Involuntary psych ward hold rules(US)

[DreamEnd]

Hey I tried to google this but don't really understand it. If someone you know, your friend or parent calls in and says you are suicidal etc can they involuntary take you in? How many times can they do that and for how long? Is there a way I can avoid it?

 

[MatrixPrisoner]

Every state is different. In my state of Florida there is no limit on frequency or length of stay. Just the mere insinuation of suicidality to a medical professional or law enforecement officer will get you put in - and it's non-negotiable. You're basically in there until they deem you fit for discharge. Prison for the mentally ill.

States With Involuntary Commitment Laws - Sunshine Behavioral Health

Some states can force addicted individuals to attend addiction rehab without their consent. Let's find out if you're in one of those states.

sunshinebehavioralhealth.com

 

[DreamEnd]

Every state is different. In my state of Florida there is no limit on frequency or length of stay. Just the mere insinuation of suicidality to a medical professional or law enforecement officer will get you put in - and it's non-negotiable. You're basically in there until they deem you fit for discharge. Prison for the mentally ill.

States With Involuntary Commitment Laws - Sunshine Behavioral Health

Some states can force addicted individuals to attend addiction rehab without their consent. Let's find out if you're in one of those states.

sunshinebehavioralhealth.com

Fuck I'm in Florida. So they can just abuse it all the time? Out then in out then in?

 

[MatrixPrisoner]

Fuck I'm in Florida. So they can just abuse it all the time? Out then in out then in?

Yup. Florida is a Baker Act state. I've been forced in twice. It's basically like being arrested. My ex-wife's aunt was really messed up in the head and seem like she was in there about 80% of the year spread across dozens of different trips with varying lengths of stays. If you act somewhat normal and lie to them about feeling better, they will often let you out in 3-4 days because it's so overpopulated.

 

[DreamEnd]

Yup. Florida is a Baker Act state. I've been forced in twice. It's basically like being arrested. My ex-wife's aunt was really messed up in the head and seem like she was in there about 80% of the year spread across dozens of different trips with varying lengths of stays. If you act somewhat normal and lie to them about feeling better, they will often let you out in 3-4 days because it's so overpopulated.

hey what you linked is addiction treatment. Is it the same way for suicidality?

 

[MatrixPrisoner]

hey what you linked is addiction treatment. Is it the same way for suicidality?

In Florida, yes. Florida is probably the most strict state for self-harm intentions.

 

[DoubleUp8]

Most states have a 72 hour law and after that you have a right to a hearing where the institution has to show cause to keep you longer and you have a chance to make your case for release. The way it works if you have good insurance that'll pay for a longer stay they may try to keep you. If you do have good insurance they'll probably try to get you to sign in voluntary b4 hearing. If you have crap insurance like Medicaid they probably will release you b4 72 hours. If you have no insurance they'll probably release you immediately even if you tell them "I'm not only gonna kill myself but I got a M16 and I'm gonna climb up a tower and see how many people I can pick off 1st". It really is that corrupt. I got Medicare and 1 time I was in that situation and they were going to release me because their computer was telling them my Medicare wasn't valid. But then they made a phone call and found out my Medicare card was indeed legit and lo and behold. I was about ready to walk out the door and at that moment I became "A danger to himself and others". The legal jargon they hang their hat on. Once in California released immediately and the psychiatrist said "you have no insurance. Go ahead and kill yourself if you want. You have no insurance. We can't make any money off of you". Both actually happened to me. Mental health institutions are so corrupt. They don't do 1 thing to help you while you're there and bill the shit outa your insurance. In the 1st Medicare incident I cited, I later saw a copy of what Medicare paid them for. They billed Medicare for hours of psychotherapy that never occurred. I only spoke to the psychiatrist briefly 1 time early in my stay. Yet he billed for these hour long sessions that never happened. Just a brief conversation that abruptly ended after I told him to get go fuck himself. Definitely less than 5 minutes

 

[Kalista]

Most states have a 72 hour law and after that you have a right to a hearing where the institution has to show cause to keep you longer and you have a chance to make your case for release. The way it works if you have good insurance that'll pay for a longer stay they may try to keep you. If you do have good insurance they'll probably try to get you to sign in voluntary b4 hearing. If you have crap insurance like Medicaid they probably will release you b4 72 hours. If you have no insurance they'll probably release you immediately even if you tell them "I'm not only gonna kill myself but I got a M16 and I'm gonna climb up a tower and see how many people I can pick off 1st". It really is that corrupt. I got Medicare and 1 time I was in that situation and they were going to release me because their computer was telling them my Medicare wasn't valid. But then they made a phone call and found out my Medicare card was indeed legit and lo and behold. I was about ready to walk out the door and at that moment I became "A danger to himself and others". The legal jargon they hang their hat on. Once in California released immediately and the psychiatrist said "you have no insurance. Go ahead and kill yourself if you want. You have no insurance. We can't make any money off of you". Both actually happened to me. Mental health institutions are so corrupt. They don't do 1 thing to help you while you're there and bill the shit outa your insurance. In the 1st Medicare incident I cited, I later saw a copy of what Medicare paid them for. They billed Medicare for hours of psychotherapy that never occurred. I only spoke to the psychiatrist briefly 1 time early in my stay. Yet he billed for these hour long sessions that never happened. Just a brief conversation that abruptly ended after I told him to get go fuck himself. Definitely less than 5 minutes

This is exactly what happened to me and that's how I saw them approach my situation as well. They're just there for the money. I've spoken to a psychiatrist twice. Both different. The first time was to evaluate me, the second was just to break the news that I'm getting 5150'd. Then that was it. Weeks later, I get an expensive medical bill for something I never wanted. For something I was trying to fight to get out of. Assholes.

