[Article] "People who CTB cannot regret it (as they are no longer around to regret)"

[TAW122]

This is indeed a true statement that I've heard before used by some of us and I agree with it. There cannot be regrets after a person has CTB'd or is no longer sentient to experience 'regret'. That is a true objective fact. This article will focus on that as well as the other benefits of those who are no longer around in this world. While people may view death as tragic (for the survivors), another perspective is that it is not always tragic for the person passing, especially when said person has been suffering for an inordinate amount of time, exhausted all viable solutions to alleviate their suffering, and would likely continue to suffer for decades to come…

The cessation of sentience (life) is the end of all suffering and pleasures, and while the loss of potential pleasure can be considered a loss to many, the price of suffering that an individual undergoes could (almost) never be justifiable for only temporary, fleeting moments of pleasure and joy. While there is no guarantee of the (temporary) pleasure that one seeks, there is guarantee of future suffering and each day alive is another day gambling with sentience itself for the potential for worse outcomes.

If anyone has experiences with people who are on their death beds they oftenly talk about what they regret and being in that state while waiting for (natural, or otherwise) death out of their hands is one of the most cruel and agonizing experiences one can experience, especially psychological (and physical too since most people on there are also physically ill as well) torture. They are unable to attain their dreams due to circumstances no longer allowing them to, and their body as well as their mind deteriorated to such a state that prevents them from having the capacity to do so, while they wait for their time to leave existence.

The benefits of CTB'ing and death on one's own terms are, but not limited to:

• Being able to exercise the ultimate act of free will.
• Overriding one's strongest instinct (the survival instinct, or self-preservation)
• Not having to worry about future suffering and/or late life events such as retirement, physical and psychological decline, plus other health problems.
• Not having to live with regrets and end up dying on the death bed waiting for real 'death' to come.
  

As a conclusion, I see more benefits, especially one exercising one's own free will in choosing whether to stay in life or exit it as well as avoiding all the inevitable and unbearable potential suffering down the road. If the world gets shittier (very likely) and more prohibitive (pro-life dystopia) when it comes to death, then when one successfully CTB's on one's own terms, one can avoid that fate and experience. Of course, if there are potential pleasurable moments (very unlikely), they are at best fleeting and can vanish just as quickly as they come, with much more suffering that follows along with regrets. One should not have to be forced to 'gamble' in the game of life that they never chose to play to begin with, especially when this involuntary game of life is rigged from the start.

 

[WorthlessCoward]

Only regret is not doing it sooner

 

[FuneralCry]

Suicide does literally solve every problem which is why I see suicide as being self care. To die removes all suffering and prevents all future harms, the non existent have no wants or needs to fufill, they cannot regret or mourn anything and the thought of exiting this world on my own terms has always appealed to me as it's taking control over my inevitable fate and it would prevent more unnecessary time spent trapped here just to be tortured from old age and die anyway.

Existing is only a futile burden that there was never a need for so of course to me choosing to leaving this world could only be a benefit because as well as existence being completely useless it's also something so harmful with the risk of even worse torment being there at any moment. So therefore I view it as always being preferable to not exist, I just think the problem lies in how difficult and inaccessible suicide is.

 

[Leagueofgentlemen]

The other paradox of suicide is that you can never be happy that you succeeded, unlike everything else in life.

 

[Judah]

This gives me peace of mind, I have certainly had fleeting moments of pleasure and happiness, suffering and despair become a greater weight that makes me come to the conclusion that life is no longer worth it for me.

 

[Georg]

The other paradox of suicide is that you can never be happy that you succeeded, unlike everything else in life.

I don't want be to happy (anymore), I just don't want to suffer anymore. And suicide will solve this issue

 

[TAW122]

Am bumping this topic since I had a few things to add and say. With regards to regret, yes no one can regret the loss of sentience as they would lack the ability/capacity to do so. Also, as someone who is an atheist, I don't believe in the afterlife or anything, it would be just like pre-sentience (billions of years before one's conception, existence) and the same afterwards. It is just that sentience, or life itself that is the harm. The cessation of life itself would be the cessation of that non-consensual harm to oneself. However, on the flipside if one were to endure sentience it is likely they would suffer and there is no way to turn back time or unexperience, unsufffer sentience itself, therefore it would be wrong to involuntarily impose sentience (or even interfere against and keep one trapped indefinitely) onto a being against it's will.

The other paradox of suicide is that you can never be happy that you succeeded, unlike everything else in life.

