Venting the criminalization of ctb'ing probably increases suicidal feelings

[bitofftoomuch]

If ctb'ing were as simple as getting a bottle of N from a local store I likely would just get it, store it, and not feel any need to think about CTB'ing until things got very bad. Who knows, I might actually commit myself to recovery enough to successfully rebound and wind up never using it.

But since instead it's far harder to die peacefully, I sink hours at a time into researching things and it makes my mental health far worse. CTB'ing is on my mind for far longer stretches of time and renders me much more dysfunctional. Even after ordering SN I'm overwhelmed by the daunting process of getting anti-vom pills and sedatives. If I'm being honest I personally have high standards for "peaceful". Again, would be so much easier if methods like ddmaph or N weren't so criminalized.

It's quite depressing that suicide appears to be something every major global power player is in lockstep on. Whether fascist, liberal, or "socialist", every country wants to criminalize ctb methods. N has basically been bombed off the map, metaphorically speaking. Do they not realize that just like abortion people will still find a way, but that it will just be a much less pleasant process? That's rhetorical of course. They don't care about our suffering. They just want fewer suicides because mass ctb would lose them negotiating power over labor or harm their public health reputation. Making CTB'ing as unpleasant as possible is a victory in their eyes because they see it as good to keep as many of us here against our own will as possible. I want to shake these shitstains and tell them that if they want us alive, they should instead be building a society worth living in. That they now work relentlessly to stop us from opting out is the silent admission that this capitalist model is in its latest stage so shitty and hellish that most rational people want out. I pray by some satanic miracle we'll one day again find a steady supply of what we need.

 

[Plato'sCaveDweller]

Indeed! Well said.

I'm sure all of us here would love a Sarco pod experience, or maybe Pentobarb if drinking something is more your style. But most of us are forced to use physically brutal methods (cars, trains, jumping, hanging), slightly less than ideal oral methods (SN, select prescription drugs, illicit substances), less than ideal gas methods (CO or H2S), or rig up a DIY inert gas setup if one is in the fortunate position to do so. As you say, they can restrict or ban methods all they want, but some will still find a way. We still reside in a prison, and just because some prisoners manage to escape doesn't mean we're all able and free to do so. As Sarah Perry said in Every Cradle is a Grave, we do not live in The Land of Free Disposal. And as such, people who wish to take their exit must do so clandestinely and not always with a method they'd prefer, and take the opportunities to CTB as soon as they arise, for it is unknown whether another will show its face in the future. All of this adds unnecessary suffering and pressure to the process.

A lot of people, I think, would live much more comfortable and freeing lives if they had a lethal dose of N in their nightstand, always there for when things become too much to bear; even then, I think that having N might make people more resilient and stoic in the face of bullshit, raising the threshold for calling it quits, since they'd have an easy and peaceful way out available to them. Like that one quote, "A prison becomes a home when you have the key."

 

[sevennn]

yes. makes mental worse. can't even describe how much suffering no option 4 euthanasia causes. in fact ONE WOMAN was ASSISTED for EXACTLY my issues. so the world agrees. my issue hard enough and the world granted someone with my exact issue her wish. so it's hypocrite that in other part of the world they don't. still same issue. validating and sad that somewhere they agreed that my issue = enough reason to ctb. don't want to ctb. but have to

Indeed! Well said.

I'm sure all of us here would love a Sarco pod experience, or maybe Pentobarb if drinking something is more your style. But most of us are forced to use physically brutal methods (cars, trains, jumping, hanging), slightly less than ideal oral methods (SN, select prescription drugs, illicit substances), less than ideal gas methods (CO or H2S), or rig up a DIY inert gas setup if one is in the fortunate position to do so. As you say, they can restrict or ban methods all they want, but some will still find a way. We still reside in a prison, and just because some prisoners manage to escape doesn't mean we're all able and free to do so. As Sarah Perry said in Every Cradle is a Grave, we do not live in The Land of Free Disposal. And as such, people who wish to take their exit must do so clandestinely and not always with a method they'd prefer, and take the opportunities to CTB as soon as they arise, for it is unknown whether another will show its face in the future. All of this adds unnecessary suffering and pressure to the process.

