Discussion anyone abused by narcissists, sociopaths or psychopaths?

[KAZ-2Y5]

cluster b people

 

[bluebus]

Yeah. My mom. She is a walking textbook for mental illnesses. No matter what she's done I still love her, and I feel bad knowing how much pain she's in/ has been in her entire life. Still wish she didn't have to fuck up my life too, but c'est la vie.

 

[AvoidingMyself]

Yeah, both of my parents

 

[Sweet Tart]

Not all people with cluster b diagnoses are abusers. My mom, however, is an abusive, sociopathic narcissist. I'm not sure about my stepfather and late father. At the very least, they are/were enablers.

 

[Per Ardua Ad Astra]

Yes

 

[HoleintheDark]

My father had antisocial personality disorder, but weirdly enough he never hurt me or my brother to the best of my knowledge, while he did hurt my mother and sister. I think it was only because we were his blood. I was completely oblivious to everything he had done until I was an adult. I felt guilty, like there was something I could have done to help them. My mom used to say I inherited his psychopathy.

 

[SpaceBoyEvangef]

An old partner of mine, they were a raging narcissist, they cared more about themselves and pleasuring themselves than my own well being and my own personal comfort. Always made sexual advances on me and were a huge piece of shit, I bet their current partner is suffering just the same, and I feel sorry for them.

 

[Spiritual survivor]

Yes, I was a child of a narcissist single mother and I suffered greatly. I didn't really have a foundation that prepared me to navigate life. So it's hardly surprising my life has been a failure.

 

[leloyon]

Just a reminder to everyone in advance that narcissistic abuse isn't real, abuse is abuse.
Also antisocial personality disorder and narcissistic personality disorder aren't just labels you give to assholes. Please refrain from demonising people who are suffering from serious, lifelong mental disorders.
That being said, if you have been abused by someone who is diagnosed with a cluster B disorder this isn't meant to be an attack on you. Just refrain from diagnosing people who haven't been looked at professionally with serious mental illnesses just because they're assholes, and don't automatically demonise serious mental illnesses that negatively affect their sufferers, many of whom aren't abusers, kay?
(saying this as a non-cluster B)

 

[Forever Sleep]

Just a reminder to everyone in advance that narcissistic abuse isn't real, abuse is abuse.
Also antisocial personality disorder and narcissistic personality disorder aren't just labels you give to assholes. Please refrain from demonising people who are suffering from serious, lifelong mental disorders.
That being said, if you have been abused by someone who is diagnosed with a cluster B disorder this isn't meant to be an attack on you. Just refrain from diagnosing people who haven't been looked at professionally with serious mental illnesses just because they're assholes, and don't automatically demonise serious mental illnesses that negatively affect their sufferers, many of whom aren't abusers, kay?
(saying this as a non-cluster B)

I do get where you are coming from. Plus, I can understand why someone suffering from Narcissistic Personality Disorder must feel a bit victimised themselves- if everyone is always saying how much they hate narcissists!

BUT- from personal experience- I feel sure I grew up with a narcissist. Of course- I don't have an official diagnosis- I never will have. Still- it was mainly their behaviour that caused me to have suicidal ideation in the first place. My life felt like hell at that point.

It was literally maybe a decade later I happened to be watching a YouTube channel that discussed narcissism and ALL of their bizarrre behaviours were described there. I can't tell you what a relief it was to finally have some sort of validation in a way I suppose. The knowledge that some people have these (peculiar) patterns of behaviour. I'd argue that narcissistic abuse IS real. It has common factors- love bombing, triangulation, projection, playing the victim, smear campaign, revenge seeking, guilt tripping. I think it's important to pick up on those things so you can identify one early.

I agree- we probably do tend to throw the phrase around too readily. I'm also sure that some people suffering from it are self aware enough to not abuse people. BUT- I'd say- a lot of people calling someone out for being a narcissist likely HAS been abused by them. Maybe they have got the diagnosis wrong. Maybe I have. But- I wish I'd suspected at the time! I think it's important to realise you might be in the midst of a narcissist- so you can take actions to protect yourself- run away preferably.