True, but the cessation of sentience and/or consciousness also means that one cannot experience any future harm after the act.

This gives me peace of mind, I have certainly had fleeting moments of pleasure and happiness, suffering and despair become a greater weight that makes me come to the conclusion that life is no longer worth it for me.

Yes, I share very similar sentiments and as someone who has been sentient for more than three decades and counting, I can definitely attest to this. Even in good times, every day being sentient is just a gamble for potentially equally bad (or worse) suffering.

 

[Deleted member 65988]

Part of my reason for ctb is to no longer be subject to any potential future suffering plus once you're dead, there's no sentence left to feel any guilt over their actions.

 

[walkingdead2023]

This is indeed a true statement that I've heard before used by some of us and I agree with it. There cannot be regrets after a person has CTB'd or is no longer sentient to experience 'regret'. That is a true objective fact. This article will focus on that as well as the other benefits of those who are no longer around in this world. While people may view death as tragic (for the survivors), another perspective is that it is not always tragic for the person passing, especially when said person has been suffering for an inordinate amount of time, exhausted all viable solutions to alleviate their suffering, and would likely continue to suffer for decades to come…

The cessation of sentience (life) is the end of all suffering and pleasures, and while the loss of potential pleasure can be considered a loss to many, the price of suffering that an individual undergoes could (almost) never be justifiable for only temporary, fleeting moments of pleasure and joy. While there is no guarantee of the (temporary) pleasure that one seeks, there is guarantee of future suffering and each day alive is another day gambling with sentience itself for the potential for worse outcomes.

If anyone has experiences with people who are on their death beds they oftenly talk about what they regret and being in that state while waiting for (natural, or otherwise) death out of their hands is one of the most cruel and agonizing experiences one can experience, especially psychological (and physical too since most people on there are also physically ill as well) torture. They are unable to attain their dreams due to circumstances no longer allowing them to, and their body as well as their mind deteriorated to such a state that prevents them from having the capacity to do so, while they wait for their time to leave existence.

The benefits of CTB'ing and death on one's own terms are, but not limited to:

• Being able to exercise the ultimate act of free will.
• Overriding one's strongest instinct (the survival instinct, or self-preservation)
• Not having to worry about future suffering and/or late life events such as retirement, physical and psychological decline, plus other health problems.
• Not having to live with regrets and end up dying on the death bed waiting for real 'death' to come.

As a conclusion, I see more benefits, especially one exercising one's own free will in choosing whether to stay in life or exit it as well as avoiding all the inevitable and unbearable potential suffering down the road. If the world gets shittier (very likely) and more prohibitive (pro-life dystopia) when it comes to death, then when one successfully CTB's on one's own terms, one can avoid that fate and experience. Of course, if there are potential pleasurable moments (very unlikely), they are at best fleeting and can vanish just as quickly as they come, with much more suffering that follows along with regrets. One should not have to be forced to 'gamble' in the game of life that they never chose to play to begin with, especially when this involuntary game of life is rigged from the start.

Suicide does literally solve every problem which is why I see suicide as being self care. To die removes all suffering and prevents all future harms, the non existent have no wants or needs to fufill, they cannot regret or mourn anything and the thought of exiting this world on my own terms has always appealed to me as it's taking control over my inevitable fate and it would prevent more unnecessary time spent trapped here just to be tortured from old age and die anyway.

Existing is only a futile burden that there was never a need for so of course to me choosing to leaving this world could only be a benefit because as well as existence being completely useless it's also something so harmful with the risk of even worse torment being there at any moment. So therefore I view it as always being preferable to not exist, I just think the problem lies in how difficult and inaccessible suicide is.

Why you still here then? I'm just saying!

 

[ijustwishtodie]

Yes, this is all true. This is why that, whilst I think that the argument made by pro lifers that people should live on because they could regret not being there for a better future is the strongest argument that they have, it still doesn't consider that people who successfully ctb can no longer regret it. This seems like a dark conclusion to acknowledge as I think it could justify every type of person killing themselves but, nonetheless, it is the truth.

For those who killed themselves, there is no future to consider from their point of death so talking about what could have been for their future self is pointless as their future self will no longer come to pass. Time has stopped for them then and there and the only ones who can ruminate about what could have happened to them in the future are the ones who are still living with the time moving forward for them. It's impossible for those who killed themselves to suffer from being deprived of any good things there were to occur to them in the future as they no longer exist

 

[Deleted member 65988]

Yes, this is all true. This is why that, whilst I think that the argument made by pro lifers that people should live on because they could regret not being there for a better future is the strongest argument that they have, it still doesn't consider that people who successfully ctb can no longer regret it. This seems like a dark conclusion to acknowledge as I think it could justify every type of person killing themselves but, nonetheless, it is the truth.

