Method Having nitrous in the bag?

[Intractabe]

My plan is to use a ratchet tie down and a plastic bag. I have some whippits that I was thinking of filling the bag with before pulling it down over my head, but I'm worried I'll pass out or be too high to use the ratchet. It just seems like it would be nice to go out in bliss.

 

[profoundexperience]

The ratchet is my backup method & I'm really surprised more people don't use it (fast, ~painless, cheap, proven). It's gotta be more comfortable than hanging one's whole bodyweight by one's neck and certainly faster and ~likely more comfortable than SN (perhaps a lot more).

My plan/understanding with my ratchet is -- positioned properly high on the neck... above the "adams apple" area of course -- to keep pretty quickly -- keep-on cranking until I fainted, trying to push a few more clicks in at the end. While I can see how what you propose might be enjoyable... I think you need to know whether you're passing-out (fainting) due to the ratchet or due to the N2O = If you faint due to the whippits, you might not complete the ratcheting enough and that could lead to brain-damaged survival (particularly without a bag... a bag is generally is not required with the ratchet*, but may be used if desired).

HOWEVER, you plan to use a bag. This adds the complication of getting both the bag and the ratchet properly positioned on your neck... at the same time. AND, with managing the nitrous oxide N2O from leaking from the bag. I'm not sure you have enough N2O to come even close to filling a bag = if the NO2 got pretty diluted, will it have any effect?

FINALLY, >>> and please others comment on this as this is my speculation <<<: Typically, with the ratchet you're breathing regular, room air*. If your bag is small, carbon dioxide (CO2) will start to really build-up. If you're already passed-out, maybe no problem. But, CO2, not oxygen, is more what your body senses when it feels it's suffocating. If the CO2 builds-up in the bag and somehow you become aware of it, it may be unpleasant.

That's my thinking from the best of my knowledge...

P.S. If you follow the sensations as you pass out from the ratchet alone... you may find them just as pleasant as whippits (albeit likely somewhat different feeling).

* According to the instructions I follow from the "Five Last Acts" book by Docker.

 

[Intractabe]

The ratchet is my backup method & I'm really surprised more people don't use it (fast, ~painless, cheap, proven). It's gotta be more comfortable than hanging one's whole bodyweight by one's neck and certainly faster and ~likely more comfortable than SN (perhaps a lot more).

My plan/understanding with my ratchet is -- positioned properly high on the neck... above the "adams apple" area of course -- to keep pretty quickly -- keep-on cranking until I fainted, trying to push a few more clicks in at the end. While I can see how what you propose might be enjoyable... I think you need to know whether you're passing-out (fainting) due to the ratchet or due to the N2O = If you faint due to the whippits, you might not complete the ratcheting enough and that could lead to brain-damaged survival (particularly without a bag... a bag is generally is not required with the ratchet*, but may be used if desired).

HOWEVER, you plan to use a bag. This adds the complication of getting both the bag and the ratchet properly positioned on your neck... at the same time. AND, with managing the nitrous oxide N2O from leaking from the bag. I'm not sure you have enough N2O to come even close to filling a bag = if the NO2 got pretty diluted, will it have any effect?

FINALLY, >>> and please others comment on this as this is my speculation <<<: Typically, with the ratchet you're breathing regular, room air*. If your bag is small, carbon dioxide (CO2) will start to really build-up. If you're already passed-out, maybe no problem. But, CO2, not oxygen, is more what your body senses when it feels it's suffocating. If the CO2 builds-up in the bag and somehow you become aware of it, it may be unpleasant.

That's my thinking from the best of my knowledge...

P.S. If you follow the sensations as you pass out from the ratchet alone... you may find them just as pleasant as whippits (albeit likely somewhat different feeling).

* According to the instructions I follow from the "Five Last Acts" book by Docker.

Yeah, I read Five Last Acts and the ratchet method seems like the best to me. The helium is too complex and requires supplies. Altogether the book and the ratchet and the bag were $60, so I'm pretty happy about that.

It's not a huge bag, just an oven bag like the book recommended. I have probably ten canisters, which each fill a balloon, so it seems like there would plenty. Getting the bag over my head without the nos leaking out might prove difficult, but I figure if it does I just don't use the nos. Not like it's an essential ingredient, it just seems like it would be nice.

