Help Antacid- Shall I bother??!!

[MeltingHeart]

HI ALL,

SO many mixed reports about which Antacid to use, i only have Zantac which is a H2 Antagonist, NOT a proton pump inhibitor-which is recommended! - i dont have the timeor means to get that type now!! I have been advised my a trained nurse (who i trust) that Milk of Magnesia is gonna be useless!

So am basically thinking to just skip the antacic altogether! I know only I can ultimately decide & I know i have asked similar questions before-so sorry for going around in circles!

Any last minute thoughts are appreciated though-as i weight up these last decisions.

ThankU

 

[LegaliseIt!]

• Antacid

The purpose of antacid has nothing to do with quicker absorption of SN. In your stomach there is something called gastric juices, one of the components of this juice is hydrochloric acid (HCL). When SN mixes with HCL, it converts to regular salt (NaCL). There isn't enough HCL in your stomach to convert all the recommended dose, but it will reduce it. Therefore less SN gets passed to the small intestine where the process of actually transferring it into bloodstream starts. The stomach only prepares the food for digestion, it does not absorb it into the bloodstream. So the purpose of antacid is to help reduce that conversion so more SN moves into the small intestine.

You may see that there are conversations regarding complex medications to reduce the amount of stomach acid. It is not necessary. Regular stores and pharmacies will sell easy to obtain medications that cure indigestion and excess stomach acid.

After research, it was found that proton pump inhibitors (PPI) were not useful for the SN process. Nor any other drug that changes the behaviour of your stomach producing acid. You only need something that reduces the stomach acid quickly.

Excess normal salt (NaCl) in your stomach may also produce some stomach discomfort which makes it a good thing to take them.

From Stan's Thread. I hope this is helpful
Peace, comfort and compassion,

 

[jgm63]

I would think Zantac or Tagamet would be ok....
( Various searches on here seem to confirm that )

 

[MeltingHeart]

• Antacid

The purpose of antacid has nothing to do with quicker absorption of SN. In your stomach there is something called gastric juices, one of the components of this juice is hydrochloric acid (HCL). When SN mixes with HCL, it converts to regular salt (NaCL). There isn't enough HCL in your stomach to convert all the recommended dose, but it will reduce it. Therefore less SN gets passed to the small intestine where the process of actually transferring it into bloodstream starts. The stomach only prepares the food for digestion, it does not absorb it into the bloodstream. So the purpose of antacid is to help reduce that conversion so more SN moves into the small intestine.

You may see that there are conversations regarding complex medications to reduce the amount of stomach acid. It is not necessary. Regular stores and pharmacies will sell easy to obtain medications that cure indigestion and excess stomach acid.

After research, it was found that proton pump inhibitors (PPI) were not useful for the SN process. Nor any other drug that changes the behaviour of your stomach producing acid. You only need something that reduces the stomach acid quickly.

Excess normal salt (NaCl) in your stomach may also produce some stomach discomfort which makes it a good thing to take them.

From Stan's Thread. I hope this is helpful
Peace, comfort and compassion,

God its compliacted - ive gotZantac- a basic H2 Antagonist. i'll just take that, thanks!

I would think Zantac or Tagamet would be ok....
( Various searches on here seem to confirm that )

Ta.

 

[LegaliseIt!]

If you are using Domperidone to prevent vomiting, antacids are _not_recommended, as they interfere with the absorption of Domperidone. Ranitidine and Tagamet are fine with Meto.

 

[a.n.kirillov]

Yes but we could use something like Rennie or an OTC acid reducer after a domperidone regimen right? Like for example -1h domperidone stat, -45 pain killer, -30 antiacid (milk of magnesia, Rennie, whatever). I'm still conflicted since I wanna use domperidone.

Also I'm still not sure whether or not I wanna be the guinea pig for the 2 grams of propanolol which PN seems to advice. No one here seems to have done it before.

 

[MeltingHeart]

Yes but we could use something like Rennie or an OTC acid reducer after a domperidone regimen right? Like for example -1h domperidone stat, -45 pain killer, -30 antiacid (milk of magnesia, Rennie, whatever). I'm still conflicted since I wanna use domperidone.

Also I'm still not sure whether or not I wanna be the guinea pig for the 2 grams of propanolol which PN seems to advice. No one here seems to have done it before.

i would take propano if i had it,itcalming and will reduce rapid heart rate-which is gonna be a scary feeling. Ive got Meto not Domp.

