Discussion 'Do you have thoughts of hurting yourself or hurting others?'

[Forever Sleep]

I read a very moving post by @ceserasera yesterday concerning a question like this. I didn't want to derail their thread- so I've started another.

I remember on the mental health assessment, one of the questions was: (or was similar to)

'Do you have thoughts of hurting yourself or hurting others?'

Were you ever asked this on a mental health questionnaire or in therapy? The post yesterday reminded me of it. I remember at the time it really bothered me- I thought- shouldn't that be two separate questions? Do I want to hurt myself? (Yes) Do I want to hurt others? (No.) Aren't they even interested in whether I am suicidal or homicidal?

Of course- it made me realise- no- they probably don't care. If you are caught trying to murder yourself, the result will kind of be similar to that if you were caught trying to murder someone else- you will involuntarily have your freedom taken away.

It's just another example where the suicidal person is treated as two people- in essence- a regular person (who has the right to be protected) and a murderer (who needs to be forcibly restrained.) The suicidal person IS a murderer in the eyes of psychiatry and the law.

 

[Jadzia]

Never hurting others but I have a history of self harm

 

[donealready]

Yes, heard that question a lot. Also have history of self-harm. I feel there is a huge difference between thoughts, plans / intentions and actions.
All about 'assessing risk' and ticking boxes.

 

[MideonNViscera]

I've heard it many times. Depending on who it's coming from I may tell the truth, or I might lie.

 

[ceserasera]

I read a very moving post by @ceserasera yesterday concerning a question like this. I didn't want to derail their thread- so I've started another.

I remember on the mental health assessment, one of the questions was: (or was similar to)

'Do you have thoughts of hurting yourself or hurting others?'

Were you ever asked this on a mental health questionnaire or in therapy? The post yesterday reminded me of it. I remember at the time it really bothered me- I thought- shouldn't that be two separate questions? Do I want to hurt myself? (Yes) Do I want to hurt others? (No.) Aren't they even interested in whether I am suicidal or homicidal?

Of course- it made me realise- no- they probably don't care. If you are caught trying to murder yourself, the result will kind of be similar to that if you were caught trying to murder someone else- you will involuntarily have your freedom taken away.

It's just another example where the suicidal person is treated as two people- in essence- a regular person (who has the right to be protected) and a murderer (who needs to be forcibly restrained.) The suicidal person IS a murderer in the eyes of psychiatry and the law.

If I said I was going to hurt someone else (never have in my life nor do I plan on it) they'd believe me immediately. Because I'm always a 'threat'. If I told them I'm going to kill myself they'd take that as a threat too, but a different kind. It would be a threat to them professionally, post-humously, because of course my suicidal feelings are all about them. Nothing to do with *me*.

 

[Pentobarbital_Plz]

"Omg, oh fuck. Help me! Please! Someone is trying to kill me!!"

"!! Who?? Where are they?"

*Rips open skull, exposing brain* "Quick! Get 'em!!"

 

[Darkover]

i stopped taking my medication for 6 month and became seriously ill again in an emergency i rang up the mental health team to get me some medication one of the question was exactly that, to whice i answer no knowing full well knowing if i had said yes i would of been taken to a mental hopsital

but to answer the thread title i have throughts of killing everything and everybody i woudlent want to take the risk of being born again
if rebirth is a thing then i wouldn't want to take the risk by leaving anything alive here that could bring me back to life

 

[LaVieEnRose]

That's standard risk assessment. Therefore they ask that question all the time. They're always spooked about liability (especially in litigious America) so that's where that question is mainly coming from.

 

[Anonymus]

I'm already hurting myself in my slow process of self-destruction, but for whatever reason mental health professionals keep thinking of classic self-harm when they ask you this question and leave out other forms of self-harm harm to oneself that are irreversible (such as forcing your eyes to see in a certain way in which you will lose vision forever or not taking according to which foods or habits that in the long run will generate problems with your bones and that you will not be able to, of no way, solve).

In fact, I already have a long list of well-consumed self-destruction that all it does is facilitate my CTB at a given moment and without anyone noticing.

