S

summers

Visionary
Nov 4, 2020
2,495
I'm all for abortion rights, but I really dislike when demonstrators use the slogan My Body My Choice so narrowly. I feel like they stole a slogan that could have been used to legalize and normalize suicide.

First, it completely leaves out men.
Second, it basically is saying people should have autonomy over their bodies, but the demonstrators are only asking for autonomy over their uteri.

My Body My Choice is exactly what we should be fighting for. It would include, at the very least:
The right to peaceful suicide without having to jump though hoops.
The right to use any drugs a person wants (including abortion pills).
The right to elective surgery (including abortion).

I'm sure there are more that would be included.
 
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Bootleg Astolfo

Bootleg Astolfo

Glorious Bean Plushie
Oct 12, 2020
656
The right to surgically be enhanced into a cool robot.
 
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Life_and_Death

Life_and_Death

Do what's best for you 🕯️ Sometimes I'm stressed
Jul 1, 2020
6,826
I always figured it was a universal thing. I mean, remove any context and it is.
 
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hans0solo

hans0solo

Member
Dec 10, 2021
75
slogans are meant to focus of their target audience. the point of it was about the issue affecting woman. I can't think of any major issue of bodily autonomy for men that would be of the same caliber. Now as for autonomy for suicide, there is another way to consider it. As a crip, a politically identified disabled person, we consider ourselves to possess a body-mind, which recognizes that those two are connected. And as such, we strive for autonomy for our body-mind. I'm also involved in the 'mad rights' movement, which has a concept of cognitive liberty. This usually focused on our choice to take or not take drugs to affect our mind/brain.
 
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TAW122

TAW122

Emissary of the right to die.
Aug 30, 2018
6,703
Yes, I agree that there should be a better slogan, but perhaps "My Body My Choice" could be more in line with "My Uterus My Choice" (or if someone has a better name for pro-choice abortion rights then that would be even better).

And as for the right to die peacefully and with dignity, it could be "My Life My Choice" or something along those lines. Again, if someone has better slogans, feel free to come up with them.
 
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onlyanimalsaregood

onlyanimalsaregood

Unlovable 💔 Rest in peace CommitSudoku 🤍
Mar 11, 2022
1,329
It's just a slogan... Could be worse.
 
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Lebensunwertes

Lebensunwertes

Du bist auf dich allein gestellt
May 26, 2022
141
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Sans

Sans

Protesting the conditions of an inhumane world
Oct 2, 2019
343
I agree. The terms "my body, my choice" and "pro-choice" (as opposed to "pro-life") could very well be used to describe people who are pro-suicide.

I used to be pro-life (as in anti-abortion) until I realized the hypocrisy in that banning abortion would regulate what some people do with their bodies, which is the same thing I'm fighting against. While I still think abortion should be avoided whenever possible, I understand that it may be necessary sometimes.

Which is why I HATE when so-called "pro-choice" people try and take away our rights to assisted suicide. "My body, my choice" should apply to everyone, not just you. They want to have it both ways, and it pisses me off.

Oh yeah, and "my body, my choice" could also apply to the vaccine arguments, but that's a whole new can of worms.
 
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S

summers

Visionary
Nov 4, 2020
2,495
Oh yeah, and "my body, my choice" could also apply to the vaccine arguments, but that's a whole new can of worms.
In the US, they were never forced. You could choose not to get them, and you employer could choose to fire you. Still, your choice.

I think it has to go both ways. For example, I think you should be able to do whatever drugs you want. And kill yourself peacefully if you want. At the same time, I think insurance (both health and life) should be able to deny your claims, and employers can fire you for these behaviors.

There are no free rides. You want the freedom to choose, you have to deal with the consequences. No consequences = no choice.
 
dramatizelist

dramatizelist

Member
Jul 3, 2022
18
"My Life, My Right" would have a better rhyme to it, if one must have a slogan
 
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KuriGohan&Kamehameha

KuriGohan&Kamehameha

想死不能 - 想活不能
Nov 23, 2020
1,682
There are lots of bodily rights that we are deprived of, many of which you mentioned like ctb, drugs, elective procedures and surgeries, etc. Abortion is only the tip of the iceberg. One of the most infuriating things about living is how little control we have over our bodies.

For example, an employer practically owns you for the 8 or 9 hours a day you are at work. In countries where worker's rights aren't much of a priority, employers can subject you to a world of pain simply to squeeze out more profits or uphold meaningless social norms.

For example, in large european supermarkets, the employee working the till (often times this will be an elderly person) is allowed to have a chair to sit on. This is not the case in North America, or hypercapitalist asian countries where work culture revolves around looking as busy and tough as possible to give off the appearance of dedication and a strong work ethic.

