If money was no barrier for anyone, then most mental health issues...

[Commitmentphile101]

... could be identified precisely with the right help be it therapy or whatever (assuming everyone had an open mind and was willing to talk) and it could be solved with many people being prevented from CTB. My proposition is the world is masking the real issue under several different guises which people describe as the cause of their MH issues. I believe the real issue is really money.

Let's discuss.

Here is my full opinion which I have copied and pasted from a PM discussion with someone else earlier. It only occurred to me recently what the whole community thought about this:

"Every time I get angry about something from the past, when I dig down to the roots there was nothing money could not have solved. I believe all the solutions are readily available out there. If they did not cost something and people were ready to grab them there would be considerably less mental health issues. I always tell myself to not get fooled by a lot of the things from the past which trigger my anger, it's the world trying to mask the real issue. Money could have solved those problems for sure.

I hate the phrase "Money doesn't buy you happiness". It's a disgusting working class phrase coined by those who are content with their mediocrity or have given up hope so want to make themselves feel better.
No it may not buy you happiness. It is up to you to MAKE a fulfilling life with great relationships and a work-life balance.
But first addictions, bad thought processes, health problems, crippling finances that inhibit basic quality of life, mental health issues like schizophrenia, dysphoria (amongst an endless list) must all be eliminated. Your mind can be your best friend or your worst enemy and these things really fuck with it. Number one they MUST all go before you can live life to your maximum. And money 100% can fix them all in my opinion through support groups, therapy, healthcare, surgery.
If you would like to suggest something that I'm not seeing that can't be fixed go for it, I'm up for learning too.

Awareness of the list of problems above , awareness of their easy/difficult solutions with money, and the money itself gives you the OPPORTUNITY to MAKE a very happy life. And this isn't a trivial thing at all, it's absolutely huge. Just having the OPPORTUNITY should be a basic right for everyone.
I also don't like the use the suicides of wealthy people like billionaires as a way to prove that awful phrase "Money doesn't buy you happiness" is right. Who knows what went wrong? Perhaps they lost a loved one and made a rash decision, perhaps more commonly they mistook the instrument/aid to a happy life as the source of happiness itself. It violates my condition that there must be an open mind and a willingness to talk so that doesn't count anyway. "

So I'm open to ideas. Let's play a game where you try and suggest a problem whether it be personal or the experience of someone you knew and convince me money couldn't have fixed it.

 

[Life_and_Death]

im fixing most of my problems myself without the help of any medical professional. however i have a few major problems (such as hallucinations) that i need a medication for. if i didnt have those specific problems, i wouldnt need any money to get better.

 

[Cherrypea]

My work colleague was in ITU for 6 weeks with covid and has lung damage, not sure money can fix this...

I pay for counselling but it doesn't help cos deep down I don't deserve help, my money is not helping here...

Money got my teenage daughter through her A levels with private tuition but she still didn't go to university and choose to bum around the last year instead. Did the money help that?

 

[Rollo]

Sure money is a huge thing. Having food on a table and roof over your head are big contributors to happiness. Still money always require work, even stealing it require work. So how can having money be a right? Somebody will have to pay the bill. And money can't solve every problem. Even in terms of physical health, let alone mental health.

 

[IsThisTheEnd?]

there's appears to be a huge rise in anxiety in country's that are very capitalist I'm not saying that's the only cause but there's a lack of community and the 2 market leaders U.S.A and UK.

 

[woxihuanni]

If I was filthy rich, I doubt my partner would insist I kill myself double quick. They could use the moneybto have even more mindblowing holidays with their owner.

 

[LittleJem]

I watched a mini-interview with Demi Moore - filthy rich. In which her kids said they didn't feel they could have issues because they were seen to have everything - but Demi Moore relapsed into (alcoholism?/drugs) when one of them was 9 years old. Her daughters left the house for a while and were not in touch with her for three years or so...

Also, money does not fix heartbreak, for example. It also doesn't cure depression and anxiety, or addiction or anything else...

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

People who suddenly gain vast quantities of money by winning the lottery end up doing worse afterwards. Typically this is because of newly gained anxiety over losing money. Sure having money is nice, but sometimes people can be consumed by the fear of losing a single piece of it even if they already have more than enough. Why do you think the extremely wealthy still care about profits? It's because having money alone makes them that much more terrified of losing it.

I'm not saying that people who need it shouldn't get more money though, especially if they really need it. Just that, we should be careful to assume that it really will solve all our problems. It's so easy to say that anything we don't have can fix our lives when there are plenty of examples all around us of people who are still wealthy and miserable.

