Discussion Does hope exist or is it an illusion?

[Sad_Autistic_boy_101]

Does hope exist or is it an illusion?

I feel people try to force false hope onto us, whether that's trying to convince us good things can happen or telling us to try and focus on the positives. I think they do this to make themselves feel better if we are still alive.

I just think it's a cruel mind game that people keep playing with me. I always end up beleiveing them and then every time I get crushed when nothing improves or things get better.

For some reason I keep giving life a chance and it still ends up the same dissapointment. I'm tired of living groundhog day every day, I just feel so trapped with no way out. My country has made it hard to access anything that can be used to CTB, especially for disabled people.

 

[celestialsnowangel]

it is real, 'hope' is a term used to compartmentalise survival instinct and the illusory feelings of profundity that accompany it; it's actually much more brutish than it is poetic. humans are quite literally hardwired to be optimistic, but if you're disordered, as i suppose we all are, you're going to be deviating from nature. when people preach 'hope' to you, it isn't 'false hope', it's real to them because they're healthy enough to feel it, their mistake is in assuming people suffering from suicidal ideation/depression possess the same cognitive potentiality as them. it's coming from a good place, just one of fundamental incomprehension.

 

[FuneralCry]

No for me, my existence is nothing but suffering and no matter what I'd only ever wish for death, I only hope to never exist again, I'd never wish for something as cruel, painful and torturous as having the ability to exist. I find existing deeply undesirable and under no circumstances would I want to suffer for decades longer in this existence where there is no limit as to how much agony one can feel, more than anything I wish I never suffered in this existence at all.

 

[rocketman99]

hope is an affect, a feeling. It exists as much as any other feeling. I think you are asking if there something to hope for or if change is possible?

Life is arbitrary and good things are as likely to happen as bad. Some people place their bets on the good stuff happening; others can't do this for whatever reason. The irony is that if you place your bets on the good stuff happening, it becomes more likely, and it will get you through the bad stuff.

Some people find this impossible to do and live without hope. Living without hope is very difficult and actually ends up being self-fulfilling as the future becomes gradually more impossible.

So how can you find a way to hope? Find something to live for would be my suggestion.

 

[pthnrdnojvsc]

it is real, 'hope' is a term used to compartmentalise survival instinct and the illusory feelings of profundity that accompany it; it's actually much more brutish than it is poetic. humans are quite literally hardwired to be optimistic, but if you're disordered, as i suppose we all are, you're going to be deviating from nature. when people preach 'hope' to you, it isn't 'false hope', it's real to them because they're healthy enough to feel it, their mistake is in assuming people suffering from suicidal ideation/depression possess the same cognitive potentiality as them. it's coming from a good place, just one of fundamental incomprehension.

I'm not disordered because i see life as meaningless suffering.

no one can tell my why i have to have hope or be "optimistic" or to live or do anything . there is no reason. life is meaningless.

nothing matters. what will matter in 200 years ? what will matter in 10,000 years? in a trillion years ? nothing.

the only thing that matters to me is avoiding long lasting constant extreme excruciating unbearable pain. no one can tell me why i have to have hope or do anything for any reason and much less to work so hard to be in a state of danger of falling into a trap of something very horrible happening to me

i don't want to hope for anything except killing myself asap to get out of this hell this prison this evil imposition.

no one can tell me why i have to have "hope" to work all day hard just to be a slave prisoner to be in a state of where something even more horrible can happen to me

You know how i reached these and 1000 pages more of these conclusions? logic and rational thinking

I'm not hardwired to be "pessimistic" or anything. i used this brain right here to see life is meaningless and that nothing matters but that i do want to avoid extreme pain. And that's the only thing i want to avoid extreme pain and extreme suffering.

no one can tell my why i have to do anything even live. no one can change my mind about anything

 

[rocketman99]

I'm not disordered because i see life as meaningless suffering.

no one can tell my why i have to have hope or be "optimistic" or to live or do anything . there is no reason. life is meaningless.

nothing matters. what will matter in 200 years ? what will matter in 10,000 years? in a trillion years ? nothing.

the only thing that matters to me is avoiding long lasting constant extreme excruciating unbearable pain. no one can tell me why i have to have hope or do anything for any reason and much less to work so hard to be in a state of danger of falling into a trap of something very horrible happening to me

i don't want to hope for anything except killing myself asap to get out of this hell this prison this evil imposition.

no one can tell me why i have to have "hope" to work all day hard just to be a slave prisoner to be in a state of where something even more horrible can happen to me

You know how i reached these and 1000 pages more of these conclusions? logic and rational thinking

I'm not hardwired to be "pessimistic" or anything. i used this brain right here to see life is meaningless and that nothing matters but that i do want to avoid extreme pain. And that's the only thing i want to avoid extreme pain and extreme suffering.

no one can tell my why i have to do anything even live. no one can change my mind about anything

So something is only meaningful if it lasts forever? I would actually argue the opposite and say that finitude is what makes life meaningful.

What you're saying isn't rational. I'm not saying it's wrong; it's just not logically sound.

Life clearly isn't just suffering. The way you see the world is just that: the way you see the world. It's not how things are, it's how you are. Maybe it makes life easier to act as though life is uniformly awful all the time. Gets rid of the contradictions and ambiguities. But life isn't just awful all the time.

 

[pthnrdnojvsc]

So something is only meaningful if it lasts forever? I would actually argue the opposite and say that finitude is what makes life meaningful.

What you're saying isn't rational. I'm not saying it's wrong; it's just not logically sound.

Life clearly isn't just suffering. The way you see the world is just that: the way you see the world. It's not how things are, it's how you are. Maybe it makes life easier to act as though life is uniformly awful all the time. Gets rid of the contradictions and ambiguities. But life isn't just awful all the time.

you can't tell me why something has to be meaningful , important to me . life has no objective meaning. life is meaningless

so you say i'm irrational and i'm not being logical because i don't buy into some of the ridiculous garbage they tell me is important or meaningful . why is life or anything meaningful or important . what is the objective meaning of life or some of the ridiciulous addictions they say are so important?

what will you trade or have me trade for getting 95% of my skin burned off in a fire and having to live like that? there is no reason to live anyway much less to risk extreme torture

There are in addition multiple levels on top of what i mention why life is meaningless suffering. not just that it's fleeting meaningless garbage you don't remember even while alive much less after you're dead but all the hard work and extreme suffering you have to risk for that meaningless fleeting forgotten garbage

 

[rocketman99]

no, no one can tell you anything, you've made that clear. Congratulations

 

[pthnrdnojvsc]

no, no one can tell you anything, you've made that clear. Congratulations

you can't tell me why something has to be meaningful , important to me .

what i mean is you can type it but i don't have to accept it as truth and then have to make it important to me and i wont . and i can debunk anything anyone posts that says i have to do something . your morality is not the one objective morality.

 

[rocketman99]

I never said you did. I was saying what I thought. My morality and worldview is not objective, and neither is yours. Life is about as meaningful as you want to make it imo.

 

[pain6batch9]

Hope exists as much as any other human emotion or concept. I'd like to think I still have it as much as the opposite, despair. I'm obviously not speaking for everyone, but for me, there's a kind of balance between the two. It gets knocked out of kilter sometimes to be sure. At my lowest moments, the scales tipped in favour of despair, that's when I come close to the bus stop.

If I was asking myself this question, or say, to another version of myself, I would adapt it as follows: Does hope ever completely vanish?

My answer to this adaptation is: No, never completely. It may be squashed or out of sight, but it's there.

Just my personal take.