Discussion Death Counsellors

[Disappointered]

I am in favour of creating a field in which someone specializes in helping people overcome anxieties about suicide. I know it will seem way too controversial at the moment but I hope it happens in the future. So many people would benefit. This site has a lot of posts that demonstrate the need for this kind of assistance. I know there is a relatively new (?) role similar to what I am suggesting called "Death Doula" so that is a good step in the right direction. I find the Doula thing a bit new agey and as a result it doesn't really inspire a lot of confidence for me. I hope there will soon also be professionals of some sort who focus more on scientific and ethical reasons that refute and/or provide rational management of the anxiety some of us have about taking personal initiative to speed up and facilitate the ending of our lives.

 

[Forever Sleep]

Interesting but I expect a lot of anxieties are based around personal feelings and beliefs. I'm not sure how you change them for people. I'm not even entirely sure that you should. We're talking about things like religion here, feelings of love and commitment towards family members and fears of failing an attempt.

Just my feeling but for me- a place like this seems more supportive in that it allows people to openly talk about their concerns and doubts. Then, allows a group of people feeling the same way to share their own feelings and ways of looking at things. I love this place because it is a kind of sounding ground. It's not about trying to convince people of an idea. It's giving space for people to present a whole range of ideas and options that a person can consider.

Maybe I've got this all wrong but- I'll give you an example maybe: A 20 year old with a religious background and, close to their parents. They want to die. They're sure of that. But- they're afraid. Their religion makes them afraid of the judgement they may receive and they fear they may go to hell. They don't want to hurt their parents. They're not even sure whether they should tell their parents. They feel sure it would destroy them. They have researched different methods and chosen one but they are also deeply concerned about failing an attempt. How would you reassure them?

Of course- the upside would be that someone seeking out something like that would actually be looking to be reassured but again- just how much can you/ we reassure each other? We don't know for sure whether there is a God or afterlife. You can't tell them with any confidence that their parents will be ok and that leaving them a note will solve everything. You can't even assure them that their method to CTB will work.

I love the idea of caring and supporting someone through their anxieties but to be truthful- sadly- we simply can't reasure people that literally any aspect of it will be ok. I guess that's what makes it so hard. I do love your idea though. Maybe if assisted suicide was widely legalised and accepted- it would certainly be a wonderful support but with everything being so under the radar and physically hazardous, I don't see how it could work now. I guess maybe that's what you had in mind though- a time when suicide was more widely accepted and assisted suicide would guarantee a painless exit.

 

[Disappointered]

Interesting but I expect a lot of anxieties are based around personal feelings and beliefs. I'm not sure how you change them for people. I'm not even entirely sure that you should. We're talking about things like religion here, feelings of love and commitment towards family members and fears of failing an attempt.

Just my feeling but for me- a place like this seems more supportive in that it allows people to openly talk about their concerns and doubts. Then, allows a group of people feeling the same way to share their own feelings and ways of looking at things. I love this place because it is a kind of sounding ground. It's not about trying to convince people of an idea. It's giving space for people to present a whole range of ideas and options that a person can consider.

Maybe I've got this all wrong but- I'll give you an example maybe: A 20 year old with a religious background and, close to their parents. They want to die. They're sure of that. But- they're afraid. Their religion makes them afraid of the judgement they may receive and they fear they may go to hell. They don't want to hurt their parents. They're not even sure whether they should tell their parents. They feel sure it would destroy them. They have researched different methods and chosen one but they are also deeply concerned about failing an attempt. How would you reassure them?

Of course- the upside would be that someone seeking out something like that would actually be looking to be reassured but again- just how much can you/ we reassure each other? We don't know for sure whether there is a God or afterlife. You can't tell them with any confidence that their parents will be ok and that leaving them a note will solve everything. You can't even assure them that their method to CTB will work.

I love the idea of caring and supporting someone through their anxieties but to be truthful- sadly- we simply can't reasure people that literally any aspect of it will be ok. I guess that's what makes it so hard. I do love your idea though. Maybe if assisted suicide was widely legalised and accepted- it would certainly be a wonderful support but with everything being so under the radar and physically hazardous, I don't see how it could work now. I guess maybe that's what you had in mind though- a time when suicide was more widely accepted and assisted suicide would guarantee a painless exit.

Thanks for your feedback, it is very valuable.

Yes, I am voicing my support for moving things toward more acceptance of suicide as well as finding ways to make it easier for those who don't want pro-life assistance. I am not suggesting it be created right now or ever necessarily integrated into this website. Pro-choice means one can choose to seek assistance for how and when they choose to end their life but it's a shame there is a current backlash due to careerists of various stripes trying to sensationalize it, otherwise progress in the end-of-life direction could happen much sooner.