 

[alexit]

I agree wholeheartedly, emphatically, but I'd argue I'd also like laws to give more freedom. To be honest, if I could, I'd spend my days getting high. Judge me if you want. That's what I want. So to your point, money would allow me to live without working and buy drugs, but with draconian laws I could be the richest person in the world and still be put in jail and not get to do what I want.

 

[Sensei]

I can't see how money could fix treatment-resistant schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, and schizoaffective disorder.

 

[draw a circle]

I don't have mental disorders or health issues so I can't talk about that but I do think I won't be here if I was rich? Me and my friend both have problems with school and mental health (not a diagnosed disorder for me, but I do have a problem). The difference is that he can comfortably spend money for therapy and change his college major (which costs money and influences) and I can barely afford therapy without being frugal. And if we were rich there won't be so much pressure on me on having a nice job so fast after graduation, and I haven't graduated yet.

On second thought, the problem lies within me as a human being so money could POSTPONE my death for a few years and make my life better but I think the thought of suicide is inevitable for someone like me lol

 

[DyingAlf]

Money did not prevent any of the trauma I have experienced & money will not fix the damage the trauma caused to my brain (no matter how much talking &/or therapy I do)
If I had more money perhaps I could use it to help me ctb.
So no, I'm sorry, I can't agree with you about this.

 

[StarNomad]

... could be identified precisely with the right help be it therapy or whatever (assuming everyone had an open mind and was willing to talk) and it could be solved with many people being prevented from CTB. My proposition is the world is masking the real issue under several different guises which people describe as the cause of their MH issues. I believe the real issue is really money.

Let's discuss.

Here is my full opinion which I have copied and pasted from a PM discussion with someone else earlier. It only occurred to me recently what the whole community thought about this:

"Every time I get angry about something from the past, when I dig down to the roots there was nothing money could not have solved. I believe all the solutions are readily available out there. If they did not cost something and people were ready to grab them there would be considerably less mental health issues. I always tell myself to not get fooled by a lot of the things from the past which trigger my anger, it's the world trying to mask the real issue. Money could have solved those problems for sure.

I hate the phrase "Money doesn't buy you happiness". It's a disgusting working class phrase coined by those who are content with their mediocrity or have given up hope so want to make themselves feel better.
No it may not buy you happiness. It is up to you to MAKE a fulfilling life with great relationships and a work-life balance.
But first addictions, bad thought processes, health problems, crippling finances that inhibit basic quality of life, mental health issues like schizophrenia, dysphoria (amongst an endless list) must all be eliminated. Your mind can be your best friend or your worst enemy and these things really fuck with it. Number one they MUST all go before you can live life to your maximum. And money 100% can fix them all in my opinion through support groups, therapy, healthcare, surgery.
If you would like to suggest something that I'm not seeing that can't be fixed go for it, I'm up for learning too.

Awareness of the list of problems above , awareness of their easy/difficult solutions with money, and the money itself gives you the OPPORTUNITY to MAKE a very happy life. And this isn't a trivial thing at all, it's absolutely huge. Just having the OPPORTUNITY should be a basic right for everyone.
I also don't like the use the suicides of wealthy people like billionaires as a way to prove that awful phrase "Money doesn't buy you happiness" is right. Who knows what went wrong? Perhaps they lost a loved one and made a rash decision, perhaps more commonly they mistook the instrument/aid to a happy life as the source of happiness itself. It violates my condition that there must be an open mind and a willingness to talk so that doesn't count anyway. "

So I'm open to ideas. Let's play a game where you try and suggest a problem whether it be personal or the experience of someone you knew and convince me money couldn't have fixed it.

Hammer swings, hits nail on the head, that is why we need a UBI ( Universal Basic Income )!! Problem solved, I mean we know in this world money controls everything. I hate that saying " Money can't buy you happiness ", those that spit this qoute out so much, try to be happy without said money. Keep spreading this around, it is so true.

 

[Jojo81]

My depression Due to unemployment and anxiety thinking about future months and how to take care of my family, will disappear if I have enough money... Money is everything... Money is the primary source of happiness in this world.. Money is freedom... Money is everything for me now... Few months before, I took money for granted.. I used to say happiness is everything, money doesn't matter if you can be happy with what you have.. But when am at the point where I am unable to bear the thought of no money..

So again, let me say it again, money is everything.

 

[Commitmentphile101]

im fixing most of my problems myself without the help of any medical professional. however i have a few major problems (such as hallucinations) that i need a medication for. if i didnt have those specific problems, i wouldnt need any money to get better.

