It would be nice to have a thumbs down react in addition to hmpf!

[GoodPersonEffed]

Sometimes I disagree with a post, but I'm not angry about it! Having an angry-looking hmpf react as the only means to disagree, without writing a treatise about disgreeing, is emotional, and can provoke negative emotional reactions in others. It just seems unnecessarily inflammatory. And no, a treatise isn't necessary, but just commenting about disagreeing can derail a thread.

When someone gives good advice to an OP's question, lots of like reacts can show that others agree with the advice without having to make the effort of posting the same thing, and the OP can see it's an opinion that's supported/agreed upon by many. If someone gives bad advice, a bunch of thumbs down responses can have the same effect.

@Marquis
@Hasssssuùuu

 

[FriendofDeath]

Sometimes I actually laugh or smile on here and wish we had a gentle smile to post. There are some pretty witty people on this site.

 

[Pryras]

I had a yahoo answers acc over a decade ago before they swapped whoever was in charged and screwed over their forum interface with unnecessary changes.

There was a good system of thumbs up / down that I think worked well. The answers riddled with thumbs down were left at the bottom of the threads but still viewable.

I'm sure great answers will get some negative reacts but generally there's a consensus on here at least with the forum regulars/longer term members that certain information is more accurate and helpful than others. I think it would be useful for the OP and new members that aren't exactly aware of the ABCs of this sort of topic.

 

[Soulless_Angel]

They removed the laughing emoji as it was abused, I do think the same could be said about the angry emoji,
I agree with a different version would be so much better, I am going to assume though they may be limited on what the options are.
I would love this one as a reaction tbh!
When there are simply no words!

 

[Hennessy]

I fear that a thumbs down function only will raise the treshold for people to post. Many people will not dare to post any independent thoughts.

Also, I have seen on other forums that thumbs down functions only make people angry on each other and starts a "thumbs down war".

I think a thumbs down function will do more harm than good.

 

[FusRohDracarys]

I fear that a thumbs down function only will raise the treshold for people to post. Many people will not dare to post any independent thoughts.

Also, I have seen on other forums that thumbs down functions only make people angry on each other and starts a "thumbs down war".

I think a thumbs down function will do more harm than good.

I fully agree. I suspect a thumbs down feature would make this place a more hostile space, especially given the influx of younger members who are already inclined to treat this space like social media. Hopefully we're all fairly aware of the toxic nature prevalent in social media platforms and how some young people tie their self worth to their likes/follows, so I would be concerned people might come here and feel worse about themselves for sharing their authentic selves.

 

[Simba]

It might all end up being making posts just to get as many likes and what not .. im 23 and i don't care much about these stuff.. i don't have much of a social life anyways so who am i to say :(

 

[Deleted member 1465]

#suicidaltwitter

 

[Deleted member 1465]

Likes go unnoticed, dislikes don't.

Exactly. Hence toxic social media. What's more important, self expression or a friendlier environment?

 

[FusRohDracarys]

Exactly. Hence toxic social media. What's more important, self expression or a friendlier environment?

Personally, I don't feel like omitting a thumbs down feature necessarily limits self expression. I think it just puts the onus on the individual to "read the room," so to speak. What will the impact of posting in this thread be? Will it be inflammatory, cause arguments, and eventually get the thread locked? Will it promote intellectual discussion with healthy exchange of differing opinions? Members are still free to share their views, but perhaps not in that particular thread. And if someone's views on a particular subject are strong enough that it's worth expressing their dissent or opposition, then I believe that it should be well worth the level of effort required to create an articulate post explaining your position or even just bickering with someone in the same thread. In that regard, thumbs down just seems low effort and passive aggressive to me since you're not really expressing yourself as much as just crapping on someone else who is.

