Venting My therapist is holding my SN

[mittensxx]

Back at the end of 2020 I thought that I was feeling much better and felt pressure from my GP, nurse and psychiatrist to try and get rid of my SN.
The only person I trusted at the time was my therapist who told me that he would keep it safe for me in his office. And he reassured me that it's "mine" and I can come in and collect it any time. (Important to mention here that it's probably not legal to do that, but he suggested it himself so I took him up on the offer).

Last week rolled around and I wanted my SN back. What I didn't expect going in was him to tell me that he would have to report me once he gives it back to me.

I managed to walk away (without my SN) and not get in trouble, but now I'm heartbroken because he was the last person I trusted and felt comfortable talking to about anything and now I feel like I never want to see him again.

It's very difficult for me to cope right now because I feel like my only method was taken away from me (and when I mentioned "just finding another way" he wanted to report me for that as well).

In conclusion, don't be as stupid as I was (even if you think you have the greatest therapist).
((and sorry if this post wasn't good, I'm not a native speaker and this is my first post after 1.5 years on here))

 

[Tackingintothewind]

I know how you feel. The method I had probably wouldn't have worked anyway but my gp managed to talk me into destroying my benzos. The therapist wasn't doing this to betray your trust, he genuinely has a duty of care to report you.

 

[mittensxx]

I know how you feel. The method I had probably wouldn't have worked anyway but my gp managed to talk me into destroying my benzos. The therapist wasn't doing this to betray your trust, he genuinely has a duty of care to report you.

I'm sorry that sucks. Wish I would have thought it through before I gave it up (even if I wasn't going to use it).
I understand that it's his legal duty, but he's actually not pro-life and believes that people should be allowed to ctb on their own terms so it just suprised me that's all.

 

[BrokenArrow]

This is one of the issues with mental health professionals - they HAVE to report you if they genuinely think you might make an attempt on your own life.

It's also to protect their own reputations - if one of their patients kills themselves, then what kind of therapist are they?

It's why I've never told my therapist about my suicidal ideation and never will. It's not very healthy to lie, but if you say everything in your head you could very easily end up in a psyche ward. Every conversation is like walking a tightrope.

That really sucks though, OP :-(

 

[Tackingintothewind]

At the end of the day his job would have been on the line so I understand it. But it does suck for you. He should never have made the offer

 

[booray]

OP, you should never have admitted to having the SN in the first place.

 

[mittensxx]

This is one of the issues with mental health professionals - they HAVE to report you if they genuinely think you might make an attempt on your own life.

It's also to protect their own reputations - if one of their patients kills themselves, then what kind of therapist are they?

It's why I've never told my therapist about my suicidal ideation and never will. It's not very healthy to lie, but if you say everything in your head you could very easily end up in a psyche ward. Every conversation is like walking a tightrope.

That really sucks though, OP :-(

I do understand that, if it was me in his position I wouldn't want to feel responsible either.
And that's sad you can't talk about your suicidal ideation. I talked to mine very openly last year when I had a plan (hotel booked, SN ready, goodbye letters written) and he never reported me. But everyone's therapist is different, I hope yours is helpful

OP, you should never have admitted to having the SN in the first place.

I've told my GP, psych nurse and psychiatrist about it too. And none of them really made a big deal (just said that I should get rid of it, if I can). But I agree with you now, would have been better to stay quiet.
Maybe it's different rules in different countries? I'm in Ireland btw.

 

[EmbraceOfTheVoid]

Anyone that uses coercion is just plain scum to me. They can hide behind their license, their job, and their money but what they're doing is inhumane. This is why the therapeutic relationship is a complete joke if you're suicidal; the only kind of trust you can have is the superficial kind. Someone that will throw you under the bus because you're a inconvenience to them is not on your side. It sucks but that's the way it is.

 

[mittensxx]

Anyone that uses coercion is just plain scum to me. They can hide behind their license, their job, and their money but what they're doing is inhumane. This is why the therapeutic relationship is a complete joke if you're suicidal; the only kind of trust you can have is the superficial kind. Someone that will throw you under the bus because you're a inconvenience to them is not on your side. It sucks but that's the way it is.

THANK YOU!! Couldn't have said it better myself. Maybe 10/20 years down the line they will figure out a way to support people EVEN IF they want to end their life. And really support them not just throw them in a hospital and drug them up.

 

[EmbraceOfTheVoid]

THANK YOU!! Couldn't have said it better myself. Maybe 10/20 years down the line they will figure out a way to support people EVEN IF they want to end their life. And really support them not just throw them in a hospital and drug them up.

Thomas Szasz compared the current system to the Nazi regime and he's right. You don't help people by instilling fear into them and subjecting them to further cruelty. I have to wonder what kind of mental gymnastics these people perform so they can sleep at night while their clients are being traumatized in the psychiatric ward.