 

[a.n.kirillov]

Ah well then just take tagamet. I have it as well but don't want to risk EPS since both my grandfather and father have restless legs and Parkinson's related stuff, so I'm gonna go with domp.

 

[k75]

HI ALL,

SO many mixed reports about which Antacid to use, i only have Zantac which is a H2 Antagonist, NOT a proton pump inhibitor-which is recommended! - i dont have the timeor means to get that type now!! I have been advised my a trained nurse (who i trust) that Milk of Magnesia is gonna be useless!

So am basically thinking to just skip the antacic altogether! I know only I can ultimately decide & I know i have asked similar questions before-so sorry for going around in circles!

Any last minute thoughts are appreciated though-as i weight up these last decisions.

ThankU

You'll need to work out the dose, but it's fine other than that. The most common acid reducers people used before Stan's guide were Tagamet and Zantac.

Proton pump inhibitors are actually not recommended at all.

 

[MeltingHeart]

Who writes/edit the suicide Wiki pages linked to this site?? on that it clearly states NO antacid is better for a peacfull process, but then on the exact same page is ALL the info about antacids-which makes no sense!

 

[chris8000]

You'll need to work out the dose, but it's fine other than that. The most common acid reducers people used before Stan's guide were Tagamet and Zantac.
Proton pump inhibitors are actually not recommended at all.

The only issue with Stan's guide I found was he lumps all of the antacids together with H2 receptor antagonists and proton pump inhibitors, when antacids are distinct to H2 receptor antagonists and proton pump inhibitors from what I read (although they all have the effect of raising pH in the stomach it seems).

From wikipedia:

'Antacids are distinct from acid-reducing drugs like H2-receptor antagonists or proton pump inhibitors and they do not kill the bacteria Helicobacter pylori, which causes most ulcers.[2] '

So H2 receptor antagonists, such as cimetidine, which are recommended by the PPHB and the wiki, aren't antacids technically. I think this is because antacids neutralise stomach acidity, whilst H2 receptor antagonists reduce production of acid. Interesting.

 

[k75]

Who writes/edit the suicide Wiki pages linked to this site?? on that it clearly states NO antacid is better for a peacfull process, but then on the exact same page is ALL the info about antacids-which makes no sense!

The Wiki is a million types of screwed up. You can't trust the info in it anymore. People without our best interest in mind started editing at at some point. Which, after saying it, sounds like paranoia but it's not. lol

The only issue with Stan's guide I found was he lumps all of the antacids together with H2 receptor antagonists and proton pump inhibitors, when antacids are distinct to H2 receptor antagonists and proton pump inhibitors from what I read (although they all have the effect of raising pH in the stomach it seems).

From wikipedia:

'Antacids are distinct from acid-reducing drugs like H2-receptor antagonists or proton pump inhibitors and they do not kill the bacteria Helicobacter pylori, which causes most ulcers.[2] '

So H2 receptor antagonists, such as cimetidine, which are recommended by the PPHB and the wiki, aren't antacids technically. I think this is because antacids neutralise stomach acidity, whilst H2 receptor antagonists reduce production of acid. Interesting.

I had some discussions and disagreements with Stan over his antacid portion in private messages, but he was very committed to what he believed. He did his own research and came to his own conclusions, but I very much do not agree that any old antacid will work the same.

 

[BPD_LE]

The only issue with Stan's guide I found was he lumps all of the antacids together with H2 receptor antagonists and proton pump inhibitors, when antacids are distinct to H2 receptor antagonists and proton pump inhibitors from what I read.

No he doesn't. He says clearly that PPI's are not effective OR anything else that changes the way the stomach produces acid. H2 Blockers reduce the amount of acid your stomach makes.
His opinion therefore was to use a simple OTC antacid which neutralises acid already present in the stomach. He covered them all and does not lump them all together.
In addition H2 Blockers reduce the amount of acid but do nothing to decrease overall pH levels.

 

[MeltingHeart]

The Wiki is a million types of screwed up. You can't trust the info in it anymore. People without our best interest in mind started editing at at some point. Which, after saying it, sounds like paranoia but it's not. lol



I had some discussions and disagreements with Stan over his antacid portion in private messages, but he was very committed to what he believed. He did his own research and came to his own conclusions, but I very much do not agree that any old antacid will work the same.