For those who killed themselves, there is no future to consider from their point of death so talking about what could have been for their future self is pointless as their future self will no longer come to pass. Time has stopped for them then and there and the only ones who can ruminate about what could have happened to them in the future are the ones who are still living with the time moving forward for them. It's impossible for those who killed themselves to suffer from being deprived of any good things there were to occur to them in the future as they no longer exist

It lives on the false premise that there will be a version of us alive after we've died from ctb, that will lament our action because we missed on X possibilities for a future timeline we destroyed because we did what we did but it seems to only make sense from a sentient perspective that we'll live to regret what we lost.

 

[TAW122]

Part of my reason for ctb is to no longer be subject to any potential future suffering plus once you're dead, there's no sentence left to feel any guilt over their actions.

Good point, the lack of sentience or consciousness means there is no capacity for regret. The 'regret' that people are talking about are oftenly referred to those who have survived (or failed) their attempt and the ones who failed their CTB are regretting the consequences from the attempt rather than just the attempt itself. Many pro-lifers oftenly like to cite the fact that people who failed regret their attempts (some do), but the real truth is that people would oftenly deny further ideation and/or suicidality in order to escape the pro-lifers' monitoring and scrutiny, so of course, the person who failed to CTB would say something to get the pro-lifers' off their backs. What people actually regret is the consequences from the attempt, ranging from becoming permanently disfigured, disabled, debilitated, and/or other consequences such as being locked up in a psych ward or further social stigma and ostracization from their peers.

Yes, this is all true. This is why that, whilst I think that the argument made by pro lifers that people should live on because they could regret not being there for a better future is the strongest argument that they have, it still doesn't consider that people who successfully ctb can no longer regret it. This seems like a dark conclusion to acknowledge as I think it could justify every type of person killing themselves but, nonetheless, it is the truth.

For those who killed themselves, there is no future to consider from their point of death so talking about what could have been for their future self is pointless as their future self will no longer come to pass. Time has stopped for them then and there and the only ones who can ruminate about what could have happened to them in the future are the ones who are still living with the time moving forward for them. It's impossible for those who killed themselves to suffer from being deprived of any good things there were to occur to them in the future as they no longer exist

Excellent post and insight. Yes, for those who managed to successfully CTB, the sentient world and consciousness is no longer relevant to them as they cannot experience anything afterwards. The survivors and those who are still around would experience the aftermath of one's CTB, but that's another point altogether (would be addressed in a different thread). I always likened the fact that death is the cessation of life and the state in which ones was prior to conception and sentience as well as what happens after sentience (pre-conception and after sentience). Also, death itself is not necessarily a negative state as much as pro-lifers like to refer to as, but rather just a state of nothingness. Of course though, pro-lifers view death as a negative event because it would be deprivation of life and (no surprise!) pro-lifers view life as a positive value when the universe could care less though.

It lives on the false premise that there will be a version of us alive after we've died from ctb, that will lament our action because we missed on X possibilities for a future timeline we destroyed because we did what we did but it seems to only make sense from a sentient perspective that we'll live to regret what we lost.

Good points and yes, once one is dead, there can be no good nor bad for the person, it would just be as the same as prior to conception or birth. Sure, the survivors and bereaved would mourn, but for the individual, said individual can no longer be harmed and everything else is just irrelevant. Since I'm an atheist and don't believe in an afterlife, this means that death to me would just be like prior to existence, non-sentience.

 

[Deleted member 65988]

Good points and yes, once one is dead, there can be no good nor bad for the person, it would just be as the same as prior to conception or birth. Sure, the survivors and bereaved would mourn, but for the individual, said individual can no longer be harmed and everything else is just irrelevant. Since I'm an atheist and don't believe in an afterlife, this means that death to me would just be like prior to existence, non-sentience.

Very much agreed on all points.

Many pro-lifers oftenly like to cite the fact that people who failed regret their attempts (some do), but the real truth is that people would oftenly deny further ideation and/or suicidality in order to escape the pro-lifers' monitoring and scrutiny, so of course, the person who failed to CTB would say something to get the pro-lifers' off their backs

That's true though, anyone who actually doesn't regret their ctb attempt and intend to try again are shut down to keep this prevailing notion.