I've practiced some with the ratchet and it really doesn't need to be very tight to cut off blood flow. You're not trying to crush your windpipe, just block the carotids. I'm considering using folded shirts to target the pressure but I don't think you need it.

I'm thinking maybe I try doing a whippit and seeing exactly how long I can hold my breath and remain functional. I figure when the time comes, if I can remain conscious for long enough in testing, I put the ratchet on my neck and get it to just loose enough to slide the bag under. Then fill the bag, take a deep breath of normal air, and slide the bag over my head while trying to keep it as sealed as possible, and slide the opening under the strap. Start tightening the strap then let myself breathe out and in, and quickly tighten the strap more. It's hard to work the release so I don't think that will be an issue. If the bag leaks while I'm putting it on and the stuff dilutes, oh well. I guess I just won't go out high.

 

[Aap]

I'm normally all for combining complementary techniques, but in this case you are almost picking the worst of both worlds. Done correctly, night night is fast, painless, but requires proper technique. Nitrous itself won't make you unconscious, save for oxygen deprivation.

unfortunately, you will start rebreathing co2 immediately. This has more moving parts than a standard exit bag while simultaneously offering more risk of failure and long term damage if a failure.

 

[profoundexperience]

It's great you're practicing/dress rehearsals a lot & as an engineer*, I think the "Five Last Acts" book is awesome (although I'm pretty new here, the resources here are very extensive, and I haven't been able make a comparison).

I'm 100% NOT recommending this, just brainstorming with you. WHAT YOU'RE PROPOSING IS MORE RISKY because the more "moving parts" that are involved, the more that can go wrong. That said, if I were you, and absolutely determined to try it with whippets...

1. I would use some poly tubing --- very similar to tubing described in the inert gas chapter 1 of the Five Last Acts book... can get on A for ~$20, although maybe you want bigger tubing = bigger "inner diameter" tubing = less resistance = easier to breath through.
2. Start with the ratchet, loaded but not tight... around my neck, but resting on my shoulders. Have you decided what hand will do the ratchet & noticed how the ratchet moves position as you tighten it? You'll have to make sure it ends-up where you want it....
3. One poly tube stuck in my mouth, snaked down my neck, UNDERNEATH the ratchet = to breath through "~100% normally" while I was getting everything else setup perfectly.
4. A 2nd poly tube, also snaked under the ratchet could be used to "inject" the whippets into your bag -- at the last moment before you really start ratcheting.
5. Position the bag perfectly.
6. Bring the ratchet up and start tightening... just enough so everything stays in place. At this point, you're still breathing ~normally through the tube in your mouth.
7. "Inject" the whippets through the 2nd ploy tube into the bag. You don't want to "over-pressurize" the bag so that it might burst, though!
8. Exhale completely >>> pull both poly tubes out >>> start ratcheting >>> breathe in the air in the bag.

All that IS JUST AN IDEA and would require A LOT OF PRACTICING and working out the kinks.

P.S. There are something like over 400,000 posts here. Do please search thoroughly and see if someone may have already solved this.

* Although not in any field that qualifies me to advise on ctb... just my education level.

 

[Intractabe]

I'm normally all for combining complementary techniques, but in this case you are almost picking the worst of both worlds. Done correctly, night night is fast, painless, but requires proper technique. Nitrous itself won't make you unconscious, save for oxygen deprivation.

unfortunately, you will start rebreathing co2 immediately. This has more moving parts than a standard exit bag while simultaneously offering more risk of failure and long term damage if a failure.

I'm not sure what the failure risk is here. Using a bag in addition to the ratchet is recommended by the book, so that's not an issue. The alternative here is I just don't put nos in the bag. If the nos won't make me pass out, then what's the issue?

It's great you're practicing/dress rehearsals a lot & as an engineer*, I think the "Five Last Acts" book is awesome (although I'm pretty new here, the resources here are very extensive, and I haven't been able make a comparison).

I'm 100% NOT recommending this, just brainstorming with you. WHAT YOU'RE PROPOSING IS MORE RISKY because the more "moving parts" that are involved, the more that can go wrong. That said, if I were you, and absolutely determined to try it with whippets...

