"Respect the dead"

[Sprite_Geist]

You may often hear the phrases: "You must 'respect' the dead", "Do not speak ill of the deceased" or similar expressions along that line - so to speak. I thought about this recently (maybe too much) and I do not understand it. I might have misinterpreted this attitude the wrong way, but personally it comes across as to mean that dead people are more important and/or deserve more "respect" than those who are living.

So it is okay to mistreat another person - to abuse and insult them while they are alive. Though once they die, suddenly, being mean-spirited toward that person is no longer acceptable. Even those that bullied or disliked you will become overly-protective of your memory as if they cared about you to start with. Why do we draw the line at death - should it not be okay to mistreat another person (for no reason) at all whether or not they are gone?

If anything it should be the other way around: you should not speak ill of the living; given that someone who is alive actually has a conscience that is capable of processing emotions, and a body that can feel pain; they are much more susceptible to the ill-treatment from others. If it is not considered good to abuse the memory of a deceased individual then it should not be considered good to abuse that same person when they are alive. On the other hand (but by the same logic): if it is okay to criticise a living person for doing something wrong then it should also be okay to criticise the deceased for any wrong doings they committed in life. Death should not always equal vindication - depending on the situation.

Also: considering that some individuals who commit suicide do so because of bullying it makes sense to be kind to one another in the present. If we "respected" each other now, while we are all living, then we might not have a need to "respect" the dead, because there would not be as many people in early graves - due to suffering caused by others - in the first place.

 

[Ghost2211]

I personally have no problem speaking poorly of the dead if they were horrible while living. They're lack of kindness or abundance of cruelty is not erased simply because they are dead, or unable to speak up for themselves. My mom was a heartless abusiver, and I have no shame in stating that despite the fact that she is dead.

 

[Them]

Of course it is nonsense phrase, no doubt about it. I think you can speak whatever you want as long as you speak the truth, because no intelligence wants to be lied to (unlike religious people).

And certainly bullies won't listen to things that make sense, because that's why they're bullies in the first place.

 

[MindFrog]

Well sometimes "respect" comes from guilt too. It could be a way to clean their conscience if they happen to hurt the dead person. It's more of a selfish act if you frame it this way.

 

[Gnip]

I personally have no problem speaking poorly of the dead if they were horrible while living. They're lack of kindness or abundance of cruelty is not erased simply because they are dead, or unable to speak up for themselves. My mom was a heartless abusive, and I have no shame in stating that despite the fact that she is dead.

My retired elementary school principal father, first, second and fourth grade teachers and my elementary school principal from third to sixth grade ripped me apart when I was a Ritalin skinny kid, teaching and encouraging the other kids and subsequent teachers and school psychologists and "counselors" to bully me in turn.

I was alive, blamed and punished for literally nothing (yet I was never so much as held in for recess or a detention), and even slapped if I so much as attempted to defend myself against ridiculously false accusations.

The fact that my father now has a measure of dementia does not mean he is not pure evil. If I outlive him and get my hands on his ashes after his cremation, I will dump them into the nearest outhouse cesspool. (Ditto for those of virtually all the living "teachers" I have known, and yes, I fully endorse grave desecration as a highly therapeutic activity for survivors of abuse from the deceased.) If you teach disrespect in life, then you have fully embraced receiving disrespect and desecration in death.)

 

[signifying nothing]

Do not conform.

 

[Soulless Angel]

Speak ill of the dead may come from those that are trying to keep a positive memory of someone's that others may not have.
Do not disrespect the dead, similar meaning.

I do not believe in those sayings unless it's too respect a living person.

I speak ill of the dead, one of my abusers, I watched him die, he had a brain tumour, when he finally took his last breath, my first words where, thank fuck for that, off to hell you go.

Speak how you wish of some one, as long as it's in context to their relationship with you.

 

[issyishere]

I personally have no problem speaking poorly of the dead if they were horrible while living. They're lack of kindness or abundance of cruelty is not erased simply because they are dead, or unable to speak up for themselves. My mom was a heartless abusiver, and I have no shame in stating that despite the fact that she is dead.

I 100% agree with this. Just because someone has died does not mean they get a free pass for things they did.

On a side note, before my mental health nosedived I used to think suicidal people were cowards. I've now come to realize they're one of the most couragous people on the planet.

 

[livefreeorpeace]

I agree. I believe the issue that people take with 'pissing on the dead' if you will, is that person is not around to defend themselves against those criticisms. That's the only valid reason I've ever heard anyhow. That's not to say that it is a one size fits all, not in the least. The example you give illustrates this well, I would NOT besmirch you for being critical of your abuser, that's perfectly within your right to do, and airing those grievances is most likely the healthiest course of action, in most cases. In the interest of saving time and not getting off into the pucker brush, I'll leave it at that. I hope that made sense, and pray that it won't be taken out of context.

I 100% agree with this. Just because someone has died does not mean they get a free pass for things they did.

On a side note, before my mental health nosedived I used to think suicidal people were cowards. I've now come to realize they're one of the most couragous people on the planet.

Always found that curious myself, the whole cowardest thing. Let's be honest, you have to have heart (and a huge pair of balls) to lay your head down on that track, whilst a train is barreling down on you at full speed, hell you can probably feel the vibration on the track as the engine approaches. If that's not bravery, I don't know what is.

 

[Sprite_Geist]

I agree. I believe the issue that people take with 'pissing on the dead' if you will, is that person is not around to defend themselves against those criticisms. That's the only valid reason I've ever heard anyhow. That's not to say that it is a one size fits all, not in the least. The example you give illustrates this well, I would NOT besmirch you for being critical of your abuser, that's perfectly within your right to do, and airing those grievances is most likely the healthiest course of action, in most cases. In the interest of saving time and not getting off into the pucker brush, I'll leave it at that. I hope that made sense, and pray that it won't be taken out of context.

Always found that curious myself, the whole cowardest thing. Let's be honest, you have to have heart (and a huge pair of balls) to lay your head down on that track, whilst a train is barreling down on you at full speed, hell you can probably feel the vibration on the track as the engine approaches. If that's not bravery, I don't know what is.

Oh no - your post made sense and is polite. I think it is a good take on this subject also.

Well sometimes "respect" comes from guilt too. It could be a way to clean their conscience if they happen to hurt the dead person. It's more of a selfish act if you frame it this way.

This is true in some cases. That is why in the initial post "respect" was put in quote marks, because sometimes what is seen as respect is not actually respect, but fear. To add to what you have said: It could also be peer pressure too.

 

[livefreeorpeace]

Oh no - your post made sense and is polite. I think it is a good take on this subject also.



This is true in some cases. That is why in the initial post "respect" was put in quote marks, because sometimes what is seen as respect is not actually respect, but fear. To add to what you have said: It could also be peer pressure too.

Interesting, I never considered 'group dynamics' in this context. The peer pressure metric certainly must play a role in regards to this subject. I appreciate you folks being available to bounce ideas off. Good stuff!

 

[sadbadpsychogirl]

lol i know for a fact that there are people who will dance on my grave. good for them

 

[Gnip]

lol i know for a fact that there are people who will dance on my grave. good for them

My ideal scenario would be to have certain people dance on my grave. Did I mention my ideal scenario involves jumping into an active volcanic lava lake? ...:

 

[Deleted member 25174]

I think people say it because they're not here to defend themselves. I disagree I'll celebrate "thatcher's dead thursday" til i die