Sorry but it's actually quite hard for people who have had experience with suspected narcissists to see them as anything other than very dangerous, destructive people. Which I suppose is why we ought to be sure before we start throwing the term around. I think refraining from defamation is wise in fact but- I think it's actually sensible to try and annalyse what you might be dealing with privately. For self preservation! Plenty of people's lives are ruined by these sorts of people. Plus- this forum is annonymous. People aren't exactly naming and shaming on social media here. I actually think it's pretty unwise to 'un-mask' a narcissist anyway.

 

[fwompie]

I do get where you are coming from. Plus, I can understand why someone suffering from Narcissistic Personality Disorder must feel a bit victimised themselves- if everyone is always saying how much they hate narcissists!

BUT- from personal experience- I feel sure I grew up with a narcissist. Of course- I don't have an official diagnosis- I never will have. Still- it was mainly their behaviour that caused me to have suicidal ideation in the first place. My life felt like hell at that point.

It was literally maybe a decade later I happened to be watching a YouTube channel that discussed narcissism and ALL of their bizarrre behaviours were described there. I can't tell you what a relief it was to finally have some sort of validation in a way I suppose. The knowledge that some people have these (peculiar) patterns of behaviour. I'd argue that narcissistic abuse IS real. It has common factors- love bombing, triangulation, projection, playing the victim, smear campaign, revenge seeking, guilt tripping. I think it's important to pick up on those things so you can identify one early.

I agree- we probably do tend to throw the phrase around too readily. I'm also sure that some people suffering from it are self aware enough to not abuse people. BUT- I'd say- a lot of people calling someone out for being a narcissist likely HAS been abused by them. Maybe they have got the diagnosis wrong. Maybe I have. But- I wish I'd suspected at the time! I think it's important to realise you might be in the midst of a narcissist- so you can take actions to protect yourself- run away preferably.

Sorry but it's actually quite hard for people who have had experience with suspected narcissists to see them as anything other than very dangerous, destructive people. Which I suppose is why we ought to be sure before we start throwing the term around. I think refraining from defamation is wise in fact but- I think it's actually sensible to try and annalyse what you might be dealing with privately. For self preservation! Plenty of people's lives are ruined by these sorts of people. Plus- this forum is annonymous. People aren't exactly naming and shaming on social media here. I actually think it's pretty unwise to 'un-mask' a narcissist anyway.

I understand your point and feelings but I'd also like to disagree. I've also been abused by my mother who has narcissistic traits. But implying and believing that all diagnosed narcissistic will abuse you is not fair to those who are diagnosed who would not abuse someone. I think that was the point they were trying to make. It will hurt other people by doing that.

It can be anonymous but you're still implying that cluster-B people do bad things by standard. And if people are not diagnosed it's better to phrase it like "narcissistic tendencies" or "suspected narcissist". Just to be correct and fair.

All n all, it's abuse by someone who might be narcissistic (if not diagnosed). But not all narcissists abuse. I hope that gets the point across! <3

Edit: also just realized I tried making the same point worded in different ways lol, sorry about that.

 

[Forever Sleep]

I understand your point and feelings but I'd also like to disagree. I've also been abused by my mother who has narcissistic traits. But implying and believing that all diagnosed narcissistic will abuse you is not fair to those who are diagnosed who would not abuse someone. I think that was the point they were trying to make. It will hurt other people by doing that.

It can be anonymous but you're still implying that cluster-B people do bad things by standard. And if people are not diagnosed it's better to phrase it like "narcissistic tendencies" or "suspected narcissist". Just to be correct and fair.

All n all, it's abuse by someone who might be narcissistic (if not diagnosed). But not all narcissists abuse. I hope that gets the point across! <3

Edit: also just realized I tried making the same point worded in different ways lol, sorry about that.

