Discussion How to overcome doubt to CTB?

[ztupidity]

Hello again everyone!

I'm sorry if this kind of topic has been posted over and over on SS. I'm currently in deep trouble (for the umpteenth time). Once again because of my stupidity. I give up on myself. I want to CTB so bad. I see no point for continuing life in this old age with all this trouble. I am far left behind compared with all my old friends.

But somehow this doubt always comes up. This doubt consists of false hope that situation will getting better, something still give me pleasure in life, the questions about death itself, what's death like, what's nothingness like, will I regain consciousness again because of unthinkable situation in the future after I die, the story of people who comeback after troubled situations in their life, etc.

Can anybody explain what was like the mindset of these two brave young woman who "determined" to end their life. They have everything to live for yet they still managed to CTB.

Tragic teenager marked the date of her own death on her calendar

Alicia Sidebotham, 19, was found hanged in the woods

www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk

‘Super intelligent’ biomedicine student used knowledge to kill herself with caffeine

A "SUPER intelligent" student took her own life at university halls of residence with a lethal overdose of caffeine, an inquest was told.

www.dailystar.co.uk

 

[Shamana]

I think you really have to believe it's the right solution. I think it's easier for atheists since they belive that nothingness await us all at death anyway. Since i'm buddhist, I geniuenly don't believe my mind is destroyed at death so I don't actually believe it will solve anything since I believe in karma and rebirth. I just can't obsessing about because my mental health and somatic health has become shit and my daily life is nightmare.

Hello again everyone!

I'm sorry if this kind of topic has been posted over and over on SS. I'm currently in deep trouble (for the umpteenth time). Once again because of my stupidity. I give up on myself. I want to CTB so bad. I see no point for continuing life in this old age with all this trouble. I am far left behind compared with all my old friends.

But somehow this doubt always comes up. This doubt consists of false hope that situation will getting better, something still give me pleasure in life, the questions about death itself, what's death like, what's nothingness like, will I regain consciousness again because of unthinkable situation in the future after I die, the story of people who comeback after troubled situations in their life, etc.

Can anybody explain what was like the mindset of these two brave young woman who "determined" to end their life. They have everything to live for yet they still managed to CTB.

Tragic teenager marked the date of her own death on her calendar

Alicia Sidebotham, 19, was found hanged in the woods

www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk

‘Super intelligent’ biomedicine student used knowledge to kill herself with caffeine

A "SUPER intelligent" student took her own life at university halls of residence with a lethal overdose of caffeine, an inquest was told.

www.dailystar.co.uk

Reading those stories, I was sometimes wonder if AD's drive more young people to suicide. They have been proven to do so, so what is the rationalle for giving them to people under 25?

 

[ztupidity]

Reading those stories, I was sometimes wonder if AD's drive more young people to suicide. They have been proven to do so, so what is the rationalle for giving them to people under 25?

What is AD?

 

[Shamana]

What is AD?

Antidepressants. It's proven that they increase the risk of suicide in people under 25 and a new large study showed that they increase the risk in Adults 3-fold. It seems like tons of suicides and homocides were comitted by people on AD's. The ethics and science behind prescribing them to everyone is highly questionable.

 

[restingspot]

It'll happen naturally. Since you're an older member, and old age is your reason, just think of the path that awaits you in your 80s. 90s. Or you're a "lucky" person to be of a centennial age. Your body begins to slowly shut down when you hit your 70s, and starts to falter in the 30s. We really weren't biologically programmed to live beyond 40 since our developmental peak is in our 20s.

 

[ztupidity]

It'll happen naturally. Since you're an older member, and old age is your reason, just think of the path that awaits you in your 80s. 90s. Or you're a "lucky" person to be of a centennial age. Your body begins to slowly shut down when you hit your 70s, and starts to falter in the 30s. We really weren't biologically programmed to live beyond 40 since our developmental peak is in our 20s.

I'm going to 41 this year. That's an old age, right?

 

[restingspot]

I'm going to 41 this year. That's an old age, right?

It's considered middle aged socially, but biologically you start to have a lot of health problems, or your existing ones start to aggravate. If you're in perfect health by eating right and keeping in shape as well as train yourself cognitively, the aging will delay itself. There are people who are in their 70s who still to triathalons and shit because of that, and they don't look half bad either.

 

[Joannf]

Hello again everyone!

