Righttodie

Righttodie

Maybe in another life
Apr 10, 2019
166
Why did the universe HAVE to exist in the first place and be the way it is(time, space, life, emotions, need for survival)

I mean, it can all have been just a clean blank sheet instead. Death would be maybe nothingness and everything.
Where nothing is everything and everything is nothing.

It's an amazing and profound thought I fall back on as time goes on.

Everyone is welcome to share their thoughts and philosophies on this topic
 
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Soul

Soul

gate gate paragate parasamgate bodhi svaha
Apr 12, 2019
4,704
Have you ever read The Laws of Form by G. Spencer Brown? It approaches that question in a way that's ... well, have a look for yourself.
 
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Righttodie

Righttodie

Maybe in another life
Apr 10, 2019
166
Have you ever read The Laws of Form by G. Spencer Brown? It approaches that question in a way that's ... well, have a look for yourself.
I have learning disabilities. Lack of attention being one, I can't read much. But the book sounds nice. Thanks
 
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Soul

Soul

gate gate paragate parasamgate bodhi svaha
Apr 12, 2019
4,704
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Severen

Severen

Enlightened
Jun 30, 2018
1,819
Why did the universe HAVE to exist in the first place and be the way it is(time, space, life, emotions, need for survival)

I mean, it can all have been just a clean blank sheet instead. Death would be maybe nothingness and everything.
Where nothing is everything and everything is nothing.

It's an amazing and profound thought I fall back on as time goes on.

Everyone is welcome to share their thoughts and philosophies on this topic

For the same reason, people like to torture people in the Sims games... You know, build a swimming pool, wait for someone to get in it and then trap him or her in the pool. Then watch.
 
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Alpha_Draco_Pegasus

Alpha_Draco_Pegasus

Member
Jun 16, 2019
48
I asked that question for a long time. "Why can't there just be nothing?" I've just settled for the answer that nothingness is impossible. There is no such thing as "nothing", never was and never could be. There has always been somethingness because to somethingness, nothingness is inconceivable and impossible.

Since I gave up on philosophy a while ago, restating all of this feels kind of stupid to me. I guess maybe I don't think it's a very good answer anymore, haha... but I'm not saying that this is not a good question. I think it was kind of serene for me when I just accepted "I don't know" as an answer to everything. And also "I don't care" and "It doesn't matter". And now I am passionless and interestless! Not saying it feels great. Not sure how it feels anymore.

I hate to be a downer but you're never going to get your answer. Take your pick on which philosophy appeals most to you. It might be fun to humor some ideas for a while. But I bet it's all wrong. "Who, what, where, why, when and how" could all just be irrelevant questions. Maybe there's a question that we don't even know how to ask yet. If there is, count me interested. That'd be worth sticking around for. It would be like seeing a completely new color. Something that isn't a question, a statement, exclamation, proposition, gesture, concern, request, etc... something ELSE! All of this philosophy we have, to me... it just seems like none of it matters, or at least, understanding any of it would really have no affect on my life.

It's like, if I can't think myself into unexistence, i.e. somehow "consciously uncreate" myself, just thinking about it isn't doing me any good.
 
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ish

ish

Experienced
Jul 20, 2019
268
[QUOTE = "Righttodie, post: 341128, członek: 6989"]
Dlaczego wszechświat MUSI istnieć przede wszystkim i być taki, jaki jest (czas, przestrzeń, życie, emocje, potrzeba przetrwania)

To znaczy, wszystko to mogło być czystym pustym arkuszem. Śmierć może być nicością i wszystkim.
Gdzie nic nie jest wszystkim i wszystko jest niczym.

To niesamowita i głęboka myśl, że z biegiem czasu wracam.

Wszystkich zapraszamy do podzielenia się swoimi przemyśleniami i filozofiami na ten temat
[/ZACYTOWAĆ]
 
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P

pleasethistime

Experienced
Jun 25, 2018
256
imho there is no beginning or end for universe. but i hope when i die i stop existing in terms of conciousness, feeling etc. that s enough for me :) dreamless sleep state is great.
 
