Discussion If involuntary commitment was done away with...

[TAW122]

If involuntary commitment for self-harm and danger to oneself was done away with (with some exceptions for those that are truly mentally ill or a danger to others), then I believe that there will be more people actually seeking help and less afraid to open up to medical professionals and people in the healthcare field.

It is rather ironic that society wishes to de-stigmatize suicide and mental illness by these raising awareness and prevention campaigns, yet fail to realize that one of the main reasons that people do not want to open up nor be honest with mental health professionals, authority figures (law enforcement, educators, and what not), and other mandated reporters, etc. is that they can take their freedom away on a whim (while having committed no real crimes) with no real due process. Also, it doesn't help that the way people are being treated as a problem rather than a rational, logical response to the irrational, cold, unjust world.

If said suicidal people are truly a threat to society and a danger to others, then they should deal with the criminal justice system instead (such as threatening harm on others, doing things to harm others) of the mental health system (unless they already have some underlying condition that caused them to commit said crime). I don't believe that a lot of people are really mentally ill; this isn't to say that there aren't any mentally ill people (as there are), but the numbers and figures are just overblown and inaccurate. I think most people who fall into the mental health system are just people who have a realistic view on the world itself, the conditions in which they live in, and their response to the failed system and unjust world. That in and of itself, is not a mental illness. Therapy is also bullshit, (see reasons here), but that's another story/topic altogether.

Let me know what you guys think. If you agree or disagree or have some other point of view that isn't mentioned here.

 

[Vegrau]

People's obsession towards life is unhealthy. It's mania. Infringing other's right to die while ignoring their suffering. Their exaltation of life is pitiful. If life is that good then we certainly dont have to convince ourselves its good while distracting ourselves from it. Those pro lifer are abomination. Merely a cheap imitation of life. Lying to others and themselves. When people wont abide they forced them to. They exist merely following their instinct exactly like animals.

The generalization of everything is also a problem. They generalize anything that is "different"/"not normal". As if they have the right to judge. As if they themselves are normal. Ohh it pissed me off to no end. Their idiocy and superficiality. If only they werent this self absorb and actually try to understand others. Then life would have been easier for themselves as well. There is no mold of normalcy we have to fit in. Nothing is normal when everything is different. Its like comparing oak tree to a redwood. Both are trees yes. But each are normal on their own.

 

[TAW122]

Well said, I also hate most pro-lifers as they can't just keep their own morals and will to themselves. They feel the need and duty to impose their morality and will on others that differ from them or don't subscribe to their views. Fuck the lot of them.

Anyways, I like your analogy to the oak tree and redwood tree, it makes logical sense.

 

[Vegrau]

Well said, I also hate most pro-lifers as they can't just keep their own morals and will to themselves. They feel the need and duty to impose their morality and will on others that differ from them or don't subscribe to their views. Fuck the lot of them.

Anyways, I like your analogy to the oak tree and redwood tree, it makes logical sense.

Thank you and it may seems logical to us. But to them its not. They move and live solely following instinct and emotions. Theyre incapable of logical thoughts. No will or thoughts of their own. They only follow. Pity our world's resources are being wasted on things like them. Like swarm of bloodsucking mosquitoes.

 

[Armadillo]

I thought about that too, society thinks it is helping people while in reality it's only worsening their situation.
Of course I'm not gonna say I'm suicidal if the risk is getting locked up in a mental hospital for months... well, I'm not telling it to anyone IRL anymore anyway, the psychiatrist I met are all FUCKING STUPID. They don't know shit about how meds work, they don't know shit about side effects, addiction or anything at all. They prescribe extremely dangerous stuff like anti-psychotics or benzodiazepines in high dosages as they were candies. But that's another story...

Back to the question: all the system is extremely irrational, expecially from a utilitaristic point of view. You can't help people by punishing them when they ask for help, you can't assume their approach to the problem (suicide) is dysfunctional if you can't even understand said problem.

IMO this way of thinking arises from 4 wrong premises. "Life is to be preserved always no matter what, the patient who admits to be suicidal is not thinking clearly and needs help."
"No matter the condition (phisical or psychological), deciding to take your own life is never justifiable. It is perfectly ok to keep someone from killing himself without giving him any reasons not to do so."
"Pain can always be made bearable through therapy and/or medications."
"Doctors know what's best for you, you are ill and need treatment."
They are all extremely nonsensical, but right because of that most people agree with them.

 

[sólstafir]

This forum is unique in the whole world, I don't know how many times I've felt better thanks to people here, because to feel you're not crazy that you want to die is sometimes the best 'cure'. To feel actually heared by someone, not labeled as 'crazy' to even have these thoughts. If we're talking about real help, then for me this forum has been real help, instead of being locked up in mental hospital all my human rights taken away from me, including freedom to have my own thoughts. I don't answer the thread right now, I know, but I agree with you.

 

[TAW122]

I thought about that too, society thinks it is helping people while in reality it's only worsening their situation.
Of course I'm not gonna say I'm suicidal if the risk is getting locked up in a mental hospital for months... well, I'm not telling it to anyone IRL anymore anyway, the psychiatrist I met are all FUCKING STUPID. They don't know shit about how meds work, they don't know shit about side effects, addiction or anything at all. They prescribe extremely dangerous stuff like anti-psychotics or benzodiazepines in high dosages as they were candies. But that's another story...

Back to the question: all the system is extremely irrational, expecially from a utilitaristic point of view. You can't help people by punishing them when they ask for help, you can't assume their approach to the problem (suicide) is dysfunctional if you can't even understand said problem.

IMO this way of thinking arises from 4 wrong premises. "Life is to be preserved always no matter what, the patient who admits to be suicidal is not thinking clearly and needs help."
"No matter the condition (phisical or psychological), deciding to take your own life is never justifiable. It is perfectly ok to keep someone from killing himself without giving him any reasons not to do so."
"Pain can always be made bearable through therapy and/or medications."
"Doctors know what's best for you, you are ill and need treatment."
They are all extremely nonsensical, but right because of that most people agree with them.

Of course, their logic (or lack of) violates many logical rules and contains many logical fallacies, some of which include causation implying correlation, straw man, ad hominem (whenever they attack people's character or insult them), and many more. Furthermore, there is no objective evidence to suggest that what they said is true, only anecdotal evidence and that's not real science.

This forum is unique in the whole world, I don't know how many times I've felt better thanks to people here, because to feel you're not crazy that you want to die is sometimes the best 'cure'. To feel actually heared by someone, not labeled as 'crazy' to even have these thoughts. If we're talking about real help, then for me this forum has been real help, instead of being locked up in mental hospital all my human rights taken away from me, including freedom to have my own thoughts. I don't answer the thread right now, I know, but I agree with you.

I agree with you. This place has also given me answers and honest, genuine perspectives that cannot be found elsewhere.