Loneliness is just lack of power

[JustSwingingTheD]

I'm an unattractive, socially awkward male so it's difficult for me to find female company. I describe myself as socially awkward but the way i see it myself, that's not the whole truth. Because of my autism I'm quite sensitive by nature. Lying doesn't come naturally to me, if we don't count lying to the self. Because of this it's hard for me to find much common ground with most people. I detest "group mentality", hiding yourself into crowds full of like-minded people. It's very common behaviour but I find it disgusting. That's why most of the time i didn't much even want to try to fit in.

The way i see it, getting any kind of company is all about having some kind of power over others. You can sugarcoat it all you want but that's what it comes down to. Good looks, money, connections, certain kind of character and/or services that you have are all different forms of power.

I don't really have much when it comes to any of these things. I find people who seek my company mostly physically unattractive. These things don't seem to work out fairly when it comes to looks. Everyone says being unattractive as a female is more difficult. But i've known non-wealthy, unattractive women with normal looking or even attractive partners. Not much the other way around. Maybe i haven't paid enough attention. The way I experience physical attraction it's easy to look past unattractive qualities that you yourself have (for me atleast). For example, i have a bite problem and that has severely affected my looks. I could overlook that same problem in a potential partner. Another example, I'm normal weight, and severely overweight women i just can't find attractive. Even if i was willing to overlook the issue for some reason, would that be fair to those women? Would they feel good about themselves knowing that i can't find them attractive? I wouldn't want my partner to see me that way, i would rather be alone.

I'm close to thirty but i don't feel like i'm my age because of the chronic loneliness i've experienced all my life. I feel fourteen and i feel fourty-nine. I feel like nothing. Time doesn't mean anything when nothing changes. I don't feel like I'm living, just alive. In a way, it's already over, i'm an old man and soon to be dead. One way or another, it doesn't really matter. That's why i wish i could just get over with it and end it now. Every passing year, every passing day, i keep getting more and more bitter for the lies that have been planted in my head. Rooting them up is ungrateful work.

 

[Ethereal Knight]

as an incel I can understand your will to CTB, life without affection, touch and sex really is miserable.
we can stand it for some time but the tendency overtime is to breakdown and start feeling terrible.

Not much the other way around.

life is unfair. both sexes have their perks and problems, but overall nature doesn't care about making us happy, it just wants us to reproduce, and survive long enough so we can do that.
it's literally using us for its own purpose, selfishly.

 

[HappyForever?]

As someone permanently single (I prefer not to use the word "incel" because of the negative connotations) I totally understand how you feel. I find it absurd how people are so preoccupied with looks, and I abhor those who value appearance above anything else when it comes to finding a partner.

For example, i have a bite problem and that has severely affected my looks.

I think you can get surgery for this.

I don't really have much when it comes to any of these things. I find people who seek my company mostly physically unattractive. These things don't seem to work out fairly when it comes to looks. Everyone says being unattractive as a female is more difficult. But i've known non-wealthy, unattractive women with normal looking or even attractive partners. Not much the other way around. Maybe i haven't paid enough attention.

Frankly from what I have seen men in relationships look less attractive than their partners on average. Maybe it's because the lack of makeup.

 

[Rational man]

You dont place much emphasis on the honest and sensitive sides of you. You see it as negative but you see the postive in attractiveness and wealth. Not that j disagree but its sad when PEOPLE can't see beyond the "cover of a book".

 

[Stuckaf2]

I am in the same boat. If I was extremely rich handsome tall then I would never been suicidal. Ppl will just love me and not allow me to lose in life. Ppl don't like seeing perfect ppl fail and will do anything to lift them up and put them on the right track. I can't wait for my sn to be here and leave this shithole. God could've blessed me too but he chose not to.

 

[Cosmic dust]

As someone permanently single (I prefer not to use the word "incel" because of the negative connotations) I totally understand how you feel. I find it absurd how people are so preoccupied with looks, and I abhor those who value appearance above anything else when it comes to finding a partner.

I think you can get surgery for this.

Frankly from what I have seen men in relationships look less attractive than their partners on average. Maybe it's because the lack of makeup.

Men generally care less about their own looks than women, but you rarely see people with partners too much under their "level", as in a combination of social position/looks/money/education.

I am under the impression that this happens, at least partly, because the individual person knows that this is how to rest of the society thinks, so he feels that he is losing his value, if he accepts someone who is ugly and/or lack enough value.

 

[cringelord111]

yeah same

 

[whatevs]

In my case I am a 6,5/10 in looks and have an interesting conversation/women have proven to be interested at times but chronic illness has made me a powerless, lonely incel in a different way.

I think the view of the OP of relationships being purely about a power struggle is limited. Oftentimes people like each other's company or have tender feelings of camaraderie and loyalty, the power struggle is there but is not everything.

These dark and cynical worldviews are typically developed as a reaction to a life of disadvantage and social alienation. They are truthful but skewed.

 

[JustSwingingTheD]

I think the view of the OP of relationships being purely about a power struggle is limited. Oftentimes people like each other's company or have tender feelings of camaraderie and loyalty, the power struggle is there but is not everything.