In many jobs, especially manual labor, factory work, and food service, a person can't even decide when they are allowed to go to the bathroom. Loads of workplaces don't allow employees to choose when they get to have a meal or a break either, and have one sized fits all designated rest times. Of course, one can quit, but someone has to do these jobs.

Most people think the solution is to throw more money at the problem to compensate employees for shitty environments rather than first improving the working conditions of these professions and giving employees more bodily autonomy. A grown adult should not have to beg for permission to go take a piss or have a sandwich. Likewise, someone shouldn't have to break their back or harm themselves to "look busier."

Inaccessibility of medications is another thing that pisses me off. Gatekeeping everything behind a doctor's prescription means that some people will just suffer for life due to the ignorance and ego that comes with the territory of a profession holding such robust authority. Beurocratic hand typing also ensures that many people suffering from chronic pain will never have access to pain killers. Even if it goes against their personal principles, doctors are legally required to follow whatever asinine regulation exists, and deny people help so that they can protect their career.

If a person has no control over what they put into their body, if they have to put themselves through unnecessary harm and pain to make money, if they can't check out whenever they wish, getting manhandled and carted off to psychiatric wards when they express the desire to not exist.. Can we really say that humans have ownership over our bodies? Do we have the ability to make choices about our bodies? Not always.
 
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Zzzzz

Zzzzz

Nothing compares to the bliss of death.
Aug 8, 2018
879
There are lots of bodily rights that we are deprived of, many of which you mentioned like ctb, drugs, elective procedures and surgeries, etc. Abortion is only the tip of the iceberg. One of the most infuriating things about living is how little control we have over our bodies.

For example, an employer practically owns you for the 8 or 9 hours a day you are at work. In countries where worker's rights aren't much of a priority, employers can subject you to a world of pain simply to squeeze out more profits or uphold meaningless social norms.

For example, in large european supermarkets, the employee working the till (often times this will be an elderly person) is allowed to have a chair to sit on. This is not the case in North America, or hypercapitalist asian countries where work culture revolves around looking as busy and tough as possible to give off the appearance of dedication and a strong work ethic.

In many jobs, especially manual labor, factory work, and food service, a person can't even decide when they are allowed to go to the bathroom. Loads of workplaces don't allow employees to choose when they get to have a meal or a break either, and have one sized fits all designated rest times. Of course, one can quit, but someone has to do these jobs.

Most people think the solution is to throw more money at the problem to compensate employees for shitty environments rather than first improving the working conditions of these professions and giving employees more bodily autonomy. A grown adult should not have to beg for permission to go take a piss or have a sandwich. Likewise, someone shouldn't have to break their back or harm themselves to "look busier."

Inaccessibility of medications is another thing that pisses me off. Gatekeeping everything behind a doctor's prescription means that some people will just suffer for life due to the ignorance and ego that comes with the territory of a profession holding such robust authority. Beurocratic hand typing also ensures that many people suffering from chronic pain will never have access to pain killers. Even if it goes against their personal principles, doctors are legally required to follow whatever asinine regulation exists, and deny people help so that they can protect their career.

If a person has no control over what they put into their body, if they have to put themselves through unnecessary harm and pain to make money, if they can't check out whenever they wish, getting manhandled and carted off to psychiatric wards when they express the desire to not exist.. Can we really say that humans have ownership over our bodies? Do we have the ability to make choices about our bodies? Not always.

Would be nice to have full legal ownership of our own bodies lol
 
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Niko66

Niko66

Specialist
Dec 6, 2021
352
It doesn't really mean we can't use it as well for other purposes.
The (very poorly coined) term "pro-lifers" is usually understood as people against abortion but we use it here to refer to people against suicide.

Abortion is just the somehow controversial issue with the spotlight at the moment and there's enough people affected by it and advocating for it to be so. It's just how it goes, rights are obtained slowly if at all. At this point in time a lot of people would agree with the right for abortion. Not many people would agree with the right of having a free choice to suicide, if they were to include it then they would be hurting their own cause as it would make them seem more "extremist and irrational" and more easily dismissed by media and the masses.

I think looking negatively at other social movements is barking at the wrong tree is all.
 