A lot of people, I think, would live much more comfortable and freeing lives if they had a lethal dose of N in their nightstand, always there for when things become too much to bear; even then, I think that having N might make people more resilient and stoic in the face of bullshit, raising the threshold for calling it quits, since they'd have an easy and peaceful way out available to them. Like that one quote, "A prison becomes a home when you have the key."

good quote in the end. i also like what one doctor in support of assisted suicide said in reply to another person against it. she said "dont hold people hostage to lifes failures" (the person against said the usual stuff about how we need to fix XYZ issues first and this is what the doctor replied, they act like we all need to hold on until just tomorrow they'll fix all those issue. makes me angry. no we won't. you are just holding me hostage because you don't want to admit my problem no cure. and my sadness irks you. so much gaslighting. to me)

 

[Forever Sleep]

I agree to an extent. I suppose the problem being that I don't think it's possible to rule out that some people may commit impulsively or during psychosis. If it's freely available, I imagine minors would get hold of it too.

I agree that peaceful methods should be available. To my mind- to any adult of sound mind and anyone with debilitating health issues. But, I think it would need regulating to stop impulsive attempts.

I suppose I also wonder whether there would be even less incentive to sort out societies problems and help the more 'undesirable' citizens if governments realise that- left to their own devices with even less support, they may well choose to kill themselves and relieve them of the financial burden. I do believe our governments are heartless enough for that.

 

[ham and potatoes]

I agree. Luckily for me, I've got access to guns and could semi easily get my hands on fent if it comes to it. But for most people, that's not an option, and they have to try to find some awful way to do it.
I don't think they will ever decriminalize it though, government and politicians want us alive so they can tax us, and the businesses and corporations that lobby (aka own) those politicians and governments want us alive so they can sell us shit and use is for our labor

 

[bitofftoomuch]

To my mind- to any adult of sound mind and anyone with debilitating health issues.

Do you mean either/or? I personally think the only limit should be age. anecdotally, I'm glad I failed to CTB at 22 because the best years of my life were 26 and 27. but probably 21 is a better place to draw the line than 25.

I suppose I also wonder whether there would be even less incentive to sort out societies problems and help the more 'undesirable' citizens if governments realise that- left to their own devices with even less support, they may well choose to kill themselves and relieve them of the financial burden. I do believe our governments are heartless enough for that.

no, they want "undesirables" alive as slaves. the smarter ruling class members understand that our society is largely built on their labor. prisoners and those in undeveloped countries serve directly as cheap labor. jobless people, meanwhile, exist as a bargaining chip. the unspoken threat every boss has is "well maybe if you don't like it here, i'll hire joe off the street and *you* can sleep off the sidewalk for god knows how long". This is why they're so against CTB regardless of who you are.

 

[Exiled spirit]

In my opinion, humans aren't truly free if they're stuck here and can't choose to die on their own terms.

 

[bitofftoomuch]

I don't think they will ever decriminalize it though, government and politicians want us alive so they can tax us, and the businesses and corporations that lobby (aka own) those politicians and governments want us alive so they can sell us shit and use is for our labor

meh, agree about sales and labor but the government really doesn't "miss" the taxes of people who die. the point of taxes in the modern fiat system is not actual wealth generation for government but rather to control the money supply.

 

[Forever Sleep]

Do you mean either/or? I personally think the only limit should be age. anecdotally, I'm glad I failed to CTB at 22 because the best years of my life were 26 and 27. but probably 21 is a better place to draw the line than 25.


no, they want "undesirables" alive as slaves. the smarter ruling class members understand that our society is largely built on their labor. prisoners and those in undeveloped countries serve directly as cheap labor. jobless people, meanwhile, exist as a bargaining chip. the unspoken threat every boss has is "well maybe if you don't like it here, i'll hire joe off the street and *you* can sleep off the sidewalk for god knows how long". This is why they're so against CTB regardless of who you are.

I think minors should actually be allowed access if they have incurable, debilitating health issues- obviously certified by doctors and the decision being made unanimously between them, their parents and the doctors.

Perhaps 21 is a more sensible age. I usually think 18, seeing as we are allowed/ trusted to make other life changing decisions at that point. But yeah- I suppose 21 is better because, if a person's problems are family/ home related, there's a possibility they could have moved out by then and changed their life substantially.