I'm sorry if this kind of topic has been posted over and over on SS. I'm currently in deep trouble (for the umpteenth time). Once again because of my stupidity. I give up on myself. I want to CTB so bad. I see no point for continuing life in this old age with all this trouble. I am far left behind compared with all my old friends.

But somehow this doubt always comes up. This doubt consists of false hope that situation will getting better, something still give me pleasure in life, the questions about death itself, what's death like, what's nothingness like, will I regain consciousness again because of unthinkable situation in the future after I die, the story of people who comeback after troubled situations in their life, etc.

Can anybody explain what was like the mindset of these two brave young woman who "determined" to end their life. They have everything to live for yet they still managed to CTB.

Tragic teenager marked the date of her own death on her calendar

Alicia Sidebotham, 19, was found hanged in the woods

www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk

‘Super intelligent’ biomedicine student used knowledge to kill herself with caffeine

A "SUPER intelligent" student took her own life at university halls of residence with a lethal overdose of caffeine, an inquest was told.

www.dailystar.co.uk

Only you can decide that. Hope is what makes humans tick - Columbus hoped he would get to India.
He lived to see West India... now he's being called an evil colonialist by crazies, but that shouldn't be a suicide reason.
Not for you, anyway ;)
Why would you WANT to give up hope so you can be hopeless enough to kill yourself ?
That makes no sense to me. If you have hope, you should go for it.

 

[ztupidity]

Only you can decide that. Hope is what makes humans tick - Columbus hoped he would get to India.
He lived to see West India... now he's being called an evil colonialist by crazies, but that shouldn't be a suicide reason.
Not for you, anyway ;)
Why would you WANT to give up hope so you can be hopeless enough to kill yourself ?
That makes no sense to me. If you have hope, you should go for it.

I'm tired being abused by hopes all my life :)

So fucking tired. All hopes is gone anyway

 

[ztupidity]

It's considered middle aged socially, but biologically you start to have a lot of health problems, or your existing ones start to aggravate. If you're in perfect health by eating right and keeping in shape as well as train yourself cognitively, the aging will delay itself. There are people who are in their 70s who still to triathalons and shit because of that, and they don't look half bad either.

In term of wealth, carrier, something like that, early 40s is the age you should have already settled down. If you're a failure and because of that you must going back to compete with those who just graduated from school, then you future is doomed. At least that's what happen in 3rd world country like where I live in.

 

[Joannf]

I'm going to 41 this year. That's an old age, right?

Are you male or female, zt ?

 

[restingspot]

In term of wealth, carrier, something like that, early 40s is the age you should have already settled down. If you're a failure and because of that you must going back to compete with those who just graduated from school, then you future is doomed. At least that's what happen in 3rd world country like where I live in.

It's definitely harder to escape the traditional roles society impedes on people when the country is still developing. Had you been in America or Europe it's much easier to just escape them. You could just go somewhere and never look back. Me personally? These days settling down isn't worth it. It's a waste of time and money and what little sanity we all have left. You're objectively better off single. More money, more free time, less relationship hassle to build onto the ones your family is giving you, etc.. In terms of careers, they don't have trade schools where you are, do they? Places where you can learn hands-on jobs like carpentry or plumbing, etc..

 

[ztupidity]

Are you male or female, zt ?

Joan, I see your posts here are nothing related with my question. I dont want hope as you suggested, I wanna die and conquer the doubt

If youre a pro life, this thread isnt suitable for u

 

[Joannf]

Joan, I see your posts here are nothing related with my question. I dont want hope as you suggested, I wanna die and conquer the doubt

If youre a pro life, this thread isnt suitable for u

I'm suicidal, does that answer your question ?
So you are saying that you want to have arguments that point you towards suicide only.
I find that interesting and have no problem with it. If you want me to give you such arguments, I can give you very convincing ones, but I don't want to be accused of talking someone into killing themselves later, and I don't want this documented on a public forum, if you see what I mean.

 

[lotus11]

Most of these stories, including one of a friend of mine, recently seem to use alcohol and or drugs before the death. I imagine that this is a large factor which allows them to 'cross the line' that you are referring to

 

[Soul]

In term of wealth, carrier, something like that, early 40s is the age you should have already settled down. If you're a failure and because of that you must going back to compete with those who just graduated from school, then you future is doomed. At least that's what happen in 3rd world country like where I live in.

