Method Insulin?

[*KNAZ*]

Anyone ever consider insulin? Read you can buy insulin without prescription at a large chain box store that rhymes with "all fart".

 

[MaybeMaybeKnot]

I looked into it when I first heard that. It's not the good kind, though. It's slow acting, too. You need the fast acting kind to be sure you can ctb.

 

[*KNAZ*]

I looked into it when I first heard that. It's not the good kind, though. It's slow acting, too. You need the fast acting kind to be sure you can ctb.

So it's true that you can purchase insulin without a prescription? Wonder if they limit how much you can buy. I would still be willing to try it. Get as much as I can and inject it all at once.

 

[MaybeMaybeKnot]

So it's true that you can purchase insulin without a prescription? Wonder if they limit how much you can buy. I would still be willing to try it. Get as much as I can and inject it all at once.

It's true that they sell the old kind without a prescription. And you can buy a ten pack of insulin syringes from the pharmacy without a script too. Just know what you're asking for. Like 30 gauge 1/4" or whatever.

 

[*KNAZ*]

It's true that they sell the old kind without a prescription. And you can buy a ten pack of insulin syringes from the pharmacy without a script too. Just know what you're asking for. Like 30 gauge 1/4" or whatever.

Do you know if there is a limit on how many vials you can buy? Assuming you inject into abdomen or upper leg?

 

[MaybeMaybeKnot]

Do you know if there is a limit on how many vials you can buy? Assuming you inject into abdomen or upper leg?

Abdomen usually. Into a vein is more potent. I'm not sure if there's a limit. They used to be $25 a vial.

 

[bornsinner]

I looked into it when I first heard that. It's not the good kind, though. It's slow acting, too. You need the fast acting kind to be sure you can ctb.

I'm sure it's fast acting if a healthy person takes it to ctb

 

[MaybeMaybeKnot]

I'm sure it's fast acting if a healthy person takes it to ctb

It's really not, though. The old style that's OTC is very inefficient compared to the new stuff.

 

[*KNAZ*]

It's really not, though. The old style that's OTC is very inefficient compared to the new stuff.

Could be dose dependent where you have to take more to get same effect

 

[bornsinner]

It's really not, though. The old style that's OTC is very inefficient compared to the new stuff.

well it does not really matter if it's fast acting or not. cause you can just overdose on the insulin at bedtime, lie down and not wake up in the morning. it's better to overdose on the stuff at bedtime

 

[k75]

Ok, so my original method was insulin od. I discovered this forum while researching it.

I'm diabetic and have a fridge full of insulin, more than enough to do the job. However, there are several issues.

First of all, the Walmart stuff is shitty quality. It's intermediate acting and isn't very good. You also need a lot, so it could end up costing more than it's worth. It is actually important to use fast rather than long acting, unlike what one of the above posts said.

So what I have is pens, not vials. Each pen holds 300 units, but you can only inject like 60 at a time. You have to be very fast to inject enough to OD on, and the constant dialing on the pens won't cut it. So you need larger syringes to draw from.

That brings a new issue... Getting big syringes with short enough needles. Insulin has to be injected into fat, not muscle. So needle size is important.

If you solve all those issues, then there's the actual hypoglycemia to deal with. Have you ever had super low blood sugar? It really sucks and is very unpleasant, physically. And all sorts of things could go wrong. It's also highly likely you might black out and do something violent or unpredictable to get yourself saved.

There's just a million flaws in this method. I've been systematically trying to make it doable, but i just can't figure it all out. I've been revisiting it for months.

 

[SuicidalSymphonies]

Ok, so my original method was insulin od. I discovered this forum while researching it.

I'm diabetic and have a fridge full of insulin, more than enough to do the job. However, there are several issues.

First of all, the Walmart stuff is shitty quality. It's intermediate acting and isn't very good. You also need a lot, so it could end up costing more than it's worth. It is actually important to use fast rather than long acting, unlike what one of the above posts said.

