Failed exit bag attempt

[veniceofdetroit]

It should have worked out. I had all the correct materials: pure argon, gas regulator, modified tube from air compressor to ensure good connection, exit bag made of strong materials.

The parts where I must have messed up were:
the tightening mechanism on bag
and not binding my hands in some form.

I was out in the woods/great lakeshore and had laid out a blanket for my setup. Turned gas on and I must of passed out, but at some point regained consciousness. I just remember coming to spinning around and not remembering where I was. Then freaked put by cold I ran back to my car to turn heat on.

Is it possible I ripped the bag off while unconscious? I know I was and that the argon was pure.

 

[Brokenwithbpd]

Wow, I am sorry. I don't hear of many failed methods that way. I stay clear of it, it's all very confusing

 

[Interloper]

Well did you have the bag on when you regained consciousness?

 

[PrincessInWhite]

following as i'm interested in this method for myself and want to make sure I don't fail in the most common ways. I'm so sorry for your anguish but i'm relieved you're ok. <3 I'm sending you a loving warm hug

 

[veniceofdetroit]

Well did you have the bag on when you regained consciousness?

No—I must have ripped off. I'm not sure if binding my hands in some form would have made a difference? The bag was snuggly tightened, I guess not enough for me to involuntarily pull it off. No idea if I suffered any form of brain damage. Trying to muster courage to try hanging now

Well did you have the bag on when you regained consciousness?

 

[PrincessInWhite]

No—I must have ripped off. I'm not sure if binding my hands in some form would have made a difference? The bag was snuggly tightened, I guess not enough for me to involuntarily pull it off. No idea if I suffered any form of brain damage. Trying to muster courage to try hanging now

the gas itself isn't toxic, it's the oxygen deprivation that kills, so if you had brain damage you'd know it by now <3 be careful with partial, i've toyed with it and it's even easier to stand up or slip out than with the exit bag. i'm so sorry you're in so much pain

 

[veniceofdetroit]

the gas itself isn't toxic, it's the oxygen deprivation that kills, so if you had brain damage you'd know it by now <3 be careful with partial, i've toyed with it and it's even easier to stand up or slip out than with the exit bag. i'm so sorry you're in so much pain

Totally—it's inert gas. Thank you for reply

 

[wanttogetonthebus]

Scary I'm sorry that happened to you. I'd be terrified if it was me that I had brain damage and would be worse off. Wishing you the best going forward though. I've heard of a good deal of failed exit bag attempts before. That's why I couldn't use that method by itself.

 

[NekoNomNom]

Hello there. I am so sorry that this happened to you. I also had a failed exit bag attempt. I had the right set up as well, and even took some muscle relaxers to help prepare myself, and yet it failed. I still have no idea why.

I remember losing consciousness, and then suddenly feeling uncomfortable. Like something was wrong. I felt my body working completely on its own, tearing the bag off, and then my senses started coming back to me. It was awful.

Again, I'm so sorry that you experienced this. I hope you're doing better now.

 

[mrhighwaysend]

i think taking the bag off after you lose consciousness is common from what ive seen

 

[RIPwednesdayadams]

Can I ask a question? Has anyone just used helium? I figured helium would be easy to obtain without much of a fuss compared to other gasses.

 

[veniceofdetroit]

Can I ask a question? Has anyone just used helium? I figured helium would be easy to obtain without much of a fuss compared to other gasses.

You need 100% helium. In order to get that, you have to go to a welding supply or airgas store anyway. It has to be 100% inert gas

i think taking the bag off after you lose consciousness is common from what ive seen

It makes sense. Once you lose consciousness, instinct to survive kicks it. That's why guns freak me out—I'd be scared that my hand would slip bc of that natural instinct.

 

[Interloper]

No—I must have ripped off. I'm not sure if binding my hands in some form would have made a difference? The bag was snuggly tightened, I guess not enough for me to involuntarily pull it off. No idea if I suffered any form of brain damage. Trying to muster courage to try hanging now

I think some form of restraints for my hands seems neccesary then. I'll probably use some of the leftover elastic like fromgermany advised me, because handcuffs and the like might increase my anxiety levels.