Yeah- that's a fair point to make. There are people here who have said they suffer from NPD. It's got to be awful for them. I can't imagine living like that. That can't be fun either. Plus, some have developed it out of contact with narcissists themselves. In a way- it seems a bit of a contradiction in terms though- a self aware narcissist. Can someone actually still be a narcissist if they realise they are?

It's not like any of us are perfect. We are all carrying around our own f*cked up bag of trauma that likely does make us difficult sometimes. I know I'm too messed up to have relationships with people. I'm sure I'd end up too needy and clingy. I probably have some narcissistic traits myself.

And yes- very fair to say that not all narcissists abuse. I guess it's just my own paranoia. I'd probably be nervous if someone told me they had NPD and I'd see enormous red flags if I started to detect some of the more abusive behaviours. But- it doesn't really relate much to me anyway now because I'm pretty much a recluse! But- you made fair points. I don't want to offend anyone here. I have to concede that I tend to approach this subject with a great deal of prejudice, paranoia and if I'm honest- hatred still.

 

[StolenLife]

Not anymore since nowadays I live like a shut-in, but when I was a child I used to get abused by certain other children who, I swear, had some early onset psychopathic traits. I don't want to go into details because I don't want to doxx myself but some of them would steal, lie, torture animals and be agressive for no reason. They are the reason why I'm on this site.

 

[Lost Magic]

Yes, I have even sat with future murderers who I suspected were dodgy but never thought they were capable of such heinous crimes. I have met all kinds of shady people. I even worked with a neo nazi (he blamed a Pakistani doctor for the death of his father). The place I grew up in was full of totally crazy, toxic, and abusive bastards. It's not good for the body, mind, and soul. I'm so glad I just keep to myself now. Humans can change on you on a dime. I prefer dogs and cats to this disgusting race called humans. There are a few good ones (like most of you on here) but so many bad ones tip the scales.

 

[KAZ-2Y5]

Just a reminder to everyone in advance that narcissistic abuse isn't real, abuse is abuse.
Also antisocial personality disorder and narcissistic personality disorder aren't just labels you give to assholes. Please refrain from demonising people who are suffering from serious, lifelong mental disorders.
That being said, if you have been abused by someone who is diagnosed with a cluster B disorder this isn't meant to be an attack on you. Just refrain from diagnosing people who haven't been looked at professionally with serious mental illnesses just because they're assholes, and don't automatically demonise serious mental illnesses that negatively affect their sufferers, many of whom aren't abusers, kay?
(saying this as a non-cluster

Just a reminder to everyone in advance that narcissistic abuse isn't real, abuse is abuse.
Also antisocial personality disorder and narcissistic personality disorder aren't just labels you give to assholes. Please refrain from demonising people who are suffering from serious, lifelong mental disorders.
That being said, if you have been abused by someone who is diagnosed with a cluster B disorder this isn't meant to be an attack on you. Just refrain from diagnosing people who haven't been looked at professionally with serious mental illnesses just because they're assholes, and don't automatically demonise serious mental illnesses that negatively affect their sufferers, many of whom aren't abusers, kay?
(saying this as a non-cluster B)

4 of my abusers were professionally diagnosed with cluster b disorders, and one of my abusers abusers was diagnosed professionally. not all cluster b but enough of us have been abused by their revenge seeking that we deserve our voices heard too.

Not anymore since nowadays I live like a shut-in, but when I was a child I used to get abused by certain other children who, I swear, had some early onset psychopathic traits. I don't want to go into details because I don't want to doxx myself but some of them would steal, lie, torture animals and be agressive for no reason. They are the reason why I'm on this site.

SAME! I knew children who were diagnosed conduct disorder and they abused me. same same.

Yeah- that's a fair point to make. There are people here who have said they suffer from NPD. It's got to be awful for them. I can't imagine living like that. That can't be fun either. Plus, some have developed it out of contact with narcissists themselves. In a way- it seems a bit of a contradiction in terms though- a self aware narcissist. Can someone actually still be a narcissist if they realise they are?

It's not like any of us are perfect. We are all carrying around our own f*cked up bag of trauma that likely does make us difficult sometimes. I know I'm too messed up to have relationships with people. I'm sure I'd end up too needy and clingy. I probably have some narcissistic traits myself.