 

[qawsed]

Yup. Florida is a Baker Act state. I've been forced in twice. It's basically like being arrested. My ex-wife's aunt was really messed up in the head and seem like she was in there about 80% of the year spread across dozens of different trips with varying lengths of stays. If you act somewhat normal and lie to them about feeling better, they will often let you out in 3-4 days because it's so overpopulated.

I can attest to this. Also, if you just pretend you are ok and go to any and all groups and activities, and eat most of your monitored food intake they are more likely to let you out quickly.

 

[DoubleUp8]

This is exactly what happened to me and that's how I saw them approach my situation as well. They're just there for the money. I've spoken up to a psychiatrist twice. Both different. The first time was to evaluate me, the second was just to break the news that I'm getting 5150'd. Then that was it. Weeks later, I get an expensive medical bill for something I never wanted. For something I was trying to fight to get out of. Assholes.

I don't know what 5150 is. Is it the number of the law that allows the 72 hour hold in your state? Equivalent of Florida's Baker act?
These places couldn't be more fraudulent. They're just committing insurance fraud all day every day and get away with it. If you dispute the bill it won't do any good. Insurance won't believe the "mentally ill person" over the learned mental health professional.

 

[DreamEnd]

Holy shit I have good insurance. I'm fucked lol

 

[Hollowman]

Hopefully there's a special place in hell for these corrupt fuckers

 

[Rogue Proxy]

Hopefully there's a special place in hell for these corrupt fuckers

Even without Hell, there's a very high chance of them suffering slow, agonizing deaths, considering that few organisms pass away peacefully and painlessly.

 

[Little_Suzy]

Holy shit I have good insurance. I'm fucked lol

Hey I tried to google this but don't really understand it. If someone you know, your friend or parent calls in and says you are suicidal etc can they involuntary take you in? How many times can they do that and for how long? Is there a way I can avoid it?

Sorry, this is kind of long, but maybe it will help you. lol


These are the police procedures if someone calls the cops to involuntarily commit you. Never admit you are suicidal!

1. Stay calm and rational.

2. Close the front door and wait for the police outside. Standing opposite the front door, like in front of the driveway. If you talk to the police outside, they'll leave faster!

3. Speak as little as possible because cops will try to compromise your answers.

4. Answer only, "I'm not in danger and want to stay home." Please leave; I don't want to talk anymore or go to the hospital."

5. Keep declining hospitalizations and ER visits with a firm, "No!" Ask police to leave.

6. The police will ask you 100 times to provoke you; you'll say, "No, I don't need to go to the hospital; please leave my home."

7. Stop talking, and tell the police that you want to go inside, and they need to leave, because you're not going to the hospital.

8. Your family can allow the police to go inside. You stay outside! They can't follow you inside because you're conscious and have declined hospitalization.

9. Don't talk to family in front of the cops; if you start arguing and yelling, you can be arrested.


10. If you have to go to the hospital, instead of having the police handcuff you and drive you to the hospital, request a family member or an ambulance to do so.

11. Hospitals are cold and boring, so pack a small bag ahead of time. Bring your tech, money, soft-cover notebook (no metal spiral), pens, paperback book, Aquaphor, medications, and a loose-fitting warm outfit. Don't bring hoodies, drawstrings, shoelaces, glass bottles, metal, or jewelry.



Hospitalization: Never admit you are suicidal!


I'm not sure you're at a disadvantage because you have good insurance and are in control of your own affairs right now.

1. I don't know your situation; however, if you have good insurance, I'd look into outstanding treatment centers. You can pick where and when to request your 72-hour release by going voluntarily.

2. Hospitalization turns people off because they frequently end up in subpar facilities. I love my treatment center because it feels like a vacation resort.

3. Sign a 72-hour release form when you're no longer involuntary detained. Your lawyer can petition a judge to discharge you from involuntary detention if you've cooperated and aren't a threat.

4. I agree with you about researching Florida's mental health statutes. Bring a list of agencies and lawyers to report unlawful violations. When speaking with the Patient Advocate, be cautious; they will always side with the hospital.

5. Keep a daily journal with staff names for potential complaints to Florida's state board or lawsuits for maltreatment. After discharge, you forget a lot of details.

6. If you need to go to inpatient treatment, that's fine because a reputable rehab center can help you feel better and even recover.
Request residential treatment because the rules are less stringent than in a hospital.