So what I have is pens, not vials. Each pen holds 300 units, but you can only inject like 60 at a time. You have to be very fast to inject enough to OD on, and the constant dialing on the pens won't cut it. So you need larger syringes to draw from.

That brings a new issue... Getting big syringes with short enough needles. Insulin has to be injected into fat, not muscle. So needle size is important.

If you solve all those issues, then there's the actual hypoglycemia to deal with. Have you ever had super low blood sugar? It really sucks and is very unpleasant, physically. And all sorts of things could go wrong. It's also highly likely you might black out and do something violent or unpredictable to get yourself saved.

There's just a million flaws in this method. I've been systematically trying to make it doable, but i just can't figure it all out. I've been revisiting it for months.

What long and fast acting do you take? I use Apidra and Lantus.

 

[k75]

What long and fast acting do you take? I use Apidra and Lantus.

Novolog and Lantus

 

[SuicidalSymphonies]

Novolog and Lantus

Yes, when I was younger I'd do the exact opposite and not take my insulin so I'd get sick and die. Instead of ODing on it. There was a near death experience when I did this once when I was 16 where I lost many senses and just relaxed. It was euphoric and the most relaxed and most stress free I'd been in a while. All because I knew I'd die. Well, I thought I knew and then they saved my life.

I could never take too much and then try to fight the urge of treating a hypo.

 

[k75]

Yeah, it's so difficult not treating it when you're low. It just feels so bad and wrong, and I suspect your body will just take over and do anything it can to save itself regardless of what you want. Like SI on speed. Just the hunger that happens is insane and near impossible to ignore!

I figure the best way to get around all that is sleeping pills or lots of benzos, but I haven't really found any solid evidence to back that up. I do know people who get crazy low can black out and be very erratic and even violent. I've seen police videos where they thought the person was on serious drugs, but it was just severe hypoglycemia.

Highs are hell too, though. But it's a lot more passive. DKA isn't a way I'd like to go, though.

 

[SuicidalSymphonies]

Yeah, it's so difficult not treating it when you're low. It just feels so bad and wrong, and I suspect your body will just take over and do anything it can to save itself regardless of what you want. Like SI on speed. Just the hunger that happens is insane and near impossible to ignore!

I figure the best way to get around all that is sleeping pills or lots of benzos, but I haven't really found any solid evidence to back that up. I do know people who get crazy low can black out and be very erratic and even violent. I've seen police videos where they thought the person was on serious drugs, but it was just severe hypoglycemia.

Highs are hell too, though. But it's a lot more passive. DKA isn't a way I'd like to go, though.

Been in DKA a lot. Tried to kill myself a lot in my teens and turns out you can't hide the loud vomiting from your mother. Who'd have thought? Obviously not me as a teenager, but... DKA is not a good way to go, no. Because it's painful and that pain doesn't stop until you eventually die.

I also considered like taking some of my meds that make me just knock out. Or supposed to. Take lots of insulin, then lots of sleeping pills and muscle relaxers.

 

[Roberto]

Anyone ever consider insulin? Read you can buy insulin without prescription at a large chain box store that rhymes with "all fart".

Yes. 5 months ago I was diagnosed with diabetes type 1. I've got a lot of insulin. There are many deaths by low sugar. It could seem an accident, to keep guiltyness thoughts of the family and friends away. It's so easy ... it's great.

I had some low level sugar crises and it's not confortable. I should take some diazepam or muscle relaxants to avoid-reduce seizures and being unconscious, I suppose.

It's my second bet, or third. My preferences now are 1) Amytriptiline 2) CO and 3) Insuline.

Insuline should have prescription. It is strange.

 

[canuck]

So im a type 1 diabetic, and insulin OD always seemed to make the most sense to me. Ive tried now 3 times and as stated by k75 its not as easy as it seems and the amount of variables is off putting. But i agree with using short acting insulin, I am on an insulin pump so it only uses short acting insulin.

Ive put in around 200 units of insulin and still woken up the next morning. After talking with my endocrinologist, he explained to me that there is enough sugar stored in your body so that when you get to potentially fatal hypoglycaemic conditions, your body actually can release this sugar in order to save your body/brain function.