These dark and cynical worldviews are typically developed as a reaction to a life of disadvantage and social alienation. They are truthful but skewed.

You have to see that the power struggle exists, even if people dont want to acknowledge it, or feel that it's besides the point.

 

[whatevs]

You have to see that the power struggle exists, even if people dont want to acknowledge it, or feel that it's besides the point.

Is that why you swing your D like that, to assert your dominance?

 

[JustSwingingTheD]

Is that why you swing your D like that, to assert your dominance?

Yeah maybe. Be careful or i will swing it to your face.

 

[whatevs]

Yeah maybe. Be careful or i will swing it to your face.

You have to see that the power struggle exists, even if people dont want to acknowledge it, or feel that it's besides the point.

The power struggle DOES exist, I'm just saying, not everything in human interactions is a competition. Some people complement each other, care for each other, share their lowest and highest points, etc. Not everyone is out to dominate you, even though it's sadly commonplace.

 

[JustSwingingTheD]

The power struggle DOES exist, I'm just saying, not everything in human interactions is a competition. Some people complement each other, care for each other, share their lowest and highest points, etc. Not everyone is out to dominate you, even though it's sadly commonplace.

Sure thing. I just think that the life experiences involving domination, or attempted domination, make such a profound effect on our character development that everything else hardly matters in the comparison.

 

[whatevs]

Sure thing. I just think that the life experiences involving domination, or attempted domination, make such a profound effect on our character development that everything else hardly matters in the comparison.

What about relationships based on sympathy? Are you taking that into consideration?

If I scan my past friendships etc I find what you speak about but also other elements that are not negligible but rather consubstantial to the relationship. I find that people liked me, they pitied me, they identified with me, all sorts of things.

Why frame any of that as "power over others"? It certainly can be yielded AS power, but let's see... Your mother had the 'power' of drowning you when you were a kid, right? But wasn't more relevant that your mother loved and cared for you than how she completely owned you like parents do with kids? The dominance aspect was there as it always is but it wasn't what defined the relationship.

 

[Efilismislife]

Sympathy clearly a result of someone below them how could you compare them
also it depends on how high you can go with only sympathy to dominate?? It could but very hard. Compare to power, status, money, etc. Like thats an instant domination.

fact that many people feel sympathy to people starve/poor/sick but just ignore them
But when it comes to people with power? Funny...

obviously OP talks about looks which is the main attractive traits to dating. And its a power.

Obviously there are many mothers that abuse their helpless child?? Maybe you cant see it if youre living a perfect life

Parents care for their children because its THEIRS. But most and many parents also very dominating to their children

What about relationships based on sympathy? Are you taking that into consideration?


Why frame any of that as "power over others"? It certainly can be yielded AS power, but let's see... Your mother had the 'power' of drowning you when you were a kid, right? But wasn't more relevant that your mother loved and cared for you than how she completely owned you like parents do with kids? The dominance aspect was there as it always is but it wasn't what defined the relationship.

 

[locked*n*loaded]

Sure a lot of rationalizing and sugar-coating going on here. Do good looking women yield power over men. Sure, they can, and some do. Most hetero men would like a real dish on their arm. But, I say, call this for what it is and that is shallowness. Pure and simple. It's the inability, or unwillingness, to look past the superficial and acknowledge that even if a person is ugly on the outside, that the character of who they are, is, and should be, much more important. And I am guilty of the same thing, so I'm not sitting here in any way, shape, or form tooting my own horn. It's inherent in ALL humans to seek out those that we perceive to have the best genes for reproduction, even if procreating is not even the purpose towards those we are seeking. It's been ingrained in us over the course of evolution. The OP stated that he doesn't like fat, ugly women, but he could overlook a bite problem as long as the woman was not fat and was good looking. Yeah, even with a bit problem she could still be good looking, I'm sure. It would be difficult for him to preclude women with a bite problem because he, himself, has one. But, he's not fat, so he can rationalize that since he isn't fat, then why does he have to accept someone who is fat. If the OP won't look past the "physical unattractiveness" of women he mentions who "seek his company", then how, or why, should it be expected for some "hot" woman to look past his own self described unattractiveness? You have to get passed the idea that women are only a piece of meat! My last gf wasn't all that great looking face-wise. She did have a fairly nice body, though. I'm not going to try and compare her face "value" with mine and say it was equal, or better, or worse. I only mentioned this to say that never once did I tell her that I didn't think her face was all that attractive. Why would you tell someone that? Even when we fought I didn't tell her that. I heard what the OP said about his autism and that it's hard for him to lie. Not mentioning something is not lying. It's sparing someone's feelings from being unnecessarily hurt. And that shallowness is a character flaw, pure and simple. And I understand that the heart wants what the heart wants. It may not be attainable. Honestly, I don't think that's enough reason to ctb. Look around you. You see all kind of what most people would consider unattractive women with unattractive guys. How did they do it? Do you think they have a completely different idea of what attractive is than we do? I doubt it. People know an attractive person when they see them. Notwithstanding whateves, who, as self-described, may be the most attractive person on the face of the earth , we ugly people need to get passed the shallowness and grow our character to understand that people are far more than their skin covering and bone structure and still have worth even if they're less than attractive. Looks fade over time. Hell, we may even have an advantage over the pretty people in one respect over time. Those pretty people of the world may have a harder time watching their looks fade as the years roll by. We, on the other hand, the ugly ones, really never have to worry about that.