I'm not sure whether the country I live in currently counts as 2nd or 3rd world but it's deffo not 1st. I'm older than you and have had to retire early due to health problems - and this is after realizing, when I was about your age, that the best I could hope for was to die while I was still working since retirement pensions are way below the poverty line, I have no kids, no spouse and an SO who's even less employable than I am.

So I believe I get what you mean. And I have always said that hope is about the saddest thing in the world. It's so naive and so damned hopeful, like a sprinkling of snow on Christmas hoping that this time the world really will be saved - but it never is.*

I don't know what to tell you. I'm an insane optimist too. I've got almost all the ingredients and I don't mind dying ... but I love my damn cats.

*For the record because it seems to make a difference in this thread for unknown reasons: I'm Jewish.

 

[Joannf]

Hello again everyone!

I'm sorry if this kind of topic has been posted over and over on SS. I'm currently in deep trouble (for the umpteenth time). Once again because of my stupidity. I give up on myself. I want to CTB so bad. I see no point for continuing life in this old age with all this trouble. I am far left behind compared with all my old friends.

But somehow this doubt always comes up. This doubt consists of false hope that situation will getting better, something still give me pleasure in life, the questions about death itself, what's death like, what's nothingness like, will I regain consciousness again because of unthinkable situation in the future after I die, the story of people who comeback after troubled situations in their life, etc.

Can anybody explain what was like the mindset of these two brave young woman who "determined" to end their life. They have everything to live for yet they still managed to CTB.

Tragic teenager marked the date of her own death on her calendar

Alicia Sidebotham, 19, was found hanged in the woods

www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk

‘Super intelligent’ biomedicine student used knowledge to kill herself with caffeine

A "SUPER intelligent" student took her own life at university halls of residence with a lethal overdose of caffeine, an inquest was told.

www.dailystar.co.uk

In a more serious vein - you are 41 and don't state your gender. 41 is different for men and women, you see... but anyway.
I find that suicide with remaining doubts is only possible if you have a perfect method/setup, that you KNOW will work, so you can pull the switch and be gone.
When you're in the mood.
If you have that, then all comes down to motivation.
You don't seem to be suffering from an illness ? Then the motivation is moot. That's a problem.
If you are just afraid to die, that can be helped but you shouldn't take lots of drugs as they might give you enthusiasm for life, just enough till the moment is past.
I don't think that there are any logical, functional arguments that would make you decisively want to die, if you are not suffering.
Just boredom is not enough.
The two girls must have had higher motives, probably personal ones that were not made public in the papers.
I can only advise you to create a perfect setup that will be ready for your use for at least half a year, so that whenever you feel like it, you're desperate enough, you can use that exit without further ado. It's exactly what I'm doing.

 

[not_a_robot]

Most of these stories, including one of a friend of mine, recently seem to use alcohol and or drugs before the death. I imagine that this is a large factor which allows them to 'cross the line' that you are referring to

This is my hope. I want to acquire an opiate/opioid habit to carry me over the edge. But I'm bad at buying drugs. :(

 

[Worndown]

I'm going to 41 this year. That's an old age, right?

No...

 

[Kjo]

"everything to live for"... Yet nothing to live for.

I imagine that's how everyone would see me. I'm very "successful" and fortunate from what the outside world sees. Regardless, I'm just so tired of fighting to live when I can't see a purpose or point to it all anyway.

 

[Joannf]

"everything to live for"... Yet nothing to live for.

I imagine that's how everyone would see me. I'm very "successful" and fortunate from what the outside world sees. Regardless, I'm just so tired of fighting to live when I can't see a purpose or point to it all anyway.

You're overthinking it.
Trust me.

 

[Nooneislistening727]

Hello again everyone!

I'm sorry if this kind of topic has been posted over and over on SS. I'm currently in deep trouble (for the umpteenth time). Once again because of my stupidity. I give up on myself. I want to CTB so bad. I see no point for continuing life in this old age with all this trouble. I am far left behind compared with all my old friends.

But somehow this doubt always comes up. This doubt consists of false hope that situation will getting better, something still give me pleasure in life, the questions about death itself, what's death like, what's nothingness like, will I regain consciousness again because of unthinkable situation in the future after I die, the story of people who comeback after troubled situations in their life, etc.

Can anybody explain what was like the mindset of these two brave young woman who "determined" to end their life. They have everything to live for yet they still managed to CTB.