 

[Deleted member 1465]

Personally, I don't feel like omitting a thumbs down feature necessarily limits self expression. I think it just puts the onus on the individual to "read the room," so to speak. What will the impact of posting in this thread be? Will it be inflammatory, cause arguments, and eventually get the thread locked? Will it promote intellectual discussion with healthy exchange of differing opinions? Members are still free to share their views, but perhaps not in that particular thread. And if someone's views on a particular subject are strong enough that it's worth expressing their dissent or opposition, then I believe that it should be well worth the level of effort required to create an articulate post explaining your position or even just bickering with someone in the same thread. In that regard, thumbs down just seems low effort and passive aggressive to me since you're not really expressing yourself as much as just crapping on someone else who is.

Fair point. Thumbs up could be seen as low effort too, but who cares as it's positive, so meh. But thumbs down is negative so merits more effort to explain.

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

In that regard, thumbs down just seems low effort and passive aggressive to me since you're not really expressing yourself as much as just crapping on someone else who is.

I was into your comment until this. This is being a like a mind-reader, but it's not accurate.

(Not trying to be harsh here, I'm just pretty dry today in how I'm expressing myself. I think you're someone I don't have to be extra soft with, and that we both can be assertive without taking it as aggression.)

As @Underscore said, a like can be low-effort, and for me, yeah, sometimes I low-effort agree, especially if the point has been made; I don't need to say it again. I would also like to low-effort disagree sometimes. There's nothing behind that, no ill will, no crapping.

And that goes back to my OP: I feel like my only options are to make effort when I don't want to, or seem angry and aggressive when I'm not.

I'm not married to my point of view in suggesting a thumbs-down react, though. I've been reading all of the responses here, and I feel no hmpf! whatsoever. I think this is a good discussion.

 

[Brick In The Wall]

I think these sort of reacts will cause issues as mentioned by a few posters already. Suicide is a very delicate subject.

Society already shuns us, we shouldn't be looking to create tension amongst ourselves.

 

[FusRohDracarys]

I was into your comment until this. This is being a like a mind-reader, but it's not accurate.

(Not trying to be harsh here, I'm just pretty dry today in how I'm expressing myself. I think you're someone I don't have to be extra soft with, and that we both can be assertive without taking it as aggression.)

As @Underscore said, a like can be low-effort, and for me, yeah, sometimes I low-effort agree, especially if the point has been made; I don't need to say it again. I would also like to low-effort disagree sometimes. There's nothing behind that, no ill will, no crapping.

And that goes back to my OP: I feel like my only options are to make effort when I don't want to, or seem angry and aggressive when I'm not.

I'm not married to my point of view in suggesting a thumbs-down react, though. I've been reading all of the responses here, and I feel no hmpf! whatsoever. I think this is a good discussion.

Ah, perhaps "crapping on" was a bit harsh to begin with. Please forgive me for lacking your eloquence with words, heh. I've followed your posts since I joined the forum and it's clear that you put a lot of thought into what you say and can articulate it very well. Given what I know about how you interact with members and also the effort you've put into other posts, I trust that you wouldn't abuse a thumbs down feature as I described, so my comment wasn't at all geared towards you or anyone specifically, for that matter. However, I can think of only maybe two or three other members who can and do communicate in the same capacity that you do. My point was more geared towards those who would be more liberal with their thumbs down--ie, the general forum at large. I do not like the thought of this place turning into a reddit, with the all too prevalent "Edit: Why the thumbs down???" By "crapping on other people's opinions," I simply mean the culture of silencing whatever we disagree with. If someone wishes to do that, then they should feel empowered to use the ignore button as liberally as they wish. However, making people who already feel bad about themselves feel worse for having their own thoughts and feelings seems like it warrants more than just a "silently judging you" thumbs down.*

Edit: * from the perspective of the recipient of the downvote

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

I think these sort of reacts will cause issues as mentioned by a few posters already. Suicide is a very delicate subject.

Society already shuns us, we shouldn't be looking to create tension amongst ourselves.

Okay then, should we not have a hmpf! react? Is that perhaps a better solution for the community? I'm not poking at you, I'm not defensive at all; I'm taking your point at face value and working with it. Since this site focuses on a delicate subject, should we have no disagree react whatsoever, and remove the one that is aggressive in tone, and also not have one that is neutral in tone?