 

[mittensxx]

Thomas Szasz compared the current system to the Nazi regime and he's right. You don't help people by instilling fear into them and subjecting them to further cruelty. I have to wonder what kind of mental gymnastics these people perform so they can sleep at night while their clients are being traumatized in the psychiatric ward.

Exactly. And I think reading all the posts on this forum really proves that point. If their methods were actually helpful then less people would be attempting again and again.

 

[profoundexperience]

While I think many therapists in many places are legally required to report if patients intend to do harm (to themselves or others)...

There is a huge ethical leap from that to the "deal" your therapist made with you: If it were a knife, or cyanide... would he have made the same offer? He likely "got involved" in a way that therapists really shouldn't. I can understand taking an item for disposal... but promising to return it seems unprofessional and I wonder if the licensing board in your jurisdiction wouldn't frown on that.

My guess is that he already binned it... that there was never any conceivable way he would ever give it back... and he was always banking on the belief that you would never ask.

We all make mistakes... very sorry!

 

[mittensxx]

While I think many therapists in many places are legally required to report if patients intend to do harm (to themselves or others)...

There is a huge ethical leap from that to the "deal" your therapist made with you: If it were a knife, or cyanide... would he have made the same offer? He likely "got involved" in a way that therapists really shouldn't. I can understand taking an item for disposal... but promising to return it seems unprofessional and I wonder if the licensing board in your jurisdiction wouldn't frown on that.

My guess is that he already binned it... that there was never any conceivable way he would ever give it back... and he was always banking on the belief that you would never ask.

We all make mistakes... very sorry!

Yeah.. I understand where you're coming from. At the time it felt like a way to prolong my impulsive BPD behaviour (since the office is quite far from my house I wouldn't have immediate access if I wanted to use it).

Suprisingly, he actually kept it. The bottle was still sealed and everything. But I agree, it was just a stupid mistake unfortunately.

 

[BornofDust]

He most likely feels like he's both doing his professional duty as well as doing this for your own good so that you can maintain your life. So I'm sure he had good intentions. Unfortunately this is clealry at your expense, I'm very sorry about all of this and what your experiencing, a breaking of trust like that is hard to let go off. Either way as @EmbraceOfTheVoid mentions, thats quite a coercive way to go about things. A lack of proper transparency is the worst way to go about things, especially towards suicidal patient

 

[EmbraceOfTheVoid]

Exactly. And I think reading all the posts on this forum really proves that point. If their methods were actually helpful then less people would be attempting again and again.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand that treating people like they're subhuman isn't going to help them so I'm inclined to believe that therapists that do this simply don't give a shit. Being legally obligated to do something doesn't mean that it's ethical or humane or that you have to have to do it; it's a joke of an excuse.

"The judge punishes lawbreakers as a burning house injures its occupants. A person may be burned to death while robbing a home or saving a friend. Similarly, from a moral point of view, the judge's work is good or evil, depending on whether the laws he enforces are good or evil."
― Thomas Stephen Szasz, Law, Liberty and Psychiatry

"What, then, are psychotherapists and what do they sell to or impose on their clients? Insofar as they use force, psychotherapists are judges and jailers, inquisitors and torturers; insofar as they eschew it, they are secular priests and pseudomedical rhetoricians. Their services consist of coercions and constraints imposed on individuals on behalf of other persons or social groups, or they consist of contracts and conversations entered into by individuals on their own behalf."
― Thomas Szasz, The Myth of Psychotherapy

"The ethics of psychiatric therapy is the very negation of the ethics of political liberty. The former embraces absolute power, provided it is used to protect and promote the patient's mental health. The latter rejects absolute power, regardless of its aim or use."

"The medical profession's classic prescription for coping with such predicaments, Primum non nocere (First, do no harm), sounds better than it is. In fact, it fails to tell us precisely what we need to know: What is harm and what is help?
However, two things about the challenge of helping the helpless are clear. One is that, like beauty and ugliness, help and harm often lie in the eyes of the beholder--in our case, in the often divergently directed eyes of the benefactor and his beneficiary. The other is that harming people in the name of helping them is one of mankind's favorite pastimes."― Thomas Stephen Szasz

 

[mittensxx]

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand that treating people like they're subhuman isn't going to help them so I'm inclined to believe that therapists that do this simply don't give a shit. Being legally obligated to do something doesn't mean that it's ethical or humane or that you have to have to do it; it's a joke of an excuse.

That's a really interesting perspective, thank you so much. I want to go and read more from him now. Maybe one good thing has come from this experience for me after all!

 

[mittensxx]

DTA : don't trust anyone .Definitly never trust anyone other than yourself. sometimes you can't even trust yourself as there is a battle in my brain between my logical rational mind and my habit mind the subconscious mind that has been programmed by other people.

When I started therapy in 2019 I thought that sharing and being open would help me recover but in retrospect it only made things worse. I'll keep that in mind from now on

 

[MrAsclepius]

Therapists aren't your friends.