And yes- very fair to say that not all narcissists abuse. I guess it's just my own paranoia. I'd probably be nervous if someone told me they had NPD and I'd see enormous red flags if I started to detect some of the more abusive behaviours. But- it doesn't really relate much to me anyway now because I'm pretty much a recluse! But- you made fair points. I don't want to offend anyone here. I have to concede that I tend to approach this subject with a great deal of prejudice, paranoia and if I'm honest- hatred still.

I understand and agree with some of what you said, but people have a right to be cautious with who they want. just look at the symptoms of antisocial and narcissism vs other disorders, definitely shouldn't be treated the same because they are not the same. add has attention and focus issues, aspd and npd have issues exploiting, manipulating other, believing they're better then you, and feeling no remorse for hurting you, taking revenge on people they deem worthy of being abused is a hallmark of aspd and psychopathy but they're often out of touch with right and wrong.

I do get where you are coming from. Plus, I can understand why someone suffering from Narcissistic Personality Disorder must feel a bit victimised themselves- if everyone is always saying how much they hate narcissists!

BUT- from personal experience- I feel sure I grew up with a narcissist. Of course- I don't have an official diagnosis- I never will have. Still- it was mainly their behaviour that caused me to have suicidal ideation in the first place. My life felt like hell at that point.

It was literally maybe a decade later I happened to be watching a YouTube channel that discussed narcissism and ALL of their bizarrre behaviours were described there. I can't tell you what a relief it was to finally have some sort of validation in a way I suppose. The knowledge that some people have these (peculiar) patterns of behaviour. I'd argue that narcissistic abuse IS real. It has common factors- love bombing, triangulation, projection, playing the victim, smear campaign, revenge seeking, guilt tripping. I think it's important to pick up on those things so you can identify one early.

I agree- we probably do tend to throw the phrase around too readily. I'm also sure that some people suffering from it are self aware enough to not abuse people. BUT- I'd say- a lot of people calling someone out for being a narcissist likely HAS been abused by them. Maybe they have got the diagnosis wrong. Maybe I have. But- I wish I'd suspected at the time! I think it's important to realise you might be in the midst of a narcissist- so you can take actions to protect yourself- run away preferably.

Sorry but it's actually quite hard for people who have had experience with suspected narcissists to see them as anything other than very dangerous, destructive people. Which I suppose is why we ought to be sure before we start throwing the term around. I think refraining from defamation is wise in fact but- I think it's actually sensible to try and annalyse what you might be dealing with privately. For self preservation! Plenty of people's lives are ruined by these sorts of people. Plus- this forum is annonymous. People aren't exactly naming and shaming on social media here. I actually think it's pretty unwise to 'un-mask' a narcissist anyway.

The difference with the disorders of ASPD, psychopathy and NPD versus the 150-something other disorders in the DSM is that they function completely differently because they are PERSONALITY disorders and not regular disorders.

Personality disorders cause dysfunction with opinions, feelings, observations, empathy, perceptions and relationships. The way they see every event, instance, and conversation is coming from a distorted perception. They can be aware of this distorted perception but one of the main symptoms of these disorders is a lack of self-awareness which is very common with personality disorders. Self-awareness is also a spectrum, not black and white as many people get wrong. They're not just "different" with their opinions and perceptions (everybody has different feelings and opinions) but they're maladaptive and unhealthy.

ASPD and NPD major/common symptoms from research (not just taking from the DSM I've been researching them for a decade now): revenge-prone (often from distorted perceptions but can certainly be from a non-distorted perception), entitlement issues, lack of empathy toward others, manipulation, deception, exploitation/supply-seeking, victim-complex and can't see fault in ones own behaviors chronically so- meaning they see themselves as perfect and don't take accountability for any little mistakes or wrongs, love-bombing then devaluing cycles which causes Stockholm syndrome, projection, possessiveness in relationships, extreme jealousy and envy issues in relationships or with peers, poor and abusive relationships.