God it's too bloody complicated! Everyone says to use something different- making me think to not take any! What would you take then personally?

No he doesn't. He says clearly that PPI's are not effective OR anything else that changes the way the stomach produces acid. H2 Blockers reduce the amount of acid your stomach makes.
His opinion therefore was to use a simple OTC antacid which neutralises acid already present in the stomach. He covered them all and does not lump them all together.
In addition H2 Blockers reduce the amount of acid but do nothing to decrease overall pH levels.

He did say to me Zantac in PM months back- but then later said that is too much for this purpose. But it's ok- I know only I can decide in the end. Just so tricky when so many people say something different. Oh well. but thanks again for all ur input.

 

[jrums]

Since I'm using Domperidone I can't use an antacid. Should I use more than 25 grams of SN?

 

[edward77]

sn is my backup plan and if i do it then it will be without antacid or any other med. simply 30-40g of sn in 50ml of water.. will update here if i does it.

 

[BPD_LE]

@MeltingHeart in my opinion a H2 Blocker is fine, an antacid is fine, and nothing is fine. Like you said, it's down to personal choice ❤

Since I'm using Domperidone I can't use an antacid. Should I use more than 25 grams of SN?

No need to.

 

[chris8000]

No he doesn't. He says clearly that PPI's are not effective OR anything else that changes the way the stomach produces acid. H2 Blockers reduce the amount of acid your stomach makes.
His opinion therefore was to use a simple OTC antacid which neutralises acid already present in the stomach. He covered them all and does not lump them all together.
In addition H2 Blockers reduce the amount of acid but do nothing to decrease overall pH levels.

I see, so are you and Stan saying what is in the PPHB and on the wiki is incorrect? Or is it out of date, and the newer PPHB has changed from tagamet? I may not have the newest one. Would be good to know where it came from.

So no tagamet or zantac? And find any antacid instead?

 

[BPD_LE]

I see, so are you and Stan saying what is in the PPHB and on the wiki is incorrect? Or is it out of date, and the newer PPHB has changed from tagamet? I may not have the newest one. Would be good to know where it came from.

So no tagamet or zantac? And find any antacid instead?

Everything I know has come from reading research papers and I encourage everyone to do the same. I do not treat the PPH as Gospel for many reasons.
In my opinion, Tagemet or Zantac is fine, antacid is fine. Which is better? I will be taking an antacid.

 

[k75]

God it's too bloody complicated! Everyone says to use something different- making me think to not take any! What would you take then personally?

I plan on taking Tagamet. I've already got it on hand for that purpose.

 

[Shakespear's Brother]

so are you and Stan saying what is in the PPHB and on the wiki is incorrect?

Keep in mind PPeH is about trial and error. PN uses readers as guinea pigs, basically. How else to explain the initial suggestion of 15g of SN and now it is 20-25g and all of the updates with changes to so-called 'potentiators'. It's a shame that there isn't that disclosure.

As for the wiki, honestly, it's a mess, and there is an edit war going on. One editor has done verbatim copy and paste from the 8chan SN thread that is full of contradictory info.

 

[MeltingHeart]

Keep in mind PPeH is about trial and error. PN uses readers as guinea pigs, basically. How else to explain the initial suggestion of 15g of SN and now it is 20-25g and all of the updates with changes to so-called 'potentiators'. It's a shame that there isn't that disclosure.

As for the wiki, honestly, it's a mess, and there is an edit war going on. One editor has done verbatim copy and paste from the 8chan SN thread that is full of contradictory info.

i'll ignore the wiki then!

 

[chris8000]

Everything I know has come from reading research papers and I encourage everyone to do the same. I do not treat the PPH as Gospel for many reasons.
In my opinion, Tagemet or Zantac is fine, antacid is fine. Which is better? I will be taking an antacid.

Sharing your references is always welcome to me.

OK, I think this has cleared up the situation in my head a bit, so thanks for your input :)

 

[BPD_LE]

Sharing your references is always welcome to me.

OK, I think this has cleared up the situation in my head a bit, so thanks for your input :)

You're welcome. You can just Google to find research papers, but here's a couple involving aspects of the SN method which I've bookmarked.