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Lost Magic

Lost Magic

Illuminated
May 5, 2020
3,045
Great post. I agree with you to the point that I have nothing else to add.
 
self.destractive

self.destractive

ick/icks, they/them
Dec 11, 2020
85
i dont see what the big deal is personally - its just a slogan.

to be honest i think abortion rights should take priority over suicide rights. they are both important, but i feel like its a smarter idea to focus on the rights of the people intending to stick around for a bit longer. a part of me is actually grossed out when people use the terms pro-choice/pro-life in any context that isnt women's and AFAB people's rights. maybe its just me, but it feels like its taking away from that movement -

i should reiterate that i think everyone should have the right to end their life, i just think there are more pressing issues atm in this world. yeah it sucks that i cant go in to get legally and painlessly euthanized by trained professionals but you know what else sucks even HARDER? children being forced to carry pregnancies to term, abused women who are forced to bear their assailants unwanted brood, people dying of ectopic pregnancies who dont even WANT to die, unwanted children getting sent into a broken and painful foster care system (effectively dooming their life in some cases), etcetc

goodness me, im rambling. this wasnt even to anyone in here in particular im just very upset about recent steps my country is taking lmao - sorry about that
 
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S

summers

Visionary
Nov 4, 2020
2,495
children being forced to carry pregnancies to term, abused women who are forced to bear their assailants unwanted brood, people dying of ectopic pregnancies who dont even WANT to die, unwanted children getting sent into a broken and painful foster care system (effectively dooming their life in some cases), etc
I'm so going to hell for this, but suicide would take care of all these problems. Kind of a two birds one stone deal.

As for those who don't want to die - they just haven't experienced what the world is really like yet - they'll come around...

This isn't sarcasm or melodrama - just how fucked up of a person I am...
 
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self.destractive

self.destractive

ick/icks, they/them
Dec 11, 2020
85
I'm so going to hell for this, but suicide would take care of all these problems. Kind of a two birds one stone deal.

this is just about one of the shittiest takes ive seen. just because we want to go doesnt mean everyone else should be forced into that position. we should respect peoples right to live, and their right to health just as much as their right to die. proposing that suicide is a solution to unplanned pregnancies over, you know, achieving basic reproductive rights, is reckless and narrowminded at best.

this world is a scary place but it doesnt have to be that way. there are people who legitimately lead fulfilling and happy lives, and that shouldnt be cut short due to a lack of basic human rights. yeah. life may suck SHIT for us, but projecting that on other people is kind of really, for lack of a better term, dumb as fuck!
 
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S

summers

Visionary
Nov 4, 2020
2,495
this is just about one of the shittiest takes ive seen. just because we want to go doesnt mean everyone else should be forced into that position. we should respect peoples right to live, and their right to health just as much as their right to die. proposing that suicide is a solution to unplanned pregnancies over, you know, achieving basic reproductive rights, is reckless and narrowminded at best.

this world is a scary place but it doesnt have to be that way. there are people who legitimately lead fulfilling and happy lives, and that shouldnt be cut short due to a lack of basic human rights. yeah. life may suck SHIT for us, but projecting that on other people is kind of really, for lack of a better term, dumb as fuck!
You take things way too seriously. Lighten up.
 
H

Hookah-smoking-cat

Member
Apr 24, 2022
28
Um if suicide is what a person wants then how can anyone stop it? They can't.
 
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7b48hl

7b48hl

nuke the universe
Aug 2, 2022
59
I agree. The terms "my body, my choice" and "pro-choice" (as opposed to "pro-life") could very well be used to describe people who are pro-suicide.

I used to be pro-life (as in anti-abortion) until I realized the hypocrisy in that banning abortion would regulate what some people do with their bodies, which is the same thing I'm fighting against. While I still think abortion should be avoided whenever possible, I understand that it may be necessary sometimes.

Which is why I HATE when so-called "pro-choice" people try and take away our rights to assisted suicide. "My body, my choice" should apply to everyone, not just you. They want to have it both ways, and it pisses me off.

Oh yeah, and "my body, my choice" could also apply to the vaccine arguments, but that's a whole new can of worms.
Yeah because women have abortions for fun
I hope all fetus obsessed fuckers experience the hell that unwanted children like me go through. Not to mention the pain of the mother, but it's no secret they want women to suffer, including rape victims
 
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S

summers

Visionary
Nov 4, 2020
2,495
Yeah because women have abortions for fun
I am 100% pro choice, but actually, this is the case sometimes. A woman may get pregnant but not want to give up her current, free and fun lifestyle. While the abortion procedure (whether pill or surgical) isn't fun in and of itself, it may lead to a lot more fun for the woman down the road. And I'm totally OK with that. You don't want a kid for any reason at all, you shouldn't be forced to have one.
 
want2dienow

want2dienow

Atari hazure?
Jul 24, 2022
339
dislike all you like. it's factually true.
 
Celerity

Celerity

shape without form, shade without colour
Jan 24, 2021
2,733
I dislike it simply because it's easy for pro-lifers to turn it around and ask, "What about the baby's body?". I like Sam Harris's take on this even if people criticize it as "enlightened centrism".
 
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G

gh0stt0wn

Member
Aug 24, 2022
11
hear, hear. i want the similar freedoms to ctb or at least self medicate to make living less painful.