While something like ADHD has issues with attention, focus staying on one task that isn't scary or bad, just distressing for the disordered individual. Anxiety disorders have symptoms like overthinking, feeling jittery or on edge, feeling distressed about the future, etc. Other disorders have issues with normal things that only distress the individual suffering from said disorder, they're not dangerous.

However, people with ASPD and NPD have symptoms that make them dangerous to themselves AND others, causing distress to both themselves AND others.

Yes, people with ASPD and NPD are certainly distressed as well from the consequences of their actions and lack of ability to love another person, thus making relationships unfulfilling. But they bring distress to people around them as well.

ASPD, psychopathy and narcissists are vindictive as a PERSONALITY trait and if you do your research properly - revenge as a maladaptive personality trait is a hallmark of ASPD and psychopathy, not just a one time thing like a 17 year old girl getting revenge with her best friend on her cheating partner (teenagers are impulsive and dumb they'd be more prone to this behavior than adults). But with personality disorders it is a pattern of behavior. And their revenge-seeking is an epidemic in the world of psychological abuse survivors because that's often what psychological abuse survivors complain of is the cluster-b persons vindictive behavior towards them for unrighteous reasons. And part of that maladaptive trait is along with the lack of emotional (sometimes cognitive) empathy they don't have that line in the sand they won't cross, meaning they don't have limits on how far they're willing to hurt people making them inherently wrong for their behaviors.

Neuroscientists psychopathy and ASPD:

• Dr Keel
• Dr. Raine
• Dr. Robert Hare
• Dr Kevin Dutton

Books:

• Handbook of psychopathy
• Hervey Cleckley's original 1940's checklist that Hare basically admitted the PCL-R is based off of.

Npd:

• Dr kernberg
• Dr. W. Keith Campbell
• Dr. Kraig malkin
• Dr. James Masterson
• Dr Steve reed
• Dr Elinor Greenberg
• Dr. Marie-France Hirigoyen, a psychoanalyst

 

[KAZ-2Y5]

Just a reminder to everyone in advance that narcissistic abuse isn't real, abuse is abuse.
Also antisocial personality disorder and narcissistic personality disorder aren't just labels you give to assholes. Please refrain from demonising people who are suffering from serious, lifelong mental disorders.
That being said, if you have been abused by someone who is diagnosed with a cluster B disorder this isn't meant to be an attack on you. Just refrain from diagnosing people who haven't been looked at professionally with serious mental illnesses just because they're assholes, and don't automatically demonise serious mental illnesses that negatively affect their sufferers, many of whom aren't abusers, kay?
(saying this as a non-cluster B)

The difference with the disorders of ASPD, psychopathy and NPD versus the 150-something other disorders in the DSM is that they function completely differently because they are PERSONALITY disorders and not regular disorders.

Personality disorders cause dysfunction with opinions, feelings, observations, empathy, perceptions and relationships. The way they see every event, instance, and conversation is coming from a distorted perception. They can be aware of this distorted perception but one of the main symptoms of these disorders is a lack of self-awareness which is very common with personality disorders. Self-awareness is also a spectrum, not black and white as many people get wrong. They're not just "different" with their opinions and perceptions (everybody has different feelings and opinions) but they're maladaptive and unhealthy.

ASPD and NPD major/common symptoms from research (not just taking from the DSM I've been researching them for a decade now): revenge-prone (often from distorted perceptions but can certainly be from a non-distorted perception), entitlement issues, lack of empathy toward others, manipulation, deception, exploitation/supply-seeking, victim-complex and can't see fault in ones own behaviors chronically so- meaning they see themselves as perfect and don't take accountability for any little mistakes or wrongs, love-bombing then devaluing cycles which causes Stockholm syndrome, projection, possessiveness in relationships, extreme jealousy and envy issues in relationships or with peers, poor and abusive relationships.

