Question regarding self agency when cognitive ability is compromised.

[hoping to lose hope]

Question
Is it morally right to allow someone who is essentially not thinking logically to make a huge decision such as to commit suicide when they lack the ability to have clear judgement?
What does it mean to have poor judgement anyway? for this question I will use someone whose thought patterns often do not align with reality and frequently switch as an example.

My opinion
I personally value freedom for all to do as to themselves as they please unless they are harming others but for the purpose of this question I will omit the psychological damage done to those surrounding a completed and attempt of suicide as this is another whole topic unto itself.

Why I ask if I have settled on a view?
I ask because I am someone who cannot trust any thoughts regarding myself: I essentially lack the capacity to make any life choices and this has also been the opinion of doctors.
Without going into any personal details I will say I have the mind of a child at times and cannot trust myself.(BPD not intellectually retarded although feels like it)
I have good reason to die due to being plagued by mental health issues that have rendered me entirely dysfunctional only succeeding in failing at improving.

I am not asking other users to encourage me but share your opinion on the topic please. ┬┴┬┴┤･ω･)ﾉ love you guys!!! sorry for asking weird things omg... (*/ω＼)

 

[stygal]

I personally think that even people who lack the ability to have clear judgement in other parts of live (who decides that anyways?) can have a clear judgment when it comes to assess their own situation. Even (terminally) ill children have a right to decide whether they want to keep on living or if their current pain is just too much.
Moreover I think people underestimate the severity of recurring suicidal thoughts. It is such a hard decision to make and nobody thinks about it just on a whim (at least not people who are actually going through with it).
In short: Everyone should have access.

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

Is it morally right to allow someone who is essentially not thinking logically to make a huge decision such as to commit suicide when they lack the ability to have clear judgement?

Unless someone has the power and willingness to take responsibility for them and support them in all the ways they cannot support themselves, or unless that person has the power to take away their misery that motivates them to take their own life, then how dare someone wield power over another in not "allowing" them to take their own life?

It's infantilizing, negating, and unjustifiably, even delusionally, entitled.

Unless they're children, people have the inherent right to fuck up if it doesn't directly impact another, even to the point of accidentally or intentionally ending their own lives. And it's not even that children don't have the right, but that others have the responsibility to care for and protect them. It's one of the dangers of life that people are going to fuck up in small and gigantic ways, and sometimes that means they die. An old joke is that the mating call of the South is, "Hey y'all, watch this!" Sometimes death comes from stupidity, lack of foresight, being misinformed, or not thinking clearly. Death comes to us all one way or another, and almost no way is preferable. But sometimes the discussion is a matter of one preferring others not die, or even that others be denied the right to self-determination; to the former I say, "You need a reality check, it's going to happen," and to the latter I say, "Slavery is immoral and illegal."

Slave "owners" kept slaves alive so they couldn't escape oppression, and denied their right to do so, even their mental capacity. I think sometimes people are mentally enslaved and demand others agree to be mentally enslaved with them, and call them incompetent if they disagree. It's the crabpot fallacy, and the one who escapes is bitterly vilified for doing so, but at least they're out of the boiling pot.

Someone being sad or upset about another dying is not a direct, tangibly measurable impact, it's a personal response to what another does. Unless the person who suicides is directly responsible for the survival of others, they automatically have the right to do what they need or want with regard to their own life or death, without question, whether others agree or not. We do not have to live solely for others' wishes and convenience. An exception is involving another person, such as suicide by train, traffic, or cop, because it is forcing someone else to take direct ownership of a suicide without their informed consent, which would be murder if they gave it; I don't disagree with preventing such suicides, but I also maintain compassion for the person who tried, because I understand desperation.

Other than that, if someone wants to die, and they're not harming another by directly involving them, or violently punishing them by doing it in front of them, then even if it's an unwise choice, suicide is their inherent right.

Craziness, abuse, violence and oppression are all results of trying to control other people instead of oneself.

I think what you're suggesting in the OP is sanctioned oppression.

I don't think suicide needs to be sanctioned at all, it's an inalienable right of every living thing, just as life is -- inalienable in that it cannot be separated from the person who exists, it's a package deal. If someone wants to escape, that's because there's something awful to escape from. If they don't have the practical means or the mental capacity to find a different way to escape, and no one provides another way, then suicide is goddamn sad but it's not a crime.

 

[hoping to lose hope]

Very nice thougt out philosophical argument.I am brain dead at the moment but will read when not so tired and see if I can find any holes.

 

[Gnip]

"Diminished capacity" is how my Catholic mother defines it. If there is a "Hell" other than this realm in which we suffer, then those of us who CTB must be automatically excluded from it, as life is no kind of "gift" for us to have rejected it.

I wish to have the mind of a child, free from the poison of school, peer pressure, the pain of sexual awakening, or any hopes, dreams and aspirations for the future. I miss being a toddler when I looked forward to nothing, but instead lived in the moment, rather than any past or future.

 

[hoping to lose hope]

Brains full of bloatware and social programming it takes so much effort to unravel the memes and we are left with shit for our efforts.

 

[Gnip]

Brains full of bloatware and social programming it takes so much effort to unravel the memes and we are left with shit for our efforts.

Indeed. Why should we not desire to completely unload the poisoned contents of toxic minds, our own and those of others?

 

[hoping to lose hope]

I am fine with others remaining ignorant.
I do get an urge to taint neurotypicals with pessimism though.

 

[Deleted member 17949]

Idk I'm pretty retarded but that won't stop me from trying to jump under a train. From my perspective yeah I should be allowed to die; my thoughts are mine and my feelings show me what I want, so why should anyone police them based on some greater end goal of happiness that I'm not actually interested in?

I guess there's a case to be made for people that struggle with massive internal conflict and don't actually want to die aside from briefly on impulse, but other that that I say let people do what they want.

 

[Gnip]

I am fine with others remaining ignorant.
I do get an urge to taint neurotypicals with pessimism though.

I was purposely brainwashed from birth by an extremely stupid and ignorant bullying father who learned about reverse psychology in college, and also the the core of a person's psyche, their ego, is fully formed by age three. He was and is an idiot who was only able to go to college on the GI Bill after serving in the USMC.

So I can't be fine with the ignorance of others, as it was the ignorance of others who poisoned my mind from birth. (Also, narcissistic parents who name children after themselves should be arrested, and the practice banned into a felony. Children have a right to their own identities, not the self hatred of their parents.)

 

[hoping to lose hope]

Literally nothing wrong with others livin optimistic delusion.
Let anyone do whatever rhye want even to others.. can just ctb. sorry very tired