//

Jo ja m'estic fent mal a mi mateix dins el meu lent procés d'autodestrucció, però pel motiu que sigui els especialistes en salut mental segueixen pensant en les clàssiques autolesions quan et fan aquesta pregunta i deixen de banda altres formes de fer-se mal a un mateix que són irreversibles (com forçar la vista a veure d'una determinada manera en la qual perdràs visió per sempre o no prendre segons quins aliments o hàbits que a la llarga et generaràn problemes amb els òssos i que no podràs, de cap manera, sol·lucionar).

De fet ja tinc una llarga llista d'autodestrucció ben consumada que l'únic que fa és facilitar en un moment donat el meu CTB i sense que ningú se n'adoni.

 

[Forever Sleep]

That's standard risk assessment. Therefore they ask that question all the time. They're always spooked about liability (especially in litigious America) so that's where that question is mainly coming from.

I agree and that makes a callous sense. I'm just curious as to how they lump 'hurting yourself' and 'hurting others' in together. Then, if you answer 'yes'- in the UK anyhow (or- in my experience) they don't seem too bothered which it is- hurting yourself or hurting others! It's a BIG distinction to me- but perhaps not to them.

Still- maybe because I pretty much fell over myself to establish I had no desire to go out and hurt someone else...

 

[Sadgirldaisy]

I started lying. I got tired of being forced to make asinine safety plans or getting committed.

 

[Rogue Proxy]

I started lying. I got tired of being forced to make asinine safety plans or getting committed.

Imagine being interrogated for "suicide risk assessment" while being hooked up to a highly advanced - and highly accurate - lie detector machine. (Not a polygraph.) *He shutters.* Absolutely. Fucking. Terrifying.

 

[byebyered]

I've been confused on the hurting others/homicidal question….is it like do you walk in the grocery store & think about killing everybody or…do you have intrusive thoughts about hurting others under certain circumstances? Like rage or anger ? I don't want or see myself hurting others on purpose but sadly , I can see myself hurting someone after being provoked. I've been a doormat/pushover for most of my life so I do have built up anger from situations where I didn't stand up for myself. I feel like people try to purposely get a reaction out of me sometimes. I can see myself losing it one day and just going off on the next person who disrespects me but I don't think I would consider myself homicidal. Sometimes the scenarios are violent & it does scare me to think what I could be capable of under enough anger.

 

[Forever Sleep]

I've been confused on the hurting others/homicidal question….is it like do you walk in the grocery store & think about killing everybody or…do you have intrusive thoughts about hurting others under certain circumstances? Like rage or anger ? I don't want or see myself hurting others on purpose but sadly , I can see myself hurting someone after being provoked. I've been a doormat/pushover for most of my life so I do have built up anger from situations where I didn't stand up for myself. I feel like people try to purposely get a reaction out of me sometimes. I can see myself losing it one day and just going off on the next person who disrespects me but I don't think I would consider myself homicidal. Sometimes the scenarios are violent & it does scare me to think what I could be capable of under enough anger.

I think they likely mean more along the lines of having a desire to hurt people (sadistically or random acts of violence maybe.) I think retaliation is perhaps more 'normal'- especially in self defence. I don't know though.

Still- that in itself is interesting. A desire to hurt yourself I'd argue ISN'T always present in people who want to kill themselves. Plenty of people here DO have a desire to self harm but some don't. I don't usually have an intense desire to hurt myself. I have a couple of times but it's not common. It actually troubles me that in order to kill myself- I am going to have to hurt myself. Most people here I would say actually want to die WITHOUT hurting themselves... That's why we're all on here looking for peaceful methods!

 

[rpxrpl]

In my experience they take the "harming others" part much more seriously. Before I discovered this site I had tried a few different things (bag, jumping from window, car crash into a thick tree) and then I mentioned trying to get someone else to run me over. (Look, I was desperate, and no I didn't try it) The moment they heard that they had me committed, explicitly told me because others would be involved/put in harm's way. So no I don't think they believe they are very connected, it's more of a liability thing as others have mentioned.