While something like ADHD has issues with attention, focus staying on one task that isn't scary or bad, just distressing for the disordered individual. Anxiety disorders have symptoms like overthinking, feeling jittery or on edge, feeling distressed about the future, etc. Other disorders have issues with normal things that only distress the individual suffering from said disorder, they're not dangerous.

However, people with ASPD and NPD have symptoms that make them dangerous to themselves AND others, causing distress to both themselves AND others.

Yes, people with ASPD and NPD are certainly distressed as well from the consequences of their actions and lack of ability to love another person, thus making relationships unfulfilling. But they bring distress to people around them as well.

ASPD, psychopathy and narcissists are vindictive as a PERSONALITY trait and if you do your research properly - revenge as a maladaptive personality trait is a hallmark of ASPD and psychopathy, not just a one time thing like a 17 year old girl getting revenge with her best friend on her cheating partner (teenagers are impulsive and dumb they'd be more prone to this behavior than adults). But with personality disorders it is a pattern of behavior. And their revenge-seeking is an epidemic in the world of psychological abuse survivors because that's often what psychological abuse survivors complain of is the cluster-b persons vindictive behavior towards them for unrighteous reasons. And part of that maladaptive trait is along with the lack of emotional (sometimes cognitive) empathy they don't have that line in the sand they won't cross, meaning they don't have limits on how far they're willing to hurt people making them inherently wrong for their behaviors.

Neuroscientists psychopathy and ASPD:

• Dr Keel
• Dr. Raine
• Dr. Robert Hare
• Dr Kevin Dutton

Books:

• Handbook of psychopathy
• Hervey Cleckley's original 1940's checklist that Hare basically admitted the PCL-R is based off of.

Npd:

• Dr kernberg
• Dr. W. Keith Campbell
• Dr. Kraig malkin
• Dr. James Masterson
• Dr Steve reed
• Dr Elinor Greenberg
• Dr. Marie-France Hirigoyen, a psychoanalyst

EDIT: ALSO, im saying this AS A CLUSTER B. thank you.

EDIT: also there are other non-cluster b disorders that are dangerous like for example: pedophilac disorder and sexual sadism disorder.

 

[KAZ-2Y5]

Just a reminder to everyone in advance that narcissistic abuse isn't real, abuse is abuse.
Also antisocial personality disorder and narcissistic personality disorder aren't just labels you give to assholes. Please refrain from demonising people who are suffering from serious, lifelong mental disorders.
That being said, if you have been abused by someone who is diagnosed with a cluster B disorder this isn't meant to be an attack on you. Just refrain from diagnosing people who haven't been looked at professionally with serious mental illnesses just because they're assholes, and don't automatically demonise serious mental illnesses that negatively affect their sufferers, many of whom aren't abusers, kay?
(saying this as a non-cluster B)

you should understand some of us are driven to suicide bc of these ppl. delete your comment. im tired and im done.

 

[KAZ-2Y5]

Al

Just a reminder to everyone in advance that narcissistic abuse isn't real, abuse is abuse.
Also antisocial personality disorder and narcissistic personality disorder aren't just labels you give to assholes. Please refrain from demonising people who are suffering from serious, lifelong mental disorders.
That being said, if you have been abused by someone who is diagnosed with a cluster B disorder this isn't meant to be an attack on you. Just refrain from diagnosing people who haven't been looked at professionally with serious mental illnesses just because they're assholes, and don't automatically demonise serious mental illnesses that negatively affect their sufferers, many of whom aren't abusers, kay?
(saying this as a non-cluster B)

so nobody is giving the labels to just assholes unless they're using narcissism as an adjective which some people do but they don't mean NPD. I've met a lot of assholes in my life and none of them are NPD or ASPD, but a handful of my abusers definitely had the disorders and some ended up being diagnosed exactly with what I thought they'd get which is NPD and ASPD bc they themselves said so and made it obvious. Survivors of this type of abuse might be just a little more common than red headed ppl but we still have a right to talk about the abuse even if it isn't the most common form of abuse. Thanks.

 

[Costrecce]

Yeah, mother is probably a narcissist. The only answer that makes sense to me

 

[KAZ-2Y5]