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ish

ish

Experienced
Jul 20, 2019
268
The universe is god.
WHO GOD IS - is everything and is unity, it is eternal life (genes undergoing as a result of evolution), and something like a collective
consciousness in everything that lives.
Humanity is a kind of "chosen genre" endowed with the ability to create a civilization (abstract thinking) and further development,
man as an individual is only an animal, subject to the same laws of natural selection as other species on earth,
it is born, dies and in no way is and will not be able to change it, the human soul does not exist, everyone has
the psyche that is shaped and memory, the older one usually fails and has difficulties with acquiring new ones
things, for eternal life, man is only a passing and substitutable element (it can be referred to one grain
cereals on several hundred hectares of cultivation, (for flour 90% for sowing in the next year 10%), civilizational achievements passed from generation to generation
generation, young generations from birth for 20 - 30 and more years acquire the achievements of previous generations, a child having
parents with scientific titles brought up by Amazonians will not know the language of their parents and I will not be able to read and write,
he will be an Indian from the Amazon, reincarnation of the next spun, unless it's just matter and its circulation in the food chain,
If GOD is in a sense interested in humanity, then his interest in a single person is rather
intellectual property is not lost and is passed on to next generations, matter remains in a specific closed cycle.
After each man there is a trace in the memory of the living progeny, and with each subsequent generation he is marginalized, for example, the living remember that the Neanderthals lived but do not know their names, etc.
Nothingness is an abstract concept similar to the concept of zero in mathematics or to the concept of vacuum in space - similar but
not the same.
Is suicide a rebellion against God - probably not, every creature in it and man has a strong instinct for survival
being an obstacle to committing suicide, suffering, pain both psychologically and physically allows to overcome it,
in the case of man, suicidal behavior results rather from the ability to think and assess the situation in which he found himself,
illness, stress, failure and lack of life prospects, age, inevitability of death, it is really the only act of free will
given to the unit. It can be argued but since since science has developed methods of the so-called peaceful death, it would be humane to allow
use them for those who want it, or it is against the law of creation - not because thanks to science this has been achieved,
in any case, no more contradictory than prolonging life through the apparatus, transplants, etc.
 
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Pupuce

Pupuce

Nobody exists on purpose. Come ctb
Apr 19, 2019
282
Why did the universe HAVE to exist in the first place and be the way it is(time, space, life, emotions, need for survival)

I mean, it can all have been just a clean blank sheet instead. Death would be maybe nothingness and everything.
Where nothing is everything and everything is nothing.

It's an amazing and profound thought I fall back on as time goes on.

Everyone is welcome to share their thoughts and philosophies on this topic

Why would the universe need a reason to exist? For the way it is, mainly because it works that way. For all we know we might be in the 985631st universe.
If you want to know, stop thinking and just try to go there and see. We can't just deduce anything about what was there before from what we think right now of the world. And personnaly I think we can't grasp the concept of nothingness as it is even more unnatural to us than quantum mechanics
The emotions and need for survival are here because if they weren't we'd be pretty bad at being still alive.

WHO GOD IS - is everything and is unity, it is eternal life (genes undergoing as a result of evolution), and something like a collective
consciousness in everything that lives.

Humanity is a kind of "chosen genre" endowed with the ability to create a civilization (abstract thinking)

That is some conveniently vague definition of god. And if we had a collective consciousness we woudln't have had so much differences of opinion throughout history.

Humanity is chosen on what precise objective characteristics?
Because animals species have been shown to have some levels of abstract thinking. And if it is because we're better at it, that's some high level of arrogance.
 
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ish

ish

Experienced
Jul 20, 2019
268
[QUOTE = "Pupuce, post: 370904, członek: 7210"]
Dlaczego wszechświat miałby powód, by istnieć? Tak jest, głównie dlatego, że tak działa. Wiemy, że możemy być we wszechświecie 985631.
Jeśli chcesz wiedzieć, przestań myśleć i po prostu spróbuj tam pójść i zobaczyć. Nie możemy po prostu wydedukować niczego z tego, co było wcześniej z tego, co myślimy teraz o świecie. I osobiście uważam, że nie możemy pojąć pojęcia nicości, ponieważ jest to dla nas jeszcze bardziej nienaturalne niż mechanika kwantowa
Emocje i potrzeba przetrwania są tutaj, ponieważ gdyby nie byli, bylibyśmy bardzo źli, gdybyśmy wciąż żyli.