Comparison of the effect of the antacid Rennie versus low-dose H2-receptor antagonists (ranitidine, famotidine) on intragastric acidity - PubMed

The onset of action in fasting volunteers was significantly faster with the antacid than with the two H2-antagonists. The duration of action was significantly longer with an H2-antagonist than with the antacid. This suggests that the two products should be used for different indications...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Antiemetic - an overview | ScienceDirect Topics

www.sciencedirect.com

 

[chris8000]

You're welcome. You can just Google to find research papers, but here's a couple involving aspects of the SN method which I've bookmarked.

Comparison of the effect of the antacid Rennie versus low-dose H2-receptor antagonists (ranitidine, famotidine) on intragastric acidity - PubMed

The onset of action in fasting volunteers was significantly faster with the antacid than with the two H2-antagonists. The duration of action was significantly longer with an H2-antagonist than with the antacid. This suggests that the two products should be used for different indications...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Antiemetic - an overview | ScienceDirect Topics

www.sciencedirect.com

I see, this is very interesting.

 

[jgm63]

sn is my backup plan and if i do it then it will be without antacid or any other med. simply 30-40g of sn in 50ml of water.. will update here if i does it.

Why not get an anti-emetic ? Generally, they are not that hard to get....

 

[edward77]

Why not get an anti-emetic ? Generally, they are not that hard to get....

antiemetic and antacids r easy to get. found in wiki that antacids may make the process less peaceful. also i am allergic to some medicines so better going it without any meds... if do not vomit will my attempt be success ? .. is antacid a must to have or can i overcome it by taking more sn ? .. also is there any chance to vomit after becoming unconscious?

 

[jgm63]

antiemetic and antacids r easy to get. found in wiki that antacids may make the process less peaceful. also i am allergic to some medicines so better going it without any meds... if do not vomit will my attempt be success ? .. is antacid a must to have or can i overcome it by taking more sn ? .. also is there any chance to vomit after becoming unconscious?

Each person's situation is unique.
Obviously I don't know all the exact details of your situation, so you have to decide for yourself what's best for you....

There is a possibility of vomiting while unconscious, but I don't know what the probability might be.

Some people have said that the wiki is not a very good source of information and has many issues/conflicts.
I would stick with Stan's guide :

Spoiler: sn-a-comprehensive-guide-including-method

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/sn-a-comprehensive-guide-including-method.25148

If you can use an anti-emetic, then it would be best to do so.
However, if you cannot, then I suppose you just need to come up with the best regime that is right for you....

Note : As always, please note that I strongly encourage you to seek help with whatever is troubling you. With the right help things can improve. There are many sources of help if you look and reach out. Please seek assistance in any and every way possible. You alone must decide upon your actions and take full responsibility for them, and you should always favour seeking help and keeping out of harm's way.

 

[edward77]

Each person's situation is unique.
Obviously I don't know all the exact details of your situation, so you have to decide for yourself what's best for you....

There is a possibility of vomiting while unconscious, but I don't know what the probability might be.

Some people have said that the wiki is not a very good source of information and has many issues/conflicts.
I would stick with Stan's guide :

Spoiler: sn-a-comprehensive-guide-including-method

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/sn-a-comprehensive-guide-including-method.25148

If you can use an anti-emetic, then it would be best to do so.
However, if you cannot, then I suppose you just need to come up with the best regime that is right for you....

i can take the risk because i will be alone for a week starting next tuesday.. so if i fails my first attempt then will do the second with anti emetic and antacid.will try drowning on xmas day and if fails then try sn the very next day if i am ok even after the failed drowning.. hoping to ctb with drowning and now searching for a perfect place for it. have made my mind that will never see the new year.

 

[jgm63]

i can take the risk because i will be alone for a week starting next tuesday.. so if i fails my first attempt then will do the second with anti emetic and antacid.will try drowning on xmas day and if fails then try sn the very next day if i am ok even after the failed drowning.. hoping to ctb with drowning and now searching for a perfect place for it. have made my mind that will never see the new year.

ok, well whatever you decide to do, just try to always plan things well....

note : ideally for the SN method, you would also include the antacid part...

eg Tagamet (Cimetidine) / Zantac (Ranitidine), or any basic antacid

b.t.w. Do you think you will make a goodbye thread ?

Note : As always, please note that I strongly encourage you to seek help with whatever is troubling you. With the right help things can improve. There are many sources of help if you look and reach out. Please seek assistance in any and every way possible. You alone must decide upon your actions and take full responsibility for them, and you should always favour seeking help and keeping out of harm's way.