1. I would use some poly tubing --- very similar to tubing described in the inert gas chapter 1 of the Five Last Acts book... can get on A for ~$20, although maybe you want bigger tubing = bigger "inner diameter" tubing = less resistance = easier to breath through.
2. Start with the ratchet, loaded but not tight... around my neck, but resting on my shoulders. Have you decided what hand will do the ratchet & noticed how the ratchet moves position as you tighten it? You'll have to make sure it ends-up where you want it....
3. One poly tube stuck in my mouth, snaked down my neck, UNDERNEATH the ratchet = to breath through "~100% normally" while I was getting everything else setup perfectly.
4. A 2nd poly tube, also snaked under the ratchet could be used to "inject" the whippets into your bag -- at the last moment before you really start ratcheting.
5. Position the bag perfectly.
6. Bring the ratchet up and start tightening... just enough so everything stays in place. At this point, you're still breathing ~normally through the tube in your mouth.
7. "Inject" the whippets through the 2nd ploy tube into the bag. You don't want to "over-pressurize" the bag so that it might burst, though!
8. Exhale completely >>> pull both poly tubes out >>> start ratcheting >>> breathe in the air in the bag.

All that IS JUST AN IDEA and would require A LOT OF PRACTICING and working out the kinks.

P.S. There are something like over 400,000 posts here. Do please search thoroughly and see if someone may have already solved this.

* Although not in any field that qualifies me to advise on ctb... just my education level.

I'm really confused about what the potential failure mode is here.

 

[Aap]

Night night is one of the most technical methods. Taking something that will interfere with coordination is the issue. If you are set on your method, then you are set on your method.

 

[Intractabe]

Night night is one of the most technical methods. Taking something that will interfere with coordination is the issue. If you are set on your method, then you are set on your method.

How is it technical? Especially with a bag in addition, it's actually pretty hard to screw up.

 

[profoundexperience]

How is it technical? Especially with a bag in addition, it's actually pretty hard to screw up.

I don't know the night-night method so I can't say how it differs from Five Last Acts.

Docker did say in Five Last Acts that the ratchet was generally more attractive to the mechanically inclined & those who had used ratchets before. So, for me it was a natural, obvious choice... seems even too easy... $15 ratchet and that's all one really needs... why didn't I know about it years ago?

It IS "ACTIVE" in that it requires one to take physical/mechanical actions right to the end. Whereas, e.g., with SN you take the drugs and from then it's "passive" (welp one has to mentally deal with discomfort and maybe vomiting)... but there's basically nothing one can do.

I don't know about the word "technical"; I'd maybe say more "active/physical". I also agree it's pretty hard to screw-up (but, you are making it easier to screw-up if you make it more complicated... that's just a consequence of adding more parts).

I'd have to re-read what Docker says about the bag and CO2... I'm pretty sure he's counting on you passing out before it builds-up to noticeable levels.

 

[Aap]

It is technical in the sense that hitting the carotids seems difficult for most. Again, if you are set in your course, have at it.

 

[Living sucks]

@profoundexperience be careful about how much advice you're giving

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

@profoundexperience be careful about how much advice you're giving

Just curious, why? Am I missing something?

 

[Living sucks]

Just curious, why? Am I missing something?

It borders the line on this statement from the rules and FAQ

Moreover, be advised that NO ONE on this site will advise you on how to end your life. Helping someone die, including advising and including specifics, is against the rules of the site and is unethical. The site allows users to post raw information and respects individual choices, but beyond this point do not insist because you will not be helped.

But the more I ponder this, it's kind of similar to someone providing building instructions for a debreather ... so maybe I'm reading into it too much as being too close to including specifics.

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

It borders the line on this statement from the rules and FAQ

Moreover, be advised that NO ONE on this site will advise you on how to end your life. Helping someone die, including advising and including specifics, is against the rules of the site and is unethical. The site allows users to post raw information and respects individual choices, but beyond this point do not insist because you will not be helped.

But the more I ponder this, it's kind of similar to someone providing building instructions for a debreather ... so maybe I'm reading into it too much as being too close to including specifics.

Yeah, that statement is confusing. What are we supposed to do with it? Omit a crucial step in SN instructions? Be raw but not specific?

 

[Living sucks]

Ya, the more I think, it's no different than the megathreads or method threads by anyone else.. i saw steps listed and immediate thought was this is very specific instruction ... but so is the hanging, train, SN, exit bag etc threads...so carry on

 

[profoundexperience]

If you're sure it's the right thing and you must... wishing you ease, wellness and great equanimity right now, @Intractabe!

And, if the situation changes, good! I wish you ease, wellness and equanimity then too!! It'll all work out....