Now your body cant keep up if you keep doing this, but i dont know for how long that is. It would seem like a combination of short and long lasting insulin might help?

But after watching vice and hearing about max dog brewing im considering switching methods

edit: forgot to mention the insulin pump delivers insulin very slowly (at drip rate) so when i tried to CTB i was combining syringe injections and a continuous feed through the pump......thinking the bigger syringe as k75 was saying is the only way to increase probability

 

[k75]

Ive put in around 200 units of insulin and still woken up the next morning. After talking with my endocrinologist, he explained to me that there is enough sugar stored in your body so that when you get to potentially fatal hypoglycaemic conditions, your body actually can release this sugar in order to save your body/brain function.

Now your body cant keep up if you keep doing this, but i dont know for how long that is. It would seem like a combination of short and long lasting insulin might help?

But after watching vice and hearing about max dog brewing im considering switching methods

edit: forgot to mention the insulin pump delivers insulin very slowly (at drip rate) so when i tried to CTB i was combining syringe injections and a continuous feed through the pump......thinking the bigger syringe as k75 was saying is the only way to increase probability

The PPH says a lethal dose is 1,000+ units. I've also read 2,200. And it says it has to be administered quickly.

I've been thinking IV dosing is the only way of making it work, short of having a partner. I'm still crushed about that, because it really is how I'd like to go.

Edit: I have been looking at mixing in long acting, but from what I can tell it's very unpredictable. I know overdoses on it give hospitals a hard time because you can be fine and then repeatedly crash again randomly.

I think it would take a lot of experimenting, and I don't want to do that to myself. :(

 

[canuck]

The PPH says a lethal dose is 1,000+ units. I've also read 2,200. And it says it has to be administered quickly.

I've been thinking IV dosing is the only way of making it work, short of having a partner. I'm still crushed about that, because it really is how I'd like to go.

Edit: I have been looking at mixing in long acting, but from what I can tell it's very unpredictable. I know overdoses on it give hospitals a hard time because you can be fine and then repeatedly crash again randomly.

I think it would take a lot of experimenting, and I don't want to do that to myself. :(

Hmm good points,

1000+ units!? Jeez i find it weird its that many units of insulin when there are so many accidental cases of insulin OD's (mind you most of them are younger diabetics)

yea no one wants to experiment on a scale like this and end up failing at that too

i thought after 18 years i understood this stuff pretty well but guess not... frustrating cause it really is the way i wanted to go too...

thanks for the help k75

 

[k75]

Hmm good points,

1000+ units!? Jeez i find it weird its that many units of insulin when there are so many accidental cases of insulin OD's (mind you most of them are younger diabetics)

yea no one wants to experiment on a scale like this and end up failing at that too

i thought after 18 fyears i understood this stuff pretty well but guess not... frustrating cause it really is the way i wanted to go too...

thanks for the help k75

They do have a weird disclaimer that that's enough for non-diabetics. I'm guessing that's where the variation can really come in. Maybe a diabetic prone to lows would need less, and that's how accidents happen?

If you ever figure anything out, I'd love to hear your thoughts. It's been my side project of sorts for awhile. If I ever worked it out, I'd toss my SN so fast!

 

[canuck]

They do have a weird disclaimer that that's enough for non-diabetics. I'm guessing that's where the variation can really come in. Maybe a diabetic prone to lows would need less, and that's how accidents happen?