 

[4eyebiped]

Argon is the one gas I personally wouldn't use or recommend for the exit bag. I haven't read the exit bag thread so I do not know what they recommend. My reasoning for avoiding it is based on my limited general knowledge on gases, how I envision things playing out in various scenarios and the success rate that I wish to achieve, 100%.

Argon (Ar) has more mass than Helium (He) and Nitrogen(N). Ar is about 1.4 times heavier than the average mixture of air. Being heavier, it will sink. I know someone is going to point out CO2 being 1.5 times heavier than an average mixture of air and that is what one would be breathing out in the bag. Fair enough, but that puts Ar and CO2 roughly close to being neutrally buoyant to each other. I could then see the potential for CO2 to build up (Keep in mind the air turbulence caused by the inflow of gas from the cylinder which will help to trap a gas that isn't substantially heavier). If CO2 builds up the body will respond to that, as it is toxic, while Ar, Ne, and N are not.

In the end I want a light gas that has the added benefit, regardless to how small, to assist with evacuating out all unwanted gases combined with the inflow of that gas from the tank. He is the king and N is the runner-up.

I am not claiming this to be what caused your situation to fail, but if CO2 levels were high enough, due to not be evacuated, then the body would had been forced to respond. Beyond that, you want a bag that isn't very easy to pull off. It has to only be lose enough to allow gas to easily escape. It also has to be prefilled with the gas before putting it on, so you are not fighting to evacuate unwanted gases at the start.

Do your own research and do not assume me to be accurate.

 

[Noctis]

You need 100% helium. In order to get that, you have to go to a welding supply or airgas store anyway. It has to be 100% inert gas

Correct. And you can't get it from a party store. Helium for balloons is sold with 20% oxygen mixed in for this exact reason.

 

[PrincessInWhite]

Argon is the one gas I personally wouldn't use or recommend for the exit bag. I haven't read the exit bag thread so I do not know what they recommend. My reasoning for avoiding it is based on my limited general knowledge on gases, how I envision things playing out in various scenarios and the success rate that I wish to achieve, 100%.

Argon (Ar) has more mass than Helium (He) and Nitrogen(N). Ar is about 1.4 times heavier than the average mixture of air. Being heavier, it will sink. I know someone is going to point out CO2 being 1.5 times heavier than an average mixture of air and that is what one would be breathing out in the bag. Fair enough, but that puts Ar and CO2 roughly close to being neutrally buoyant to each other. I could then see the potential for CO2 to build up (Keep in mind the air turbulence caused by the inflow of gas from the cylinder which will help to trap a gas that isn't substantially heavier). If CO2 builds up the body will respond to that, as it is toxic, while Ar, Ne, and N are not.

In the end I want a light gas that has the added benefit, regardless to how small, to assist with evacuating out all unwanted gases combined with the inflow of that gas from the tank. He is the king and N is the runner-up.

I am not claiming this to be what caused your situation to fail, but if CO2 levels were high enough, due to not be evacuated, then the body would had been forced to respond. Beyond that, you want a bag that isn't very easy to pull off. It has to only be lose enough to allow gas to easily escape. It also has to be prefilled with the gas before putting it on, so you are not fighting to evacuate unwanted gases at the start.

Do your own research and do not assume me to be accurate.

This is a great point and I wonder how
Many exit bag failures this contributes to. I will definitely go with nitrogen now

 

[4eyebiped]

This is a great point and I wonder how
Many exit bag failures this contributes to. I will definitely go with nitrogen now

If you want to compare the various gases yourself.

https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/gas-density-d_158.html

 

[NekoNomNom]

Can I ask a question? Has anyone just used helium? I figured helium would be easy to obtain without much of a fuss compared to other gasses.