To jest jakaś niewyraźna definicja boga. A gdybyśmy mieli zbiorową świadomość, nie mielibyśmy tak wielu różnic zdań w historii.

Ludzkość jest wybierana na podstawie dokładnych obiektywnych cech?
Ponieważ okazało się, że gatunki zwierząt mają pewne poziomy abstrakcyjnego myślenia. A jeśli to dlatego, że jesteśmy w tym lepsi, to jest to wysoki poziom arogancji.
[/ZACYTOWAĆ]
Poziom kreatywności ludzkości jest udowodniony przez cywilizację iw tym jesteśmy lepsi od innych stworzeń na ziemi, abstrakcyjne myślenie o zwierzętach - pies rozumie polecenia itd.?
BÓG jest zbiorową świadomością.
[QUOTE = "ish, post: 370945, członek: 9407"]
[QUOTE = "Pupuce, post: 370904, członek: 7210"]
Dlaczego wszechświat miałby powód, by istnieć? Tak jest, głównie dlatego, że tak działa. Wiemy, że możemy być we wszechświecie 985631.
Jeśli chcesz wiedzieć, przestań myśleć i po prostu spróbuj tam pójść i zobaczyć. Nie możemy po prostu wydedukować niczego z tego, co było wcześniej z tego, co myślimy teraz o świecie. I osobiście uważam, że nie możemy pojąć pojęcia nicości, ponieważ jest to dla nas jeszcze bardziej nienaturalne niż mechanika kwantowa
Emocje i potrzeba przetrwania są tutaj, ponieważ gdyby nie byli, bylibyśmy bardzo źli, gdybyśmy wciąż żyli.



To jest jakaś niewyraźna definicja boga. A gdybyśmy mieli zbiorową świadomość, nie mielibyśmy tak wielu różnic zdań w historii.

Ludzkość jest wybierana na podstawie dokładnych obiektywnych cech?
Ponieważ okazało się, że gatunki zwierząt mają pewne poziomy abstrakcyjnego myślenia. A jeśli to dlatego, że jesteśmy w tym lepsi, to jest to wysoki poziom arogancji.
[/ZACYTOWAĆ]
Poziom kreatywności ludzkości jest udowodniony przez cywilizację iw tym jesteśmy lepsi od innych stworzeń na ziemi, abstrakcyjne myślenie o zwierzętach - pies rozumie polecenia itd.?
BOGA świadomość zbiorowa nie jest człowiekiem.
Różnorodność opinii powoduje konflikt, ale jest to potężna siła
rozwój napędowy.
[/ZACYTOWAĆ]
Why would the universe need a reason to exist? For the way it is, mainly because it works that way. For all we know we might be in the 985631st universe.
If you want to know, stop thinking and just try to go there and see. We can't just deduce anything about what was there before from what we think right now of the world. And personnaly I think we can't grasp the concept of nothingness as it is even more unnatural to us than quantum mechanics
The emotions and need for survival are here because if they weren't we'd be pretty bad at being still alive.



That is some conveniently vague definition of god. And if we had a collective consciousness we woudln't have had so much differences of opinion throughout history.

Humanity is chosen on what precise objective characteristics?
Because animals species have been shown to have some levels of abstract thinking. And if it is because we're better at it, that's some high level of arrogance.
The level of creativity of humanity is proved by civilization and in this we are better than other creatures on earth, abstract thinking of animals - the dog understands commands, etc.?
GOD collective consciousness is not a man.
Diversity of opinions causes conflict, but it is a powerful force
driving development.
 
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D

DoneWithThis

Student
Jul 20, 2019
125
My opinion. Whether right or wrong. Which, well, in an subjective present experience reality, doesn't matter either way. But... that being said. I like the story of the Myth Of Creation by Jed Mckenna from his book Dreamstate Conspiracy. The whole thing from Nothingness to Somethingness.



I'm sure some of you will like it.
 