If you ever figure anything out, I'd love to hear your thoughts. It's been my side project of sorts for awhile. If I ever worked it out, I'd toss my SN so fast!

that makes sense, and for non-diabetics i guess to if your body is already producing insulin it shouldnt take much more to throw off the balance.

i will for sure keep you posted if i find anything else out.. appreciate the chat

 

[kiki666]

This is what a Psychiatrist says :
I'm sorry, it's in Spanish

Sí, con una sobredosis te puedes suicidar. El cuerpo humano fabrica insulina según necesita para consumir la glucosa de la sangre. Por eso en personas no diabética los niveles de glucosa se mantienen entre un máximo (producido después de comer alimentos con hidratos de carbono) y un mínimo (cuando hace varias horas de la última ingestión de hidratos de carbono). Las personas diabéticas al tener déficit de insulina (porque no la fabrican o porque no la fabrican en cantidad suficiente), no consumen esos azucares, de modo que la sangre aumenta sus niveles de glucosa (subida de azúcar). Pueden morir de un coma diabético.

translation

Yes, with an overdose you can kill yourself. The human body manufactures insulin as needed to consume blood glucose. That is why in non-diabetic people glucose levels are maintained between a maximum (produced after eating foods with carbohydrates) and a minimum (when several hours ago from the last ingestion of carbohydrates). Diabetic people have an insulin deficit (because they do not manufacture it or because they do not manufacture it in sufficient quantity), do not consume these sugars, so that the blood increases their glucose levels (sugar rise). They can die of a diabetic coma

 

[caitlynd]

this is the method that I am researching... it almost seems like you would need a constant steady supply of insulin in order for this to be effective and not allow the body time to overcome it.

 

[autumnal]

Anyone ever consider insulin? Read you can buy insulin without prescription at a large chain box store that rhymes with "all fart".

See my post linking to the PPH's comments about insulin overdose being logistically impractical for suicide.

 

[Aap]

I was going to make a post about insulin, but there is little reason after reading the excellent post already written. Insulin has been used in the past to keep individuals asleep for long durations (insulin shock treatment). While it certainly can be fatal in OD, it can just as likely cause permanent brain damage from hypoglycemia.

 

[codewarrior]

Dont even consider if one is not aware on it. Remember, every person's body is different. Sharing a personal experience.

Once sugar falls below 30 levels, you would feel the real effects but in reality you would start feeling the effects around 60 IU/ML range itself where dizziness starts to appear. Now going from 60 to 30 itself is not easy if you are awake, your SI would fight back and you would be in terrible situation.

T1D here. My lowest that has went was 32 in sleep and waking up terribly, happened thrice. Problem was if it kept falling, it keeps falling. Below 30 there is chance of coma and death. But there are cases where some people have still survived all odds and came out good.

One fine day, tired of low sugar issues in sleep, prayed and went to sleep. As usual woke up with low sugar but had nothing handy to eat at midnight far from home. After 20 minutes gave up hunt for food, prepared to sleep in whatever happens mode but then measured again and found numbers started to increase automatically. Don't know since then my body started to respond back naturally to low sugars and numbers automatically go up naturally in defense and never had hypoglycemia issues. It was like a miracle.

But do realized, now you shot up insulin, it might not be well worth.

 

[sihaam]

Ok, so my original method was insulin od. I discovered this forum while researching it.

I'm diabetic and have a fridge full of insulin, more than enough to do the job. However, there are several issues.

First of all, the Walmart stuff is shitty quality. It's intermediate acting and isn't very good. You also need a lot, so it could end up costing more than it's worth. It is actually important to use fast rather than long acting, unlike what one of the above posts said.

So what I have is pens, not vials. Each pen holds 300 units, but you can only inject like 60 at a time. You have to be very fast to inject enough to OD on, and the constant dialing on the pens won't cut it. So you need larger syringes to draw from.

That brings a new issue... Getting big syringes with short enough needles. Insulin has to be injected into fat, not muscle. So needle size is important.

If you solve all those issues, then there's the actual hypoglycemia to deal with. Have you ever had super low blood sugar? It really sucks and is very unpleasant, physically. And all sorts of things could go wrong. It's also highly likely you might black out and do something violent or unpredictable to get yourself saved.

There's just a million flaws in this method. I've been systematically trying to make it doable, but i just can't figure it all out. I've been revisiting it for months.