 

[Gaius_Baltar]

my all time favorite 'not too insulting disagree or don't care what you think' smilie

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

@FusRohDracarys, great reply overall, thanks for clarifying and, as always, being civil.

I do not like the thought of this place turning into a reddit, with the all too prevalent "Edit: Why the thumbs down???"

I hear what you're saying. There have been many times on this forum when I've seen, "Why the angry react?" But usually people are good enough to answer. I think it's a valid question: "Why did you respond this way?"

I recognize that sometimes folks don't like being questioned, I seem to be a rarity in that I value people questioning me, and I say so, and I respond. That's not me putting myself on a pedestal, I had to work for that, and it's served me well to overcome defensiveness, to feel stronger in the ability to ask questions, and to really live how much I think questioning everything is valuable. If I can't take being questioned, then I can't in good conscience question others.

By "crapping on other people's opinions," I simply mean the culture of silencing whatever we disagree with. If someone wishes to do that, then they should feel empowered to use the ignore button as liberally as they wish. However, making people who already feel bad about themselves feel worse for having their own thoughts and feelings seems like it warrants more than just a "silently judging you" thumbs down.*

I hear you, but at the same time, I hear my own thoughts, too. I don't often see on the forum that people get judged for having their own thoughts or feelings, it's highly prized here because we who consider suicide get judged and thumbs down irl all the time. Opinions and bad information, however, do get argued against (and sometimes get angry reacts). I've actually observed that arguing, doubting, dissenting, and questioning on this forum get shamed and silenced.

I also personally think it's dangerous to tiptoe around everyone's potentially hurt feelings and therefore not disagree, not reason, and not say when they sense an aroma of bovine excrement in the air. We're all adults here, and we're responsible for our own feelings, thoughts, and reactions to others when it's not at the level of trolling, but if something crosses the line, that's what mods are for. I've personally reported hmpf! reacts that were meant solely to provoke or to abuse, and the mods have always deleted them.

The laugh react was removed because some people were abusing it for sarcasm. Hmpf! reacts can be inflammatory but the mods are managing them. I still feel like a thumbs down is rather benign and emotionless, and gives a voice just as much as a like does.

And taking it a bit further, thumbs down reacts could be used if ever again there are power factions on the forum, but like and love reacts can and have been used in the same way, and that's when the forum turns into a social media popularity and power play platform rather than a suicide discussion platform. (If you disagree with my point of view, that's cool, but can I get props for all that alliteration?)

 

[Living sucks]

I don't think there should be any negative react buttons.. only positive ones because i prefer calling someone an asshole directly.

but joking aside i think a thumbs down is better than an angry react. I don't think it would be abused but i don't think there should be both.

 

[Brick In The Wall]

@GoodPersonEffed and @Brick In The Wall sitting in a tree, K I S S I N G:

I suggest the site add some commonly used gifs.

Oh, the aggressive tone of disagree reacts can be removed by humor. Even "fuck u" can look cute:

Edit: I'm drunk, I get a free pass.

Actually we don't interact anymore. But it's cute and I'm glad to hear from you.

 

[Living sucks]

Also i feel the angry react is misused.. someone posted about the people jumping from a structure into water and they were hurt but lived. Someone tagged an angry react to it.. so I asked why? The person was defensive that i asked why and said it was bcuz the people weren't successful at ctb.

i see it as being angry or in disagreement with the OP but some use it like a thumbs down.

 

[FusRohDracarys]

@GoodPersonEffed
And thank you for the opportunity for a stimulating discussion!

I recognize that sometimes folks don't like being questioned, I seem to be a rarity in that I value people questioning me, and I say so, and I respond. That's not me putting myself on a pedestal, I had to work for that, and it's served me well to overcome defensiveness, to feel stronger in the ability to ask questions, and to really live how much I think questioning everything is valuable. If I can't take being questioned, then I can't in good conscience question others.