I used 100% helium that I bought from a gas depot.

 

[LADY007]

Correct. And you can't get it from a party store. Helium for balloons is sold with 20% oxygen mixed in for this exact reason.

True.. Too much oxygen in helium

 

[Faraknur]

ok good to know. i will us some rope at the beams of my bed so i dont rip it off.

 

[UpandDownPrincess]

The bastard that made you rip the bag off is our old friend SI.

That's the thing about SI - it's an instinct and is beyond our consciousness. Binding your hands might work but you'd be amazed at how determined your body is to stay alive. It doesn't care what your brain wants.

I'm sorry your experience was not what you wanted. You might want to give yourself some time and space to think and plan before trying again.

 

[Daria98765]

bruh,this sucks.
but some people die fast with nitro or helium and some like you are not,I wonder why lol
I don't want same experience

 

[outrider567]

bruh,this sucks.
but some people die fast with nitro or helium and some like you are not,I wonder why lol
I don't want same experience

That's why I got the EEBD hood, because unlike a thin Exit Bag, the hood is more difficult to take off the head in case SI kicks in--The hood just takes longer to go unsconcious

 

[Daria98765]

The hood just takes longer to go unsconcious

Why?Standard exit bag do this around 30-60 seconds.
How long does it take for EEBD?

 

[lofticries]

This is why I abandoned this method.

 

[Daria98765]

I remember losing consciousness, and then suddenly feeling uncomfortable. Like something was wrong. I felt my body working completely on its own, tearing the bag off, and then my senses started coming back to me. It was awful.

Sorry to hear about your experience.
Were you lying or sitting when you started?

 

[color_me_gone]

but that puts Ar and CO2 roughly close to being neutrally buoyant to each other. I could then see the potential for CO2 to build up (Keep in mind the air turbulence caused by the inflow of gas from the cylinder which will help to trap a gas that isn't substantially heavier). If CO2 builds up the body will respond to that, as it is toxic, while Ar, Ne, and N are not

Absolutely this!

Mix water and oil together, and they very quickly separate due to significant differences in their densities.
Mix a bottle of ink into water, and it almost stays in suspension, as their densities are nearly the same.

The exit bag method relies on the CO2 being much denser than the inert gas, causing it to quickly sink to the bottom, and out of the bottom of the bag opening around your neck. Problem here is Ar and CO2 densities are nearly identical.

While CO2 is not toxic, it does trigger the body's hypercapnic alarm, which is the feeling of suffocation.
The hypercapnic alarm then triggers the body's survival instinct, in which it will do whatever it takes to survive.
I would not recommend using Ar for this method. even though it is called out in many documents outlining this method.

Sadly, He is in very short supply, at least last I'd heard, which makes it hard to get, and very expensive, especially for near purity.
So N2 seems to be the way to go.

 

[Lastsauce]

The exit bag method relies on the CO2 being much denser than the inert gas, causing it to quickly sink to the bottom, and out of the bottom of the bag opening around your neck. Problem here is Ar and CO2 densities are nearly identical.

I have to disagree with this. Only sufficient flow of the inert gas of your choice is needed to dilute and flush some of the small amount of CO2 you breathe out.
The main goal here is to displace oxygen and pass out fast. I don't get any kind of hypercapnia with a low flow of 10lpm of compressed air. Only looked stupid with the oven bag on my head.

 

[outrider567]

Why?Standard exit bag do this around 30-60 seconds.
How long does it take for EEBD?

3 to 6 minutes supposedly--Greenberg says EEBD hood is a 'classier' way to go than Exit Bag--Not sure why it takes that long to pass out, because my Oxygen number dropped just as fast with the Hood as it did with the Exit Bag

 

[Daria98765]

3 to 6 minutes supposedly--Greenberg says EEBD hood is a 'classier' way to go than Exit Bag--Not sure why it takes that long to pass out, because my Oxygen number dropped just as fast with the Hood as it did with the Exit Bag

Hmmm strange