Why can't you take it as an IV ? 20ml

 

[k75]

Why can't you take it as an IV ? 20ml

I have no experience putting IVs in myself. Nor the supplies required. Do you? Most actual nurses I deal with struggle to get one going in me, which is frustrating on so many levels. Also, IV drugs work fast, and I'm not sure you'd have time to dose yourself. I just don't see this as a reliable method in reality. Any success (for me, at least) would be due to accident.


Interestingly enough, this method was brought up a couple of days ago and shortly after I had the worst low blood sugar episode of my life. It reinforced my hesitation, as I never want to experience that again even if it would kill me.

For anyone who might be interested in what an insulin overdose is like, this is what happened:

I have an insulin pump. That basically works by giving you a tiny stream of insulin all day and at mealtimes, you input your current blood sugar reading and the amount of carbs you're eating and it gives you a bigger dose to compensate.

It's usually pretty foolproof, and I'm not sure specifically what went wrong. I probably miscalculated somewhere. But I had just woken up from a nap and was supposed to watch a show with a friend. And I realized I was super hungry. Like ravenous, as if I hadn't eaten in days. Odd... I couldn't quite remember when I last ate, but I figured maybe I forgot to eat all day.

So I made some food, set up my pump and was eating dinner. Halfway, through the show, I started feeling weird. Hungrier, which made no sense, and also like throwing up. I have a problem with chronic nausea anyway, so I figured it was that and took some zofran. Didn't help.

It suddenly occurred to me I should check my blood sugar. That should have been the first thing I thought to do when I felt off, but it never crossed my mind. Did I even check before setting up my dose? Couldn't remember. I could have checked the equipment history, but that also didn't ocurr to me.

By that point, I was shaky and uncoordinated, and it was hard to get the blood on my test strip. I missed my finger multiple times. I actually paused and almost forgot what I was even doing. It was scary weird. Anyway, when I finally managed, I was 49. (My danger zone is anything below 80-70. Obviously, the lower this number, the closer you are to coma or death.)

I had to make my way to the kitchen to grab a soda, and it was like I was drunk. Stumbling and slow, dizzy, shaky, splitting headache... I made it as far as the sink and started vomiting uncontrollably. I felt like I couldn't stand on my own anymore. I'm sure my sugar was steadily dropping. I hurt in a way I can't explain, and I couldn't really focus. I knew I needed the drink, but I was having trouble staying on task and also actually finding the fridge. I don't really remember how I got it, but the next thing I knew, I was struggling to open the can and then drinking. I threw it all up almost immediately. Luckily I had more and somehow got enough in me to help.

I'm not sure how long I was in the kitchen. It felt like forever, but my friend wasn't concerned when I got back. The next time I checked, my reading was 58. With the amount I drank, it should have been well over 100. So I must have been closer to the 20s while I was messing around in the kitchen.

Eventually I got up to a safe number and was functioning ok again. The nausea and headache persisted for longer than I think it should have, and I generally felt shitty.

All in all, will avoid a repeat at all costs. I can't describe how truly dreadful it felt. Also, suicide was the furthest thing from my mind, and I'm usually thinking about it on some level all the time. It's like my body went into survival autopilot, and I'm not sure I could have chosen to not at least try to save myself. Just the blind panic I was feeling is enough to make me not consider it. I have things left to do before I go, and I'm just not ready.

 

[sihaam]

Hmm good points,

1000+ units!? Jeez i find it weird its that many units of insulin when there are so many accidental cases of insulin OD's (mind you most of them are younger diabetics)

yea no one wants to experiment on a scale like this and end up failing at that too

i thought after 18 years i understood this stuff pretty well but guess not... frustrating cause it really is the way i wanted to go too...

thanks for the help k75

All you need is a 2 20ml syringe and a luerlock needle. withdraw all the insulin you have into 2 20ml syringe ( Make sure it is at least 20ml for each arm 40ml in total) Find a good vein Inject it, and make sure you aspirate so blood comes of the syringe to ensure it's in a vein. That should be 1500 units at least.
make sure you haven't eaten in a few days.
Also make sure this is no to save you.
I plan on doing it in a forest or at a nice beach.