I commend you for your self empowering growth. Those are some really great qualities that we as a society could really benefit from having more of. There are one or two things I would like to point out as to why people might not respond quite like that. For one, there are many people here who suffer from anxiety. Perhaps it's a struggle you're also familiar with and have pushed through, but you seem someone who has a very strong grasp on your identity and self worth at this point in time. For many people anxiety can be a shadow that colors how they see the world. People with social anxiety, especially, are prone to over analyzing and attributing negative intent to the actions of people around them. Combine that with the fact that with being on a text based forum where it's harder to read non-verbal cues and you have people feeling personally attacked by imagined ill-intent.

Anecdotally, I have a friend who has anxiety to the point where it is impossible to have a debate or discussion over dissenting opinions because it will trigger a panic attack. When texting this person, I have to be very careful with how I frame my words because what I consider a simple question can easily turn into an insult to their sense of self. Now, I don't know to what degree of extremes my friend falls under, but considering the type of forum we're in, it wouldn't surprise me if there were more than few people who react in such a way. So while I respect the qualities you're describing, I also appreciate that you can recognize that not everyone responds in kind. Perhaps you're already pretty knowledgeable about these things, but if not, I hope this might offer some insight to the defensiveness.

I hear you, but I hear my own thoughts, too. I don't often see on the forum that people get judged for having their own thoughts or feelings, it's highly prized here because we who consider suicide get judged and thumbs down irl all the time. Opinions and bad information, however, do get argued against (and sometimes get angry reacts). I've actually observed that arguing, doubting, dissenting, and questioning on this forum get shamed and silenced.

I also personally think it's dangerous to tiptoe around everyone's potentially hurt feelings and therefore not disagree, not reason, and not say when they sense an aroma of bovine excrement in the air. We're all adults here, and we're responsible for our own feelings, thoughts, and reactions to others when it's not at the level of trolling, but if something crosses the line, that's what mods are for. I've personally reported hmpf! reacts that were meant solely to provoke or to abuse, and the mods have always deleted them.

Good points. I honestly can't think of either anything to add to what you've said or counter it, so I'll leave it at that.

The laugh react was removed because some people were abusing it for sarcasm. Hmpf! reacts can be inflammatory but the mods are managing them. I still feel like a thumbs down is rather benign and emotionless, and gives a voice just as much as a like does.

And taking it a bit further, thumbs down reacts could be used if ever again there are power factions on the forum, but like and love reacts can and have been used in the same way, and that's when the forum turns into a social media popularity and power play platform rather than a suicide discussion platform. (If you disagree with my point of view, that's cool, but can I get props for all that alliteration?)

I've heard people talk about the power play thing a few times here, but I must confess, if it happens, it goes over my head.

Unfortunately, the laugh react was before my time here so I can't really offer any real input on the matter. One question I have with Hmph! is, because it's a stronger reaction than a simple thumbs down, does that make people think twice about whether or not it's worth using it? My suspicion is that because thumbs down seems milder, people will be more comfortable using it more liberally. But actually, after all this discussion, I'm quite interested to see how a thumbs down button would be received by the community. I mean, I don't expect it would be incredibly difficult to take it down if people did end up abusing it so it may be worth a trial.

Oh, and yes, nicely done with the alliteration! ;)

 

[FriendofDeath]

They removed the laughing emoji as it was abused, I do think the same could be said about the angry emoji,
I agree with a different version would be so much better, I am going to assume though they may be limited on what the options are.
I would love this one as a reaction tbh!
When there are simply no words!

Good to know about the laughing emoji. Sorry it was abused. Just see a lot of answers on unserious topics that deserve a laugh or smile! :)

Also i feel the angry react is misused.. someone posted about the people jumping from a structure into water and they were hurt but lived. Someone tagged an angry react to it.. so I asked why? The person was defensive that i asked why and said it was bcuz the people weren't successful at ctb.

i see it as being angry or in disagreement with the OP but some use it like a thumbs down.

Yes the angry emoji threw me. There have been times I wanted to express solidarity for someone's post if they are frustrated or are experiencing alot of pain or abuse. I don't use it because I don't like what someone says.

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

One question I have with Hmph! is, because it's a stronger reaction than a simple thumbs down, does that make people think twice about whether or not it's worth using it?

I've wondered this, too.