Inadvertently you are agreeing with me. Money is NO issue here and you are doing fine. What exactly are we disagreeing on here?

My work colleague was in ITU for 6 weeks with covid and has lung damage, not sure money can fix this...

Not a mental health issue.

I pay for counselling but it doesn't help cos deep down I don't deserve help, my money is not helping here...

You have violated the condition that you need an open mind. "I don't deserve help"?? What the hell kind of fatalistic thinking is this? The cause is already lost and there's no point arguing with you if this is the attitude.

Money got my teenage daughter through her A levels with private tuition but she still didn't go to university and choose to bum around the last year instead. Did the money help that?

Not a mental health issue.

Sure money is a huge thing. Having food on a table and roof over your head are big contributors to happiness. Still money always require work, even stealing it require work. So how can having money be a right? Somebody will have to pay the bill. And money can't solve every problem. Even in terms of physical health, let alone mental health.

I watched a mini-interview with Demi Moore - filthy rich. In which her kids said they didn't feel they could have issues because they were seen to have everything - but Demi Moore relapsed into (alcoholism?/drugs) when one of them was 9 years old. Her daughters left the house for a while and were not in touch with her for three years or so...

Also, money does not fix heartbreak, for example. It also doesn't cure depression and anxiety, or addiction or anything else...

I do not know the specifics of her case. I'm going to decline to comment. I cannot read any detailed report on her and what went on in here life , and I'm not relying on a snapshot TV interview. I have a strong suspicion it could have been handled way better.

Heartbreak is a mental illness, and the reason it is not easily fixed is because idiots all over the world a lot of them females have perpetuated this silly idea of romance and infatuation. It's a dumb idea. Call it what it is, recognise that it is a mental health issue and then you can resolve it. It's starts with this idea of Romeo and Juliet kind of love being a mental illness.


I believe the next three you have mentioned can all be fixed for the majority of people and if there are many cases which have spiralled into such a dark place where they can't be saved or it's so extremely unlikely to, it's because severe lack of money/horrendous backgrounds where poverty was a seriously big issue got them there. I still see long term lack of money as the thing to blame for that environment so I do not see the fact that money now not being able to fix their immediate problem as me losing this argument. In a roundabout way, I believe it reinforces my point.

People who suddenly gain vast quantities of money by winning the lottery end up doing worse afterwards. Typically this is because of newly gained anxiety over losing money. Sure having money is nice, but sometimes people can be consumed by the fear of losing a single piece of it even if they already have more than enough. Why do you think the extremely wealthy still care about profits? It's because having money alone makes them that much more terrified of losing it.

I'm not saying that people who need it shouldn't get more money though, especially if they really need it. Just that, we should be careful to assume that it really will solve all our problems. It's so easy to say that anything we don't have can fix our lives when there are plenty of examples all around us of people who are still wealthy and miserable.

Inadvertently you are saying that too much money or an inability to handle it can cause problems. Which is still a money problem. You haven't contradicted me.
My argument has been: Suppose not a single worry is pertaining to money.
I also never said (as many people have wrongly interpreted ) anything about other problems that were not relating to mental illness.

I agree wholeheartedly, emphatically, but I'd argue I'd also like laws to give more freedom. To be honest, if I could, I'd spend my days getting high. Judge me if you want. That's what I want. So to your point, money would allow me to live without working and buy drugs, but with draconian laws I could be the richest person in the world and still be put in jail and not get to do what I want.

I don't believe you would feel need to get high to escape reality if your reality was pleasant and fulfilling.

Hammer swings, hits nail on the head, that is why we need a UBI ( Universal Basic Income )!! Problem solved, I mean we know in this world money controls everything. I hate that saying " Money can't buy you happiness ", those that spit this qoute out so much, try to be happy without said money. Keep spreading this around, it is so true.

I know what people's problem is, I can't say what the best way to fix it is. I personally don't like UBI. I may change my mind but right now I am rather conservative and the general idea is that any kind of wealth distribution is not good. I may change my mind in the near future, who knows.

So how can having money be a right? And money can't solve every problem. Even in terms of physical health, let alone mental health.

You don't seem to have a problem with a welfare system do you? What's the problem now?

Somebody will have to pay the bill.

Yes the taxpayer.

And money can't solve every problem. Even in terms of physical health, let alone mental health.

Physical Health is not on the agenda here. Only mental health. Mental health is a tough one here. In the current society a patient has to deal with their issue while still stuck in the same disgusting system where money is a big issue. You can't fix flooding in an apartment because of an overflowing bath because of taps left on whilst the taps are still turned on.
Whilst the taps are still on (i.e you are still in the system which is fighting against you) it is not fair to say what is or isn't a good fix. The serious source of the issue may very likely still be present.