Funnily enough, my life improved briefly in my 30's. Still- not exactly enough to make me think it was worth hanging on though. (I've had ideation since age 10.)

Fair point about societies workings. We all play an exploited part. People not earning generate the need for care jobs, medication etc. which still benefit the people at the top.

 

[bitofftoomuch]

I think minors should actually be allowed access if they have incurable, debilitating health issues- obviously certified by doctors and the decision being made unanimously between them, their parents and the doctors.

yeah that's fair. if kids with say bone cancer want an out they should get it. i'm not sure i'd even require parental approval given how shite parents can be.

 

[FuneralCry]

I wish more painless methods are accessible as well, having access to Nembutal would bring me so much peace, it feels so cruel to me and it's so painful how I cannot have access to such to finally escape from all the suffering in an existence I never would have chosen or wished for in the first place.

 

[Emeralds]

A lot of people, I think, would live much more comfortable and freeing lives if they had a lethal dose of N in their nightstand, always there for when things become too much to bear; even then, I think that having N might make people more resilient and stoic in the face of bullshit, raising the threshold for calling it quits, since they'd have an easy and peaceful way out available to them. Like that one quote, "A prison becomes a home when you have the key."

The problem is that this could work two ways. If suicide was made too easy, there would be a lot more impulsive suicides. Many people would take the N in the heat of the moment if they suddenly lost their job or their partner left them, for example. They wouldn't take the time to think it through. Everyone doesn't have good self control.

 

[Plato'sCaveDweller]

The problem is that this could work two ways. If suicide was made too easy, there would be a lot more impulsive suicides. Many people would take the N in the heat of the moment if they suddenly lost their job or their partner left them, for example. They wouldn't take the time to think it through. Everyone doesn't have good self control.

That is a fair point. I simply feel that, of the two options, easier access is less harmful than restricted or outright impossible access.

A middle ground option would also be good, say, a waiting period issued by the government before one is given access to purchase or be prescribed N (or be allowed to use Sarco). But the problem with a waiting period is some people would have to endure real hell before they get their out. In the case of losing a job, they may end up going homeless and have to survive on the street until their date comes up. In the case of losing a partner, they may have to endure an immense amount of grief and loneliness before their date. Additionally, during this wait period such impulsive suicides may become impatient and choose to exit via a more brutal or risky method, and that could cause more harm than good.

It's a tough topic. And it's certainly one of the main reasons why society and the government haven't touched it very much, and have only moved a centimeter towards anything close to an actual Right to Die. You're fucked one way, or fucked another. I'm not so sure a truly ideal solution exists, which is why I lean more towards a libertarian "do as you please" approach rather than leaving people trapped in their lives or forcing them to use riskier and less peaceful methods.

 

[pthnrdnojvsc]

This thread is just more fuel for me to kill these monstrous cells I'm trapped in they call a human body .

We all will die anyway but there are people that think they have the right to tell others they have to prolong their suffering but die anyway later since we all will die no matter what happens

What fucking difference will it make to a stranger if I kill myself in an hour or suffer for 5 years and die anyway of natural causes like painful cancer?

Nobody has the right to tell someone else that they have to endure this nightmare called life another second, to continue under threat of extreme torture for no reason and to work so hard for no reason

No one can convince me of a reason I have live another minute or to want to live another second in this hell called life . Or why I have to want to do anything . Killing myself won't t affect anything nor anyone else.

All I want to do is kill myself and not bother anyone Else. That is nobody's business what I do as long as I'm not affecting anyone else: plus I'm going to die anyway like every human Will.

 

[ijustwishtodie]

I also hate how suicide methods are inaccessible. It's just so unfair and so cruel that I'm forced to die in a brutal and harsh way because I can't access a peaceful suicide method. If I had access to N, I'd be at peace and would feel a lot of relief. However, since humans have gone out of their way to heavily regulate death, I loathe humanity immensely and I hope that this shitty species goes extinct one day. This sole fact of humanity making peaceful methods and euthanasia a crime is more than enough for me to conclude that humans are the worst species on this planet