 

[Lupgevif]

I am sorry that happened to you. That's what therapists do. They manipulate you, they make you think they can be trusted and that they are the only trustyworthy person in you have in your life. But they aren't. They are just scam artists, all they do is take your money and try to keep you alive at all costs to build a reputation around that so they can take money from other vulnerable people.

 

[mittensxx]

Therapists aren't your friends.

I am sorry that happened to you. That's what therapists do. They manipulate you, they make you think they can be trusted and that they are the only trustyworthy person in you have in your life. But they aren't. They are just scam artists, all they do is take your money and try to keep you alive at all costs to build a reputation around that so they can take money from other vulnerable people.

I think my biggest problem is the fact that I haven't had any friends for a few years now so my brain probably started thinking of him as a friend and that's my own fault. Only way to improve is to not make the same mistake in the future.
At the end of the day, they want to make money to pay their bills but have chosen a shitty way to do it. Thanks for the replies!

 

[gus.nixon]

He's right. If you're in the US we are called "mandated reporters" and it's a legal document we have to sign that basically says we have to report anyone who is threatening to harm others or themselves. So yeah, he can give it back to you but you'd be in handcuffs and in an anbulance before the SN would take effect even if you downed it right after he gave it to you while you were still in his office.

 

[mittensxx]

He's right. If you're in the US we are called "mandated reporters" and it's a legal document we have to sign that basically says we have to report anyone who is threatening to harm others or themselves. So yeah, he can give it back to you but you'd be in handcuffs and in an anbulance before the SN would take effect even if you downed it right after he gave it to you while you were still in his office.

Thank you! Never knew the legal side/terms for this. (Probably should have looked it up hah)

 

[gus.nixon]

It's kind of also a legal/money thing here in America too. If your therapist just let you die or gave you the instrument of your death, at the very least your family would sue him for every dollar he has, and at the very worst your therapist would be sent to prison for aiding in someone's death.
But if you are in living here in America you can just buy more very easily.

 

[mittensxx]

It's kind of also a legal/money thing here in America too. If your therapist just let you die or gave you the instrument of your death, at the very least your family would sue him for every dollar he has, and at the very worst your therapist would be sent to prison for aiding in someone's death.
But if you are in living here in America you can just buy more very easily.

Unfortunately I'm in Ireland and SN is now illegal (wasn't when I first bought it). i don't have any family in Ireland so at least nobody could sue him haha.
But I understand why it was wrong now. Wasn't nice of me to put him in this position to begin with.

 

[gus.nixon]

But I understand why it was wrong now. Wasn't nice of me to put him in this position to begin with.

I'm sorry you're hurting, my friend. You're among friends here

 

[hopelessanddisabled]

Therapists are cops. There is no such thing as a good therapist

 

[loopylou]

This is one of the issues with mental health professionals - they HAVE to report you if they genuinely think you might make an attempt on your own life.

It's also to protect their own reputations - if one of their patients kills themselves, then what kind of therapist are they?

It's why I've never told my therapist about my suicidal ideation and never will. It's not very healthy to lie, but if you say everything in your head you could very easily end up in a psyche ward. Every conversation is like walking a tightrope.

That really sucks though, OP :-(

Here in the U.K. they would investigate the death for the coroners report. My doctor spoke to me last week and I told her that she has to put on my record if they continue to allow me to suffer another two weeks without sleep like they suggested there would be nothing left of me.

 

[rs929]

I am sorry that happened to you. That's what therapists do. They manipulate you, they make you think they can be trusted and that they are the only trustyworthy person in you have in your life. But they aren't. They are just scam artists, all they do is take your money and try to keep you alive at all costs to build a reputation around that so they can take money from other vulnerable people.

Oh come on..

A therapist is supposed to help you live, not die.

I don't understand these threads "my therapists is not helping me to die". Of course not. Are you expecting them to say "oh don't worry here's your SN, I'll bring you some water so you can drink it"

There are good therapists and bad therapists.

If therapy works well it's supposed to make you feel more comfortable about living. That's their goal

Dying sadly is a very lonely decision

 

[Wandering_Fox]

If and when you do suicide make sure you write a special note for the authorities and to him about how that made you feel. If not go get some help and move on with your life. The choice is yours.

 

[Lupgevif]

Oh come on..

A therapist is supposed to help you live, not die.

I don't understand these threads "my therapists is not helping me to die". Of course not. Are you expecting them to say "oh don't worry here's your SN, I'll bring you some water so you can drink it"

There are good therapists and bad therapists.

If therapy works well it's supposed to make you feel more comfortable about living. That's their goal

Dying sadly is a very lonely decision

So? Did I ever say a therapist is supposed to help you die?

No therapist ever has made me comfortable about living. All they did was trick me into thinking they helped, because once I was out of a session, all I could think about is how I just needed the next one, because I felt like I couldn't bear life without it. If a therapist makes you comfortable about living, there is no point in going back there. That's how they make money, by tricking you into going back there, every week, and charging 20% of your monthly wage.