I can't see how money could fix treatment-resistant schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, and schizoaffective disorder.

See what I have written above to Rollo with the flooding bath water analogy. That's just my opinion.

Money did not prevent any of the trauma I have experienced & money will not fix the damage the trauma caused to my brain (no matter how much talking &/or therapy I do)
If I had more money perhaps I could use it to help me ctb.
So no, I'm sorry, I can't agree with you about this.

See what I wrote earlier in my quote to LittleJem

 

[Life_and_Death]

Inadvertently you are agreeing with me. Money is NO issue here and you are doing fine. What exactly are we disagreeing on here?

yes i am agreeing, however im disagreeing that there are some things that you do need money for to recover. but if you want to make my medication free, feel free to email trudeau lol

 

[Commitmentphile101]

im disagreeing that there are some things that you do need money for to recover.

Money is the root of the what caused the development of those issues. I suppose depending on the country it varies to what extent money plays in the ways that these issues are addressed e.g therapy, medication etc. but I meant the cause of the issues mainly.
I suppose even this point is a good time to refer you like I have others to the bath water flooding analogy and the taps that I mentioned earlier.

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

So if I interpreted your flooding analogy correctly, are you saying we should abolish money itself? It seems like that's what you want. What would you suggest replace it then? I hope you don't mean we go back to a barter and trade system. Those are even more competitive than basic currency as anyone who's ever gotten involved in trading cards would tell you.

 

[Cherrypea]

Yeah I read it wrong and wasn't talking solely about mental health issues in my reply. Shoot me.
(please, I'll pay you)

 

[Life_and_Death]

Money is the root of the what caused the development of those issues

how do you figure?

 

[Commitmentphile101]

So if I interpreted your flooding analogy correctly, are you saying we should abolish money itself? It seems like that's what you want. What would you suggest replace it then? I hope you don't mean we go back to a barter and trade system. Those are even more competitive than basic currency as anyone who's ever gotten involved in trading cards would tell you.

Huh? Who said anything about currency being an issue here? Of course I don't want a barter and trade system.
I would like an economic system that works for everyone, giving the top end an opportunity to thrive and produce unbounded wealth, but also gives everyone at the bottom end an equal opportunity to do so, whilst having comfort that they have a safety net. I feel a lot issues stem from stress induced from basic threats to our own survival or our family's survival. Can't pay the bills, can't provide food, can't pay for medication. Some form of welfare exists in some form in every 1st world country as far as I'm aware, so I don't think it's that huge an extension to have this sort of safety net for absolutely everybody.
If it's issues caused by bad environment or parental abuse/neglect (even if finances are in order), I believe the parents are continuing a cycle based on what happened to them (behaviour induced from a time when there was a money issue).

Yeah I read it wrong and wasn't talking solely about mental health issues in my reply. Shoot me.
(please, I'll pay you)

I'll ignore the sarcasm and I genuinely do wish you all the best getting through whatever plight you are facing.

how do you figure?

That is the whole point of this whole thread isn't it? I invited people to tell me problems that they believe just simply wouldn't be ok even if they had money and I would challenge. I can't give a blanket explanation for everything? I feel like I have done an ok job so far in this thread. I realise it has been a little naive of me since noone has gone into super specifics of their own problems and to do so would be unrealistic.

 

[Life_and_Death]

maybe the question wasnt clear enough. how do you figure money is the root cause of the development of these hallucinations?

 

[Commitmentphile101]

maybe the question wasnt clear enough. how do you figure money is the root cause of the development of these hallucinations?

I have no idea what your exact medical condition is, I am no medical doctor either or any kind of expert either. It is impossible for me to say for you. I have no idea if they are related to stuff that happened to you in your past. My statement meant it is an indirect cause for being in an environment that allows this stuff to happen a lot more easily. If you were brought up in an environment that the youths you see from something like "Made in Chelsea" I somehow doubt you would be in the this same position with these hallucinations

 

[never mind me]