I am not of the opinion that introducing support for a kind of end-of-life counsellor to a place like this would undermine what it provides as a "safe space", if that is what you are getting at. Even aside from the fact that there are numerous pro-life sites and this is the only one that is pro-choice (aside from Lost All Hope which is minimal compared to this one and does not have a forum), the existing choices already contradict each other, so the opposite of what any given member at any given time might think or feel with respect to their death already coexists within this site. Pro-lifers aren't always well received here but there is an entire Recovery section, which is going beyond neutrality in the pro-life direction.

It's true that there is a zone of mystery that would be difficult to deny but if someone wants to get counselling to help them with anxieties there are arguments that make the basis of those anxieties less probable and it could be beneficial for some people to hear about them from people qualified to provide that kind of information.

I believe there are people who have some of these anxieties who would come forward and seek out this kind of counselling, so I think they should get it. They could obviously terminate said counselling at any time.

 

[Forever Sleep]

Thanks for your feedback, it is very valuable.

Yes, I am voicing my support for moving things toward more acceptance of suicide as well as finding ways to make it easier for those who don't want pro-life assistance. I am not suggesting it be created right now or ever necessarily integrated into this website. Pro-choice means one can choose to seek assistance for how and when they choose to end their life but it's a shame there is a current backlash due to careerists of various stripes trying to sensationalize it, otherwise progress in the end-of-life direction could happen much sooner.

I am not of the opinion that introducing support for a kind of end-of-life counsellor to a place like this would undermine what it provides as a "safe space", if that is what you are getting at. Even aside from the fact that there are numerous pro-life sites and this is the only one that is pro-choice (aside from Lost All Hope which is minimal compared to this one and does not have a forum), the existing choices already contradict each other, so the opposite of what any given member at any given time might think or feel with respect to their death already coexists within this site. Pro-lifers aren't always well received here but there is an entire Recovery section, which is going beyond neutrality in the pro-life direction.

It's true that there is a zone of mystery that would be difficult to deny but if someone wants to get counselling to help them with anxieties there are arguments that make the basis of those anxieties less probable and it could be beneficial for some people to hear about them from people qualified to provide that kind of information.

I believe there are people who have some of these anxieties who would come forward and seek out this kind of counselling, so I think they should get it. They could obviously terminate said counselling at any time.

Yes, that makes a lot of sense. I hope that assisted suicide will be legalised soon and I definitely think both the person and their family need support offered during that time. And yes- true- someone looking for such a service would be actively looking to try and feel more at ease with concerns they have- so- they might well be open to alternative points of view.

I guess I'd only see this servive being appropriate for assisted suicide. It would in effect be encoraging the safety of all elements of suicide- including the method. When, homemade methods aren't 100% effective. Not that you are saying this. I get the impression you are thinking more about the psychology and emotions behind the choice itself.

Still- for lots of people just here- it's the reliability and pain of their chosen method they are worrying about the most. None of us can realistically provide much comfort on either when it comes to doing it ourselves. It would be irresponsible to say- there's no need to worry- jumping off that bridge, shooting yourself in the head, hanging yourself- nothing can possibly go wrong and, you won't feel a thing! Obviously- you wouldn't be saying that!

I imagine, you would be thinking of an assisted suicide scenario. I imagine in fact that- even when assisted suicide is legalised- and I feel sure it will be eventually, I expect it will still be illegal to 'assist' someone who isn't considered eligible. Wouldn't you? Our governments aren't going to want healthy tax payers being coached towards a suicide!

 

[steppingoff]

I am in favour of creating a field in which someone specializes in helping people overcome anxieties about suicide. I know it will seem way too controversial at the moment but I hope it happens in the future. So many people would benefit. This site has a lot of posts that demonstrate the need for this kind of assistance. I know there is a relatively new (?) role similar to what I am suggesting called "Death Doula" so that is a good step in the right direction. I find the Doula thing a bit new agey and as a result it doesn't really inspire a lot of confidence for me. I hope there will soon also be professionals of some sort who focus more on scientific and ethical reasons that refute and/or provide rational management of the anxiety some of us have about taking personal initiative to speed up and facilitate the ending of our lives.

I'd be in favour of that as well.

We need help in how we choose to die and whether or not we want to die. There is a lot of uncertainty about the methods we choose.

I'd be in favour of something like a safe suicide site, like a safe injection site. There would be Death counsellors on staff.

If you walk in those doors, you know you have made a committment to CTB. It would be easier to choose a method with certainity it will do the job. But also, you would clearly understand that the choice is real and final.

I think there is a lot of anxiety about whether or not you'd survive and be brain-damaged in some way. Death Counsellors would play a role in reducing anxiety.