's not just corporate world. Work is a great example of a human-created nightmare.

These are just a few examples of structures our species has created and engage in, which cause harm to all of us.

I've always been a person centered around morals, curious about right and wrong, and wanting to be as ethical as possible. I'm no saint, I know I have bought and owned things that weren't ethically sourced (most of us have), and I'm sure I've hurt people unintentionally.

But I've never engaged in a direct and purposeful retaliation against someone, I've never engaged in an act of revenge against someone, even someone who has hurt me very badly. I've never hurt someone physically and never purposefully tried to hurt someone emotionally. I've never spewed insults at someone's face or wished death upon someone. Of course I have been critical and judgmental of others (we all have) but not to their face. I've never tried to tear someone down at work or "snitch" on someone. I've never committed a crime, stolen something, or been violent towards another individual.

And yet so so many people in the world hold up unethical systems to protect their wealth or status. So so many people have no problem hurting another on purpose for their gain. Even at the individual level.

And here I am feeling guilty for every moment I even inconvenience someone in the slightest, here I am saying sorry for everything I do and say, here I am trying to make myself so small for the world so I'm not a burden. I feel guilty for everything and anything. I feel guilty for no longer being a perfect vegan of 8 years, I'm a vegetarian now. I feel guilty for spending money on some things. I feel guilty for eating. I feel guilty for the things I own. I feel guilty for EVERYTHING.

It's just.. so unfair. So cruel. Ethics and kindness are lost. How can people be so awful? I don't understand.

And this is all just another reason to CTB.

Yeah this is why I believe that humans are inherently cruel and selfish. It's just human nature. I believe that humans are still animals at the end of the day, they still have animalistic nature no matter how hard they try to suppress it. That's why there have to be laws in place to prevent people from committing crimes. The worst thing is that humans know they're acting that way and continue to do so, unlike animals who are governed by instinct.

I agree with you that we are the most knowingly callous species. Still- I wouldn't be so sure animals are all together innocent. Most disturbing I think is that it is often the more intelligent animals that seem to be sadistic. Domestic cats know their owners don't like them hunting but they still do it. They're fed at home- so- it isn't for hunger. They enjoy it. You could argue it's 'natural' for them to be honing their hunting skills. That excuse could go for any animal in fact.

I saw a terribly distressing nature documentary where a group of killer whales were stalking a mother and calf whale- humpback or sperm whale I think. Anyhow- they kept chasing them because they knew the calf would eventually tire out. All they ate of it was it's tongue. It sounds like they did it more for the sport. Orcas supposedly have more developed emotional senses than we do- so- you can't really say they don't realise what they are doing. Same goes for chimps- they will hunt down and tear apart other monkeys quite savagely. They will even turn on one another if they perceive weakness and see a chance to gain power. You could argue again that it's instinct. So- why isn't it instinctual when humans do it? Because we know better- or, because we are taught that?

I think animals can knowingly be cruel too. I also believe that- given the chance, any of them would also take over if they could. I'm not so sure animals live in this perfect harmony with nature by choice. I just think they are forced to. It's just that we developed more rapidly to be able to out maneuver a lot of things that kill other creatures.

I agree though- I hate our species. I'm just not so sure though that 'nature' is the harmonious force people romanticise it to be. What animal wouldn't use its evolutionary edge to dominate? In fact- you could argue that our sense of morals have been imposed upon us to try and hold back our more animalistic nature. Animals don't get married or sue one another. There's no protecting them when their 'rights' are violated. Either they learn to get stronger or better at hiding or- they die. It's hard to judge just how much of it is consciously malicious with animals. No doubt- it's less but- I wouldn't say there was no malice at all. Some animals are sadistic- maybe it's in their nature to be that way. Is it in our nature to be that way too?

I think that humans see themselves as above other animals, and that humans should be governed by reason rather than instinct. I think that people think that we should "know better" because we're civilized and have the level of consciousness and intelligence needed to understand and reflect upon our actions