I partly agree with the original post. In my country of residence the suicide rate has steadily declined during the last decades. This is in big parts attributed to a better access to psychotherapy and other offers for the mentally ill and less stigma attached to mental health issues in recent years. However, despite psychotherapy being free of charge (it's fully covered for by the health insurance everybody who legally lives here has to have), many other offers for the mentally ill (like social workers or psychologists who visit people at home and assist them in stuff like paperwork or organising their life), good programms for reintegrating physically and/or mentally ill people into work and relatively decent welfare programs that make sure nobody has to starve or be homeless (that is, if you know how to deal with the bureaucracy involved in claiming welfare), I still know many people who have ongoing mental health issues for many years. And there are still people killing themselves because of mental health issues, too.
But I'm sure the situation is much worse in countries with no general access to (mental) health care and insufficient welfare programs like the USA. Actually it's often discussed in the news I read that the relatively low life expectancy (for a developed country) in the USA is due to so many people dying by suicide or drug overdose because it's so hard to get help, if you have mental health issues in the USA and have no money.
On the other hand the suicide rate in the former GDR used to be sky-high, too, despite it being a socialist country. There it obviously wasnt't the lack of money that drove people to kill themselves, but the lack of other escape routes (quite literal with an oppressive government and closed borders all around).

 

[SarRy]

People are horrible to each other. Money is just one avenue of competition and conflict. Money can't fix people. Maybe I'm just unlucky, but I find people to be mostly mean to each other.

 

[jackie_boy1337]

I agree with you, up to a point.

Throughout my life, my happiness has definitely been correlated with how much money I've made.

Where I disagree with you, is that money can't buy you a different past. Money can't buy people who WANT to treat you decently.
Money can fix immediate problems but if you've had a plain shitty life, there's no amount of money that can undo that.

It can buy you decent distractions though, hence the increase in happiness.

 

[iwillforyou]

My mother died when I was twelve of brain, lung and liver. She couldn't recognize me near the end and died alone in a hospital room after I guilted her into chemo and radiation because I felt she was choosing to give up and leave us (myself and my two brothers) rather than fighting to remain with us. Then my entire life imploded— was sent without my brothers, who were allowed to stay in my Mom and Grandma's home for months— to live with my mother's sister and her husband. When it became clear she was going to die and I would lose her I started to panic, knowing I'd would end up in foster care or an adoption agency and lose my brothers too. Which happened anyway when I was sent away. I was then subsequently forced onto medication to numb my grief despite being against medicating my as yet undeveloped (fully) brain; which didn't make me feel better contrary to their forcible claims and subsequently made me black out and have seizures. The year after my mother died my maternal grandmother died also (after being sent straight away to a nursing home.) I was that summer lied to about being sent to "summer camp" despite begging to stay home and "just be a normal kid for the summer", had my (minor) molestation thrown in my face when I said I didn't want to go (for previously mentioned reason) (a betrayal from the grave from my mother as she was the only person I told and made swear she wouldn't share with her confidants— because I didn't want to be stigmatized or made into a victim, and only because she was always very adamant if ANYONE ever touched me inappropriately I MUST tell her— which haunts me still) and after trying to reach compromise and care for myself saying I would go see the camp if she (my aunt) went with me and left me leave with her if I felt uncomfortable there, I was left abruptly alone in an airport (age 13) in the care strangers who were there to escort me to wilderness camp in the desert. After years of being sent away— lockdown residential treatment center then "step-down" boarding school for the remainder of the adolescence all because I was (naturally, I believe) depressed over the death of my only involved parent/support, I was forced by way of lack of means (here your argument may hold) to not take the gap year I wanted to and subsequently failed out of college due to continuing depression and lack of social skills while in an all girls boarding school and after no-communication policies in RTC. So I have basically been alone since she died. And almost a year ago, the closest I came to happiness with my love, the closest to companionship with anyone who hasn't treated me abusively since my mother died— excluding my one friend who has helped keep me from definitively CTB years before now— my love died unexpectedly and I am more alone than ever. I want to die more than ever and I cannot even talk to my best friend anymore because it hurts so much, even worse than losing my Mom which I didn't think was possible, because she wants to help and I can't lie to her, so now I am a burden to her too, the one person I had a true and meaningful relationship with. And I care about not hurting her unlike my Aunt who I've become dark and spiteful enough to want to suffer as much as she has done her best to increase mine (something she adamantly denies, gaslighting me to the best of her ability even though the one thing my shitty family can all agree on is she didn't like my mother and I have always been treated with a negative bias from her for being too much like my mother).

How do you propose money could solve any of this? How do you propose money could solve 2+ decades of being alone in a dark vast world?

I do agree much could be solved in life with money aka resources but I think you're being a bit over-generalizing and over simplifying a very complex subject matter.

All that to say I do not entirely agree; though perhaps applied correctly the money that was set aside to ensure he "well-being" of my brothers and I after my Mother's death may have mitigated some of the damage. But I still feel that community and a true sense of home and belonging will outrun money day-in-day-out, almost every time.