Tragic teenager marked the date of her own death on her calendar

Alicia Sidebotham, 19, was found hanged in the woods

www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk

‘Super intelligent’ biomedicine student used knowledge to kill herself with caffeine

A "SUPER intelligent" student took her own life at university halls of residence with a lethal overdose of caffeine, an inquest was told.

www.dailystar.co.uk

I have similar doubts every time I consider CTB. I can't seem to break through them either. The only thing holding me back is my older brother. He suffers from depression as well and I'm worried that he will be incredibly devastated. But he has everything to live for; a vision for the future, a love for music, a house, a wife, 3 kids, and a possible 4th on the way. And at the same time even though I have incredible guilt of leaving him behind. I don't think it is worth being Incredibly depressed for the rest of my life,/!; doing it all for him and his wellbeing while rejecting my own. I'm torn between the one person I love and the hate for myself and life and everyone.

 

[wanttodie.nz]

I have doubts too. My wife wanted to separate because she said she had to do it for herself but it left me devastated. I can't get over it and move on from her so ctb seems to be the only way out for me. I can't live with this pain any longer. If she did that for herself then why can't I do this for myself?

 

[Joannf]

I will not return point by point on your text, however, must I confess that politics disgusts me since I am old enough to understand it ...

There is one thing that bothers me a little in your assertions, and this concerns Bernard-Henri Lévy, from where hold this argument "that he is the most respected French philosopher of his time" (?)

This character is disgusting, and is at the origin of the war in Libya in particular, he wrote many books, I grant you, but he is far from having the level of philosophical writing of Michel Onfray, who is considered rightly, as the best French philosopher of the moment.

To bounce back on the subject of philosophy, I would like to come back to two French philosophers who have marked my life, Gilles Deleuze and Michel Foucault.

Michel Foucault, whom I consider as a master of thought, is very much focused on the concept of normality and madness. He thought that "normality is an obsession and the concept of madness a tool of social control, a way to stigmatize difference, in short, a source of alienation for anyone who does not fit in with the whole. If you are not in the norm, then you are deviant, a term that bears all its weight of stigma. Deviance being a form of transgression, we are led to wonder: artists, poets and thinkers, revolutionaries would they not all be deviant? "

My favorite book :

https://monoskop.org/images/a/a2/Foucault_Michel_The_Order_of_Things_1994.pdf

Regards Greg.

I was being very ironic. Levy is a dressman.

 

[TAW122]

Anyways back to the OP's OT (original topic), I suppose the answer is that when people get desperate enough, fueled by resentment, anger, pure desolation (truly lost ALL hope), then CTB would be almost seamlessly. At that stage and state in life, it is reasonable to say any strong resistance from one's SI is pretty much extinguished (not all but almost all of it) such that the desire and courage to die exceeds the sliver of irrational hope that the subconscious is protruding.

Also, what @Shamana said. The fact about atheists not believing in a God, or an afterlife generally makes it easier for atheists to rationalize suicide.

 

[Alchemist]

This goes as warning to everyone.

Please avoid breaking the thread hijacking rule by going offtopic. I already sent warning to those involved.

 

[Solow]

You're not alone, that is why I am unfortunately still here. I have felt this way for many many years. But the more days that go by do extinguish my hope little by little everyday. I can feel myself getting more comfortable with ctb and less doubtful about it. I'm hoping here soon it will be easy without any hesitation. If you figure out a way to remove the doubt sooner let me know. That's the last piece of my plan.

 

[ztupidity]

You're not alone, that is why I am unfortunately still here. I have felt this way for many many years. But the more days that go by do extinguish my hope little by little everyday. I can feel myself getting more comfortable with ctb and less doubtful about it. I'm hoping here soon it will be easy without any hesitation. If you figure out a way to remove the doubt sooner let me know. That's the last piece of my plan.

I'm planning to do it in few days. I hope I can make it. I hope..... HAHAHA I "HOPe" . This is maybe my last hope

One thing I will do to remove the doubt is to explore the news of celebrity suicides or successful businessman suicides or those who are considered 'have everything to live for' suicides. Especially those who did it by hanging. That's my method. It's so third world country, right? ;)

If Anthony Bourdain or maybe the sweet little Kate Spade could do it without hesitation, why couldn't I? Why am I over thinking about it.

Easier said than done I know..

 

[Kjo]

You're overthinking it.
Trust me.

Overthinking what?