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B

Black_Knight

Member
Jul 10, 2019
79
Nothingness is so incomprehensible to me I can't even. What I wonder is if there are things that psuedo-exist (for lack of a better term, I wouldn't even know how to refer to these "things" as I can't begin to guess their "nature"), like a "state" of "being" that is outside causality, events, things happening, stuff being there. When existence is all that there is it suddenly seems incredibly finite, like there are an infinite number of flavors of ice cream and that is superficially joyful but everything is ice cream, forever and always. What "else" is "there"? And the idea that this may have been happening for forever. Complete madness. I guess my answer, which isn't a very intellectual one, to the question of why things exist is what else is there to do? I'm willing to bet that existence under different circumstances can be a lot more bearable than what we experience as humans and things like that. In such a state there would be no reason to question it. An entertaining thought, that I don't really understand, is that nothing actually exists at all and we're just pretending. If existence is not eternal, once it exhausts itself it'll be as if it never happened and so it will have never happened. Existence would be a distraction from the fact that nothing exists. More madness.

For the same reason, people like to torture people in the Sims games... You know, build a swimming pool, wait for someone to get in it and then trap him or her in the pool. Then watch.
You mean god is a bored 12 year old? I suppose anything is possible. (please don't smite me)
 
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ish

ish

Experienced
Jul 20, 2019
268
What we perceive as people, and what is a wider reality is two different things, for example, people believed in the past that the land is
flat and that winter is the stationary center of the universe. Current science presents the universe as we know it, it does not necessarily have to
reflect the state of the fierce, the universe known to us can be
a particle of something bigger, it's also possible that certain things only exist
in the consciousness, for example, nothingness - something that is really difficult to define is
abstract concept, such a reference state that does not exist realistically
in relation to human perception. We say - not in an empty box
it's got nothing, and it's contractual, 99.99% will say it's true, 0.01% will find it
in this box, atmospheric air, dust particles, etc. Basically everyone is right. In our abstract reasoning
99.99% will accept that the opposite of nothingness is something, anything, material, 0.01% will take into account the intangible thought,
idea, consciousness. Further thinking abstractly aware of theirs
we accept that SOMETHING (GOD) always existed, and this is also a peculiar contradiction of nothingness. But even the abstraction of thinking does not allow us to visualize how to create matter from non-material things (thought, consciousness, idea), it exceeds the possibilities of human abstract thinking.
For us, people are limes, boundaries and nothing our effort in this direction,
we will not go any further. We are on our planet like bacteria
grown in the lab on a gelatin base in a container.
Well, the fact that the universe does not exist, if everything that lives
in the world, you feel both physical and mental pain.
 
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howard

howard

Experienced
Sep 13, 2019
268
I asked that question for a long time. "Why can't there just be nothing?" I've just settled for the answer that nothingness is impossible. There is no such thing as "nothing", never was and never could be. There has always been somethingness because to somethingness, nothingness is inconceivable and impossible.

Since I gave up on philosophy a while ago, restating all of this feels kind of stupid to me. I guess maybe I don't think it's a very good answer anymore, haha... but I'm not saying that this is not a good question. I think it was kind of serene for me when I just accepted "I don't know" as an answer to everything. And also "I don't care" and "It doesn't matter". And now I am passionless and interestless! Not saying it feels great. Not sure how it feels anymore.

I hate to be a downer but you're never going to get your answer. Take your pick on which philosophy appeals most to you. It might be fun to humor some ideas for a while. But I bet it's all wrong. "Who, what, where, why, when and how" could all just be irrelevant questions. Maybe there's a question that we don't even know how to ask yet. If there is, count me interested. That'd be worth sticking around for. It would be like seeing a completely new color. Something that isn't a question, a statement, exclamation, proposition, gesture, concern, request, etc... something ELSE! All of this philosophy we have, to me... it just seems like none of it matters, or at least, understanding any of it would really have no affect on my life.

It's like, if I can't think myself into unexistence, i.e. somehow "consciously uncreate" myself, just thinking about it isn't doing me any good.
I simplify it into nothing is something itself. The normal natural state is of nothing. All this stuff is a tiny temporary bubble inside the nothing. There may be lots of the little bubbles.
 
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J

jgm63

Visionary
Oct 28, 2019
2,467
Philosophies require thought and therefore have no reality.
There is only the direct experience of what is, now.
Something can only be true if you experience it yourself, now.
So the only intelligent action is to perceive what is now, without thought.
And that might eventually lead you to true knowledge.
But first you might have to pass through the agony of the mind dying.
 
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TheAmazingCriswell

TheAmazingCriswell

I predict...
Apr 28, 2021
1,351
This thread might be old, but it is still interesting.
 
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