 

[Klo]

This would be sympathetic except that you think you are entitled to company that you find attractive. Nobody is entitled to that and if you just wanted company you would find it by being a decent person. I understand not being able to be fake. A lot of us didn't get the memo that that is way of the world and now that I understand it I don't want to participate in that way of life.

The thinking you are indulging in about who's attractive and who isn't is poison and you will never find any value in life with that mindset. Don't blame your poisonous thinking on autism either that is a cop out.

 

[JustSwingingTheD]

Why frame any of that as "power over others"? It certainly can be yielded AS power, but let's see... Your mother had the 'power' of drowning you when you were a kid, right? But wasn't more relevant that your mother loved and cared for you than how she completely owned you like parents do with kids? The dominance aspect was there as it always is but it wasn't what defined the relationship.

I don't know where you live but im not aware of a single country where the parents legally "completely owns" their kids, and can even drown them without landing in jail. Aside from that obvious fact I find it funny that you should use this as an example of a basis to a relationship alternative to domination. Having kids is not about love and care, what you need is some love and care in order to have a situation where you have 2 people who are 1) either willing to take care of the kids, a lot of work for ???, that means love and care 2) thinking that they can push the responsibility over taking care of the kids to the other party.

Even in cases where these requirements are fulfilled (they don't always do, as accidents do happen), there is a lot of narcissism going on in there and a quite lot of other selfish motives too. Having kids with someone is often a lot about attaching them to you in a permanent way, that is a one big purely selfish motive. Domination is a huge part of many mother/father and child relationships and in many cases it can be argued that it defines the relationship.

This would be sympathetic except that you think you are entitled to company that you find attractive.

I do not attempt to be sympathetic. Where do i state that im entitled to that kind of company? Being entitled to something, and refusing to live without something are two different things. I'm refusing to live without sex. Life without it is dull, boring, and unsatisfying. I suspect it's those things to many people who do have as much sex as they want, (in fact i know this) but i wouldn't really know, since i've never had. I'm also refusing to have sex with people i find unattractive, and i'm by no means picky about this.

Nobody is entitled to that and if you just wanted company you would find it by being a decent person.

So you are saying lonely people are basically all just awful people? That's hilarious.

The thinking you are indulging in about who's attractive and who isn't is poison and you will never find any value in life with that mindset. Don't blame your poisonous thinking on autism either that is a cop out.

It's not poison. It's facts. Maybe the part about women having it better was a bit poisonous, but it was more an observation than an opinion, and can pretty easily be changed. You are reading it wrong

If a person is ugly on the outside, that the character of who they are, is, and should be, much more important.

I'm not that shallow. I've met hot girls i wouldn't touch with a ten foot pole after learning to know them and spending time around them. That doesn't mean i wouldn't have had sex with them before learning to know them. That is just human.

And I am guilty of the same thing

So what the hell are you preaching about?

so I'm not sitting here in any way, shape, or form tooting my own horn.

Yeah, you kind of are

If the OP won't look past the "physical unattractiveness" of women he mentions who "seek his company", then how, or why, should it be expected for some "hot" woman to look past his own self described unattractiveness?

I think I was pretty clear about what i'm after in life and this was not it.

You have to get passed the idea that women are only a piece of meat!

Yeah, it's just that they are just pieces of meat. As am I.

Not mentioning something is not lying. It's sparing someone's feelings from being unnecessarily hurt. And that shallowness is a character flaw, pure and simple.

Aside from the fact that physical attraction is the basis of almost every sexual relationship (generally all of them except those that are about money), in what relationship people don't discuss stuff like "do you find me attractive" or "what things about my do you find attractive"? Wouldn't that require me to lie? Besides, if i didn't make it clear, I'm not "lonely, lonely". I'm "horny lonely". I'm not looking for someone to watch movies with, I'm looking for someone to blow me. If i don't find that someone attractive, what is the point of the relationship?

Looks fade over time. Hell, we may even have an advantage over the pretty people in one respect over time. Those pretty people of the world may have a harder time watching their looks fade as the years roll by. We, on the other hand, the ugly ones, really never have to worry about that.

Just because looks fade doesn't mean they stop mattering at some point. I wish people stopped saying this shit, it's so stupid. Besides, wrinkly skin alone doesn't make anyone unattractive.

 

[WorthlessTrash]

Frankly from what I have seen men in relationships look less attractive than their partners on average. Maybe it's because the lack of makeup.

Women in general are attractive and men are not (at least I can't find men attractive) so to me this is true.

So you are saying lonely people are basically all just awful people? That's hilarious.

Not what they are saying. They're saying that if someone doesn't like you/find you appealing, they just don't. Nothing right or wrong about it. People just have their preferences and life certainly doesn't exist to be fair, especially to us lonely people.